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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:46:30 GMT -8
Clevinger is by no means "average". That's crazy talk.
He's won 65% of his starts, has not had an ERA above 3.18 in 5 years, and K's an average of 10 per 9. Ten per 9! Tell me you're trolling. He's also only 29 and under club control through 2022. The Padres don't need Arias (at all), and even if you absolutely love Cantillo, he has not yet pitched above A ball and the Padres rotation is going to be pretty set the next few years if Gore and Patino are who we think they are. Fair?
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Post by aztecryan on Aug 31, 2020 11:50:45 GMT -8
Clevinger is by no means "average". That's crazy talk. He's won 65% of his starts, has not had an ERA above 3.18 in 5 years, and K's an average of 10 per 9. Ten per 9! Tell me you're trolling. He's also only 29 and under club control through 2022. The Padres don't need Arias (at all), and even if you absolutely love Cantillo, he has not yet pitched above A ball and the Padres rotation is going to be pretty set the next few years if Gore and Patino are who we think they are. Fair? Watch out for Cole Wilcox in a couple years.
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Post by aardvark on Aug 31, 2020 11:56:15 GMT -8
As long as we can keep Clevinger from going to birthday parties for awhile, we should be in good shape.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 11:59:29 GMT -8
As long as we can keep Clevinger from going to birthday parties for awhile, we should be in good shape. Let's be honest, besides Lamet -- did the Padres have an experienced SP that we felt good about taking the mound in the playoffs? I mean hell, I am more bullish on Paddack than most of you, and even he has had moments of "meh" this season. Though, I still believe in his very bright future.
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Post by azson on Aug 31, 2020 12:10:14 GMT -8
Padre bullpen since August 17th : 59 innings, 3.36 ERA/3.13 FIP. 1.1 WAR. Third best in baseball over that span. And pitching staff with only 4ER over the weekend @col, that was impressive.
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Post by aztecryan on Aug 31, 2020 12:14:57 GMT -8
Padre bullpen since August 17th : 59 innings, 3.36 ERA/3.13 FIP. 1.1 WAR. Third best in baseball over that span. And pitching staff with only 4ER over the weekend @col, that was impressive. Still 1 more to go.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 12:26:03 GMT -8
The Athletic's Jim Bowden --grades. theathletic.com/2034371/2020/08/31/bowden-handing-out-grades-for-the-padres-indians-eight-player-blockbuster/San Diego Padres Overall grade: A The addition of Clevinger combined with Chris Paddack, Dinelson Lamet and Zach Davies gives San Diego a starting rotation good enough to go deep into the postseason. Padres get: RHP Mike Clevinger Clevinger is 42-22 in his five-year career with a 3.20 ERA, 3.58 FIP, 10.0 SO/9 rate and 3.5 BB/9 rate. Last year he was 13-4 with a 2.71 ERA in 21 starts and in 2018, he was 13-8 with a 3.02 ERA. This year he was 1-1 with a 3.18 ERA. Clevinger is pretty consistent with what he brings to every start and that will play well in the Padres clubhouse. Clevinger’s fastball is 94-96 mph with above-average life, his slider comes in at 82 mph and he throws it 25 percent of the time, his curveball drops at 78 mph and is used 14 percent of the time and his deceptive change-up comes in at 87 mph. He’s also used a cutter this year at 89-90 mph. He can start at Game 1, 2 or 3 in a playoff series and can match up with the best starters in the game. He’s a game-changer for the Padres and boosts their chances of holding on to second place in the NL West and doing serious damage come October. Cleveland Indians Overall grade: B The Indians get a strong package of quantity from the Padres, but without getting a Top-5 caliber prospect in the trade.The Indians are expected to make the postseason, whether it be in first or second place or even a wild-card berth. They have the starting pitching to actually run the table and win a championship, but the trade they made Monday lessens those chances. Dealing away Clevinger is a huge loss: Since 2017, he has the seventh-best ERA in the sport with a minimum of 50 starts behind the likes pitchers like Jacob deGrom, Max Scherzer, Clayton Kershaw and Justin Verlander. That’s the company he’s been in when healthy. However, the Indians, being a small-market team, always have to think about their long-term future, and this trade certainly increases their volume of prospects and overall talent. The disappointing part of the transaction is they didn’t get any of San Diego’s elite prospects in the deal. But the Indians are still good enough to get to the postseason after this trade and they can do damage when they get there thanks to their depth of starting pitching and the recent emergence of rookie right-handed pitcher Triston McKenzie, who has the potential to take up where Clevinger left off. Indians get: SS/3B Gabriel Arias Arias is the headliner in this trade for the Indians as they prepare for the eventual departure of Francisco Lindor, either through a trade over the next 11 months or in free agency in the fall of 2021. Arias is an above-average defender at shortstop with a strong arm from the hole. Last year, he slashed .302/.339/.470 in the California League with 21 doubles, 4 triples, 17 home runs and 75 runs batted in. He should be major-league ready in 2022 and the Indians’ long-term solution after Lindor. LHP Joey Cantillo Cantillo might be the sleeper in this trade for Cleveland. He has a strong pitcher’s frame at 6-foot-4, 224, and has loose arm action with above-average extension. His fastball is in the low to mid-90s and he has a knee-buckling 12-6 curveball and mixes all of his pitches well, including a slider and change. His delivery is deceptive, but he does have some developing to do.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2020 12:26:34 GMT -8
There was commentary on the other players, but because it's a paywall article I only posted the most relevant.
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Post by azson on Sept 1, 2020 8:17:19 GMT -8
And pitching staff with only 4ER over the weekend @col, that was impressive. Still 1 more to go. Fixed it And pitching staff with only 4ER over the weekend a 4-game series @col, that was impressive.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2020 8:21:19 GMT -8
Ryan,
Would you mind sharing your insight with me, on Owen Miller?
I thought he was just a throw in guy, but the more I read about him and dig into his stats -- the more intrigued I am. By no means a future star, but may be an asset on the roster.
-- "Shortstop Gabriel Arias, 20, is the most intriguing of the four position players they acquired, a gifted defender who improved offensively last season and might prove a potential long-term replacement for Francisco Lindor. Infielder Owen Miller, 23, is a talented hitter who might force his way onto the roster next season. Naylor isn’t the slugger the Indians needed in left field, but he is an upgrade over the Indians’ current options. Hedges’ profile is well-known; the Padres loved his defense, couldn’t stand his offense.
SS Owen Miller
Miller’s best role will be as a player who can be slotted in all over the diamond — he’s played all four infield positions in his career. Last year, he spent the entire year at Amarillo, the Padres’ Double-A affiliate in the Texas League, and he slashed .290/.355/.430 with 28 doubles, 13 home runs and 68 runs batted in. He struggled a bit in the Arizona Fall League, batting just .176 in 72 plate appearances for Peoria. Still, Miller profiles as a manager’s dream who can come off the bench and play whatever position you need while putting the ball in play at the plate, using the whole field and take what’s given to him by opposing pitchers. He’s a winning utility player."
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Post by aztecryan on Sept 1, 2020 8:59:58 GMT -8
Ryan, Would you mind sharing your insight with me, on Owen Miller? I thought he was just a throw in guy, but the more I read about him and dig into his stats -- the more intrigued I am. By no means a future star, but may be an asset on the roster. -- "Shortstop Gabriel Arias, 20, is the most intriguing of the four position players they acquired, a gifted defender who improved offensively last season and might prove a potential long-term replacement for Francisco Lindor. Infielder Owen Miller, 23, is a talented hitter who might force his way onto the roster next season. Naylor isn’t the slugger the Indians needed in left field, but he is an upgrade over the Indians’ current options. Hedges’ profile is well-known; the Padres loved his defense, couldn’t stand his offense. SS Owen Miller Miller’s best role will be as a player who can be slotted in all over the diamond — he’s played all four infield positions in his career. Last year, he spent the entire year at Amarillo, the Padres’ Double-A affiliate in the Texas League, and he slashed .290/.355/.430 with 28 doubles, 13 home runs and 68 runs batted in. He struggled a bit in the Arizona Fall League, batting just .176 in 72 plate appearances for Peoria. Still, Miller profiles as a manager’s dream who can come off the bench and play whatever position you need while putting the ball in play at the plate, using the whole field and take what’s given to him by opposing pitchers. He’s a winning utility player." More high floor than high ceiling. The bat's advanced, but he's not a guy who will wow you with any particular tool. I think the emergence of Cronenworth really has shifted the organizational dynamics when it comes to some of the middle infielders. Miller's a pure second baseman for me (on a daily basis), but he's another guy who is blocked everywhere here.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2020 5:51:01 GMT -8
This is the one potential concern about Clev. Not a major deal, but something to chew on -- particularly if Preller wants to offer him a significant extension this winter. -"Q: Don’t you think they traded Clevinger because of that night on the town in Chicago? A: The Indians were seriously thinking of dealing Clevinger after he turned down a contract extension offer in the spring of 2019. Then he had a significant back/shoulder problem last season, costing him 10 weeks. Q: He does have a violent delivery.A: He also showed up in spring training with a knee problem and needed minor surgery. There are questions about his durability. He was going to cost about $8 million next year. The Indians have lots of starters, young and cheap. He was expendable." www.cleveland.com/tribe/2020/09/are-indians-dealing-the-right-way-with-reality-of-baseball-in-cleveland-talking-to-myself.html
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Post by johneaztec on Sept 2, 2020 8:06:10 GMT -8
This is the one potential concern about Clev. Not a major deal, but something to chew on -- particularly if Preller wants to offer him a significant extension this winter. -"Q: Don’t you think they traded Clevinger because of that night on the town in Chicago? A: The Indians were seriously thinking of dealing Clevinger after he turned down a contract extension offer in the spring of 2019. Then he had a significant back/shoulder problem last season, costing him 10 weeks. Q: He does have a violent delivery.A: He also showed up in spring training with a knee problem and needed minor surgery. There are questions about his durability. He was going to cost about $8 million next year. The Indians have lots of starters, young and cheap. He was expendable." www.cleveland.com/tribe/2020/09/are-indians-dealing-the-right-way-with-reality-of-baseball-in-cleveland-talking-to-myself.htmlSounds like it's going to come down to what the major medical evaluation finds before they extend him.
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Post by aztecryan on Sept 2, 2020 8:20:43 GMT -8
This is the one potential concern about Clev. Not a major deal, but something to chew on -- particularly if Preller wants to offer him a significant extension this winter. -"Q: Don’t you think they traded Clevinger because of that night on the town in Chicago? A: The Indians were seriously thinking of dealing Clevinger after he turned down a contract extension offer in the spring of 2019. Then he had a significant back/shoulder problem last season, costing him 10 weeks. Q: He does have a violent delivery.A: He also showed up in spring training with a knee problem and needed minor surgery. There are questions about his durability. He was going to cost about $8 million next year. The Indians have lots of starters, young and cheap. He was expendable." www.cleveland.com/tribe/2020/09/are-indians-dealing-the-right-way-with-reality-of-baseball-in-cleveland-talking-to-myself.htmlSounds like it's going to come down to what the major medical evaluation finds before they extend him. There's no need to extend him. Under contract for 2 more years beyond this one at a bargain basement price in arbitration.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2020 8:31:12 GMT -8
Agreed. Nothing to fret about, for the time being.
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Post by aztecryan on Sept 2, 2020 9:07:44 GMT -8
Clevinger likely to debut tomorrow against the team that drafted him.
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Post by aztecmusician on Sept 3, 2020 22:33:12 GMT -8
Clevinger’s first start. 6 inn- 7 hits- 2ks- 2 ER- took the loss.
He looked decent, he battled well with runners on base. Not the dominant K machine power pitcher we saw last year, but he trusts his repaired knee and flashed mid 90’s with his fastball. He certainly pitched well enough to win, but his command was not quite his usual self. Upton and Rendon got some nice swings on him tonight. Maybe next start.
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Post by sdcoug on Sept 4, 2020 9:27:33 GMT -8
Clevinger’s first start. 6 inn- 7 hits- 2ks- 2 ER- took the loss. He looked decent, he battled well with runners on base. Not the dominant K machine power pitcher we saw last year, but he trusts his repaired knee and flashed mid 90’s with his fastball. He certainly pitched well enough to win, but his command was not quite his usual self. Upton and Rendon got some nice swings on him tonight. Maybe next start. Only his 5th start (3 Quality starts + 1 more at 5 2/3 w/ 0 runs), and hadn't pitched in 8 days. Definitely a little rust, but really liked what I saw. Despite not being able to pinpoint pitches, only 1 walk & 87 pitches over 6 innings isn't bad by any means. Relatively efficient. Interesting to watch as well with all his moving around. Next start is vs. Rockies in SD. I like our chances in that start.
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Post by survalli on Nov 16, 2020 15:06:13 GMT -8
Since 2018, Clevinger's ranks in some pretty important categories : 28.3% K% - 18th in MLB 2.92 ERA - 8th in MLB 3.23 FIP - 13th in MLB .219 BAA - 16th in MLB 1.13 WHIP - 17th in MLB Average pitchers don't post those numbers. yes 2018 was a great year. the body of his work raises yellow flags. if he was a stock he would be a risky stock. that Risky stock just tanked. nice move Padres.
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Post by aardvark on Nov 16, 2020 15:18:23 GMT -8
YES!! Signing another pitcher for 2 years, but only having him available for 1, due to his Tommy John Surgery scheduled for tomorrow.
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