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Post by MontezumasRevenge on Sept 11, 2024 15:15:08 GMT -8
But what exactly were they panicking over? That's the crux of the issue. And what you refer to as a panic move those schools would (and actually did, based on the previously posted article below) refer to as contingency planning. Now that it's more widely accepted that a B12 offer was actually there, it seems like a good time to ask: what was our contingency plan to ensure we got out of the MWC and into one of the power conferences? Did we actually have one beyond just waiting until the dust settled on the Pac12 contract, and then only at that point would we go back to the B12 if things didn't work out? As also pointed out in the article, it wasn't just Oregon/Washington that was doing contingency planning behind the scenes, but given how quickly the remaining four corner schools announced they were leaving for the B12, it was evident "they had obviously done some legwork" as well. Meanwhile, we're sitting by the phone like chumps waiting for a call that never comes. Our administration got played bad. www.seattletimes.com/sports/college/inside-the-frantic-final-days-of-the-pac-12/In the absolute best case scenario, SDSU had a half share offer from the Big XII and a near certain full share offer from the PAC 12 waiting in the wings. SDSU wasn’t in a position to have contingency plans the way Oregon and Washington were. They could make decisions with perfect information (ie wait and see what the PAC offer was and then compare to a potential deal with the Big Ten). It’s fair to eulogize this and conduct some investigation to determine what the actual decision was, but I don’t think it’s fair to assume Wicker was operating with perfect information like we are in hindsight. The PAC blowing up like it did was a somewhere between improbable and nearing zero probability. In retrospect it’s easy to say it was more vulnerable than the B12 but that’s like playing poker with the cards showing and knowledge of future events. The notion of the Pac blowing up being almost impossible to predict is a pretty subjective claim. There were lots of people outside of the Canzano/Wilner sphere that had a much less optimistic projection of the Pac's survival - of course, they were all instantly labeled as "B12 propagandists" when brought up in this forum. And if Mark Zeigler can put out a column detailing how and why the Pac-12 could fall apart months in advance of it actually happening and be more or less spot on with how things eventually played out, then it really discredits the narrative that no one could have possibly seen it coming. The funny thing is that he was constantly accused of being uninformed and out of the loop on realignment, but the article didn't even need to rely on any kind of insider info to be accurate - just a bit of knowledge about the industry, the B12 television contract (nothing which the SDSU administration shouldn't have also been aware of), and some simple logical reasoning. There's just no excuse in my mind for SDSU (along with whatever high priced consultants they hired) to have completely disregarded the Pac 12 falling apart as a potential scenario as early as Nov/Dec 22 and not planned a strategy around that worst case scenario once the Big 12 offer was received around the same time. Having said that, it's quite possible they actually did arrive at that assessment behind the scenes but De La Torre decided to go all in on the Pac 12 anyways just because she wanted so badly to be associated with the Cal/Stanford/U-Dubs of the world. She and Wicker would have no doubt soaked up all of the acclaim had they gotten us into a power conference, so it's not at all unreasonable imo for folks to direct criticism their way, especially based on the public statements they were making in the Spring/Summer of last year |
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Post by myownwords on Sept 11, 2024 17:04:37 GMT -8
In the absolute best case scenario, SDSU had a half share offer from the Big XII and a near certain full share offer from the PAC 12 waiting in the wings. SDSU wasn’t in a position to have contingency plans the way Oregon and Washington were. They could make decisions with perfect information (ie wait and see what the PAC offer was and then compare to a potential deal with the Big Ten). It’s fair to eulogize this and conduct some investigation to determine what the actual decision was, but I don’t think it’s fair to assume Wicker was operating with perfect information like we are in hindsight. The PAC blowing up like it did was a somewhere between improbable and nearing zero probability. In retrospect it’s easy to say it was more vulnerable than the B12 but that’s like playing poker with the cards showing and knowledge of future events. The notion of the Pac blowing up being almost impossible to predict is a pretty subjective claim. There were lots of people outside of the Canzano/Wilner sphere that had a much less optimistic projection of the Pac's survival - of course, they were all instantly labeled as "B12 propagandists" when brought up in this forum. And if Mark Zeigler can put out a column detailing how and why the Pac-12 could fall apart months in advance of it actually happening and be more or less spot on with how things eventually played out, then it really discredits the narrative that no one could have possibly seen it coming. The funny thing is that he was constantly accused of being uninformed and out of the loop on realignment, but the article didn't even need to rely on any kind of insider info to be accurate - just a bit of knowledge about the industry, the B12 television contract (nothing which the SDSU administration shouldn't have also been aware of), and some simple logical reasoning. There's just no excuse in my mind for SDSU (along with whatever high priced consultants they hired) to have completely disregarded the Pac 12 falling apart as a potential scenario as early as Nov/Dec 22 and not planned a strategy around that worst case scenario once the Big 12 offer was received around the same time. Having said that, it's quite possible they actually did arrive at that assessment behind the scenes but De La Torre decided to go all in on the Pac 12 anyways just because she wanted so badly to be associated with the Cal/Stanford/U-Dubs of the world. She and Wicker would have no doubt soaked up all of the acclaim had they gotten us into a power conference, so it's not at all unreasonable imo for folks to direct criticism their way, especially based on the public statements they were making in the Spring/Summer of last year I tend to agree with your take on this. What is frustrating to me is that the public has never seen any documents, letters. LOI's, or even a simple memorandum from either the Big12, or PAC expressing any intention of including us in their conference. All of the hand wringing conjecture has been spun into "facts". After all this time WHY has not a single such document been leaked? Did Wicker's remark about us joining the Big12 at "half price" come from written or verbal communication? Was there any negotiation? Or was Wicker told "take it or leave it"? At what point during the year-long Kick-ass Kliavkoff-led PAC farrago did the Big 12 make that supposed offer? We are certainly worse off now than if we'd taken that deal, aren't we? |
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Post by fisherville on Sept 11, 2024 19:51:43 GMT -8
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Post by Den60 on Sept 11, 2024 19:55:10 GMT -8
Interesting, but no mention of UNLV? Who would be the next two adds to make it the minimum of 8? Could that be from the AAC? |
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Post by montezumaduck on Sept 11, 2024 19:59:59 GMT -8
Gonna cost between $27-$29m for the MWC schools...must have figured UNLV wasn't worth that price tag. Personally, I think they should add them.
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Post by Cwag on Sept 11, 2024 20:05:14 GMT -8
Oregon State
Washington State
San Diego State
Boise State
Colorado State
Fresno State
UNLV
UTSA
Tulane
Memphis
This would be the best group in my opinion. If they are readyTo expand they have already had media conversations .
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Post by aztecm on Sept 11, 2024 20:05:28 GMT -8
Article says they’re expanding in phases. Best guess they hope for Stanford/Cal to come back. Then you start working down the list.
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Post by fisherville on Sept 11, 2024 20:07:06 GMT -8
Memphis would be pretty crazy travel, don’t think either side would want that
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Post by junior on Sept 11, 2024 20:09:20 GMT -8
sports.yahoo.com/sources-pac-12-rebuilding-conference-targeting-boise-state-san-diego-state-fresno-state-colorado-state-033254424.html P2 need 6 teams to reach the NCAA minimum of 8 teams, not four. So I wonder if P2 has information about a certain two former Pac12 schools that could soon be looking for a parachute landing. According to "the story" this deal would be just the first phase in a multi-phase league expansion. So perhaps UNLV is included in a later phase. Choosing Fresneck over UNLV seems a bit strange. Could also be that the cost of poaching 4 MWC teams is the limit of their financial risk management for now. Very interesting: The two-team conference of Washington State and Oregon State is targeting Boise State, San Diego State, Colorado State and Fresno State as new additions in a reimagined Pac-12. Those schools are expected to soon apply or have already applied for membership into the conference — the first step in the process to complete the deal. They would join the league starting with the 2026 school year.
The Pac-12’s board must approve any membership applications and are expected to soon do so. The deal could be finalized by the end of the week.
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Post by Cwag on Sept 11, 2024 20:11:45 GMT -8
Memphis would be pretty crazy travel, don’t think either side would want that It doesn’t matter anymore about travel people use jets to get from one place to another |
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Post by montezumaduck on Sept 11, 2024 20:12:05 GMT -8
Article says they’re expanding in phases. Best guess they hope for Stanford/Cal to come back. Then you start working down the list. That would be the best case scenario for a true "Pacific" conference. |
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Post by aztecfred on Sept 11, 2024 20:12:26 GMT -8
As they say in Missouri...... |
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Post by 94sdsu on Sept 11, 2024 20:13:44 GMT -8
Neither Memphis or Tulane make any sense geographically so they would be a “no” for me at this point. Besides, they’re probably making the same money as they would by joining this new PAC 12 but would increase their travel cost so it wouldn’t make financial sense for them
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Post by aztecfred on Sept 11, 2024 20:16:16 GMT -8
Memphis would be pretty crazy travel, don’t think either side would want that Only slightly farther than Tulane! Last phase for either, if at all? |
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Post by fisherville on Sept 11, 2024 20:16:16 GMT -8
Memphis would be pretty crazy travel, don’t think either side would want that It doesn’t matter anymore about travel people use jets to get from one place to another It does for money |
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Post by sdsuballer on Sept 11, 2024 20:42:16 GMT -8
Gonna cost between $27-$29m for the MWC schools...must have figured UNLV wasn't worth that price tag. Personally, I think they should add them. Not when they don't own a stadium for tv producers to schedule their tv needs plus they rent so their is no away to produce additional revenue. |
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Post by FULL_MONTY on Sept 11, 2024 20:43:15 GMT -8
Well that escalated quickly.
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Post by FULL_MONTY on Sept 11, 2024 20:44:17 GMT -8
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Post by sdsuballer on Sept 11, 2024 20:47:26 GMT -8
I personally would add UCONN (Football only) and the 3 ACC school in the west coast once their conference implodes. Add Gonzaga and St Marys for all sports except football and your back to 12.
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Post by sdsuballer on Sept 11, 2024 20:48:50 GMT -8
Neither Memphis or Tulane make any sense geographically so they would be a “no” for me at this point. Besides, they’re probably making the same money as they would by joining this new PAC 12 but would increase their travel cost so it wouldn’t make financial sense for them You do know Hawaii is father and currently have a high school football stadium with no long term plans! |
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