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Post by johneaztec on Nov 24, 2021 11:45:11 GMT -8
All three guilty. One word: Duh!!!
I guess that's my go to word when something's so dang obvious.
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Post by aztecryan on Nov 24, 2021 11:57:12 GMT -8
All three guilty. One word: Duh!!! I guess that's my go to word when something's so dang obvious. And yet this case in comparison is so vastly different in scope and circumstance. It's not justice, but it's at least some sense of closure for the family. The defense team for the McMichael's was so outrageously over the top, he might as well have just posted a sign that his clients are screwed. |
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Post by uwphoto on Nov 24, 2021 12:17:12 GMT -8
All three guilty. One word: Duh!!! I guess that's my go to word when something's so dang obvious. John..2 for 2? Even a blind squirrel find a nut sometimes! Haha, I was predicting both the same way. ..of course you know my problems with Rittenhouse that go beyond the actual final acts. |
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Post by johneaztec on Nov 24, 2021 12:20:32 GMT -8
All three guilty. One word: Duh!!! I guess that's my go to word when something's so dang obvious. And yet this case in comparison is so vastly different in scope and circumstance. It's not justice, but it's at least some sense of closure for the family. The defense team for the McMichael's was so outrageously over the top, he might as well have just posted a sign that his clients are screwed. I agree that it basically only gives the family some sort of closure is all, it was so obvious. As in this case, I think the prosecutor in the Rittenhouse case was somewhat over the top as well, and just threw things out there, hoping they would stick. |
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Post by johneaztec on Nov 24, 2021 12:21:30 GMT -8
All three guilty. One word: Duh!!! I guess that's my go to word when something's so dang obvious. John..2 for 2? Even a blind squirrel find a nut sometimes! Haha, I was predicting both the same way. ..of course you know my problems with Rittenhouse that go beyond the actual final acts. I hear ya. I haven't gone two for two since my college days!!! |
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Post by aztecryan on Nov 24, 2021 13:44:40 GMT -8
And yet this case in comparison is so vastly different in scope and circumstance. It's not justice, but it's at least some sense of closure for the family. The defense team for the McMichael's was so outrageously over the top, he might as well have just posted a sign that his clients are screwed. I agree that it basically only gives the family some sort of closure is all, it was so obvious. As in this case, I think the prosecutor in the Rittenhouse case was somewhat over the top as well, and just threw things out there, hoping they would stick. They overcharged him, but the main point I was getting at is you have two different sets of circumstances at play here. Ahmaud Arbery was jogging and was essentially assassinated. The police investigated and found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. There were no charges filed until video evidence was released and an outcry for justice was made. |
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Post by North County Aztec on Nov 24, 2021 14:11:44 GMT -8
I agree that it basically only gives the family some sort of closure is all, it was so obvious. As in this case, I think the prosecutor in the Rittenhouse case was somewhat over the top as well, and just threw things out there, hoping they would stick. They overcharged him, but the main point I was getting at is you have two different sets of circumstances at play here. Ahmaud Arbery was jogging and was essentially assassinated. The police investigated and found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. There were no charges filed until video evidence was released and an outcry for justice was made. and that took 2 plus months, a crime in itself. |
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Post by johneaztec on Nov 24, 2021 16:59:48 GMT -8
I agree that it basically only gives the family some sort of closure is all, it was so obvious. As in this case, I think the prosecutor in the Rittenhouse case was somewhat over the top as well, and just threw things out there, hoping they would stick. They overcharged him, but the main point I was getting at is you have two different sets of circumstances at play here. Ahmaud Arbery was jogging and was essentially assassinated. The police investigated and found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. There were no charges filed until video evidence was released and an outcry for justice was made. I guess the police could only go by eyewitness testimony, until the video evidence finally came out? Why would it take so long for the video evidence to come out? |
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Post by Fishn'Aztec on Nov 24, 2021 20:37:59 GMT -8
And yet this case in comparison is so vastly different in scope and circumstance. It's not justice, but it's at least some sense of closure for the family. The defense team for the McMichael's was so outrageously over the top, he might as well have just posted a sign that his clients are screwed. I agree that it basically only gives the family some sort of closure is all, it was so obvious. As in this case, I think the prosecutor in the Rittenhouse case was somewhat over the top as well, and just threw things out there, hoping they would stick. |
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Post by aztecryan on Nov 24, 2021 20:44:17 GMT -8
They overcharged him, but the main point I was getting at is you have two different sets of circumstances at play here. Ahmaud Arbery was jogging and was essentially assassinated. The police investigated and found no evidence of criminal wrongdoing. There were no charges filed until video evidence was released and an outcry for justice was made. I guess the police could only go by eyewitness testimony, until the video evidence finally came out? Why would it take so long for the video evidence to come out? Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. |
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Post by Fishn'Aztec on Nov 24, 2021 20:47:09 GMT -8
Because the putz that was found guilty on 6 of 9 charges against him must have shared it to the point it leaked out and became public. The whole affair was a CF without a secured crime scene and a prosecutor indicted for obstruction of justice.
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Post by johneaztec on Nov 24, 2021 21:47:55 GMT -8
I guess the police could only go by eyewitness testimony, until the video evidence finally came out? Why would it take so long for the video evidence to come out? Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. Oh yeah. That's right. Thanks |
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Post by Fishn'Aztec on Dec 1, 2021 18:58:11 GMT -8
Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. Oh yeah. That's right. Thanks How to cook your own goose 101! |
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Post by johneaztec on Dec 1, 2021 20:51:00 GMT -8
Oh yeah. That's right. Thanks How to cook your own goose 101! That's for sure. |
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Post by aztecryan on Jan 7, 2022 13:14:03 GMT -8
Both McMichael's sentenced to life without parole, while the third man charged gets life with the possibility of parole.
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Post by AztecWilliam on Feb 14, 2022 19:30:45 GMT -8
Both McMichael's sentenced to life without parole, while the third man charged gets life with the possibility of parole. There is something about this case that puzzles me. It's probably just that I did not follow the trial closely. As for the father and son, I can understand the sentences. But the third guy? I don't argue that he should have been found not-guilty. But what exactly was his crime? Taking a video of a crime in progress is obviously not grounds to sentence someone to life in prison. Did the prosecution make the case that Bryan conspired with the McMichaels one morning to kill a random African-American? I suppose that such a scenario might happen, but how would one prove that to a jury? I could more easily accept such an explanation it this were 1965 instead of the 2000s. I may be wrong, but would that not, if such a thing took place, be grounds for charging the three with conspiracy? Was there a charge of conspiracy brought by the prosecution? Or how about this? Was it the prosecution's contention that Bryan failed to do anything to stop the McMichaels, and therefore merits what amounts to a life sentence? According to a CNN post, "Their neighbor, William Bryan, who recorded video of Arbery’s last moments, was sentenced to life with parole for his role in the death." Well, what was his "his role"? Again, I point out that I did not follow the trial closely. I may well have missed that part. The McMichaels' part in the case is pretty clear. Absolutely nothing justifies what they did, and we have evidence of their actions thanks to the video shot by Brian. But that's the point that puzzles me. While Brian was recording a video of the event, he was not chasing Arbery nor was he pulling the trigger. So what was his crime? What did he do to deserve what likely will see him die in prison? We have all heard of "driving while black." I hope Brian was not prosecuted for "riding with White racists." If we want to call the McMichaels racists, okay. But was there evidence given that Brian had a history of derogatory statements or action aimed at African-Americans? Even if such evidence had been given, that alone would not justify a life sentence. I trust someone with a detailed knowledge of the trial can respond to my queries regarding this case. AzWm PS1: Given the nature of this case, I wonder what the prison authorities are going to do to protect the three convicts from the very possible attempts by African-American inmates to kill them. Will they be given the same treatment as that given to convicted police officers? I would imagine that wardens would rather not have inmates murdered by other inmates. PS2: I just reread the thread and found an interesting reply posted by Ryan. Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. Okay, the other two did kill Arbery. But that points to my puzzlement. If the McMichaels killed Arbery, what has Brian's role in the homicide? Not saying that there was none, but just what he did or did not do that was the basis for his indictment? |
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Post by aztecryan on Feb 14, 2022 19:42:21 GMT -8
Both McMichael's sentenced to life without parole, while the third man charged gets life with the possibility of parole. There is something about this case that puzzles me. It's probably just that I did not follow the trial closely. As for the father and son, I can understand the sentences. But the third guy? I don't argue that he should have been found not-guilty. But what exactly was his crime? Taking a video of a crime in progress is obviously not grounds to sentence someone to life in prison. Did the prosecution make the case that Bryan conspired with the McMichaels one morning to kill a random African-American? I suppose that such a scenario might happen, but how would one prove that to a jury? I could more easily accept such an explanation it this were 1965 instead of the 2000s. I may be wrong, but would that, if such a thing took place, be grounds for charging the three with conspiracy? Was there a charge of conspiracy brought by the prosecution? Or how about this? Was it the prosecution's contention that Bryan failed to do anything to stop the McMichaels, and therefore merits what amounts to a life sentence? According to a CNN post, "Their neighbor, William Bryan, who recorded video of Arbery’s last moments, was sentenced to life with parole for his role in the death." Well, what was his "his role"? Again, I point out that I did not follow the trial closely. I may well have missed that part. The McMichaels' part in the case is pretty clear. Absolutely nothing justifies what they did, and we have evidence of their actions thanks to the video shot by Brian. But that's the point that puzzles me. While Brian was recording a video of the event, he was not chasing Arbery nor was he pulling the trigger. So what was his crime? What did he do to deserve what likely will see him die in prison? We have all heard of "driving while black." I hope Brian was not prosecuted for "riding with White racists." If we want to call the McMichaels racists, okay. But was there evidence given that Brian had a history of derogatory statements or action aimed at African-Americans? Even if such evidence had been given, that alone would not justify a life sentence. I trust someone with a detailed knowledge of the trial can respond to my queries regarding this case. AzWm PS1: Given the nature of this case, I wonder what the prison authorities are going to do to protect the three convicts from the very possible attempts by African-American inmates to kill them. Will they be given the same treatment as that given to convicted police officers? I would imagine that wardens would rather not have inmates murdered by other inmates. PS2: I just reread the thread and found an interesting reply posted by Ryan. Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. Okay, the other two did kill Arbery. But that points to my puzzlement. If the McMichaels killed Arbery, what has Brian's role in the homicide? Not saying that there was none, but just what he did or did not do that was the basis for his indictment? Bryan was found guilty of six counts and received a sentence of life with the possibility of parole after 30 years. He was found guilty of felony murder and other charges. It wasn't like he just randomly showed up and started filming, he pursued Arbery just as the McMichael duo did. After Arbery was shot, he was falsely imprisoned by Bryan as he died. |
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Post by AztecWilliam on Feb 14, 2022 20:18:07 GMT -8
There is something about this case that puzzles me. It's probably just that I did not follow the trial closely. As for the father and son, I can understand the sentences. But the third guy? I don't argue that he should have been found not-guilty. But what exactly was his crime? Taking a video of a crime in progress is obviously not grounds to sentence someone to life in prison. Did the prosecution make the case that Bryan conspired with the McMichaels one morning to kill a random African-American? I suppose that such a scenario might happen, but how would one prove that to a jury? I could more easily accept such an explanation it this were 1965 instead of the 2000s. I may be wrong, but would that, if such a thing took place, be grounds for charging the three with conspiracy? Was there a charge of conspiracy brought by the prosecution? Or how about this? Was it the prosecution's contention that Bryan failed to do anything to stop the McMichaels, and therefore merits what amounts to a life sentence? According to a CNN post, "Their neighbor, William Bryan, who recorded video of Arbery’s last moments, was sentenced to life with parole for his role in the death." Well, what was his "his role"? Again, I point out that I did not follow the trial closely. I may well have missed that part. The McMichaels' part in the case is pretty clear. Absolutely nothing justifies what they did, and we have evidence of their actions thanks to the video shot by Brian. But that's the point that puzzles me. While Brian was recording a video of the event, he was not chasing Arbery nor was he pulling the trigger. So what was his crime? What did he do to deserve what likely will see him die in prison? We have all heard of "driving while black." I hope Brian was not prosecuted for "riding with White racists." If we want to call the McMichaels racists, okay. But was there evidence given that Brian had a history of derogatory statements or action aimed at African-Americans? Even if such evidence had been given, that alone would not justify a life sentence. I trust someone with a detailed knowledge of the trial can respond to my queries regarding this case. AzWm PS1: Given the nature of this case, I wonder what the prison authorities are going to do to protect the three convicts from the very possible attempts by African-American inmates to kill them. Will they be given the same treatment as that given to convicted police officers? I would imagine that wardens would rather not have inmates murdered by other inmates. PS2: I just reread the thread and found an interesting reply posted by Ryan. Because it was filmed by the guys who killed Arbery. Okay, the other two did kill Arbery. But that points to my puzzlement. If the McMichaels killed Arbery, what has Brian's role in the homicide? Not saying that there was none, but just what he did or did not do that was the basis for his indictment? Bryan was found guilty of six counts and received a sentence of life with the possibility of parole after 30 years. He was found guilty of felony murder and other charges. It wasn't like he just randomly showed up and started filming, he pursued Arbery just as the McMichael duo did. After Arbery was shot, he was falsely imprisoned by Bryan as he died. Not to be picky (but why not), but what was the evidence that he "falsely imprisoned" Arbery? Was that on the video? And what was the evidence that he "pursued Arbery"? Here's the point. If all you say is true, why was he not given the same sentence as was handed out to the elder McMichael, who, like Brian, did not pull the trigger? Something does not add up here. By the way, I wonder if you or I did some research, one of us might not find cases just as odious as this one in which the perpetrator(s) did not receive a sentence of life without possibility of parole. AzWm |
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Post by aztecryan on Feb 14, 2022 21:12:14 GMT -8
Bryan was found guilty of six counts and received a sentence of life with the possibility of parole after 30 years. He was found guilty of felony murder and other charges. It wasn't like he just randomly showed up and started filming, he pursued Arbery just as the McMichael duo did. After Arbery was shot, he was falsely imprisoned by Bryan as he died. Not to be picky (but why not), but what was the evidence that he "falsely imprisoned" Arbery? Was that on the video? And what was the evidence that he "pursued Arbery"? Here's the point. If all you say is true, why was he not given the same sentence as was handed out to the elder McMichael, who, like Brian, did not pull the trigger? Something does not add up here. By the way, I wonder if you or I did some research, one of us might not find cases just as odious as this one in which the perpetrator(s) did not receive a sentence of life without possibility of parole. AzWm I don't know understand what you're trying to prove? Do your own research, there's tons and tons of articles referencing the case and the federal hate crime case is currently ongoing. The information isn't hard to find at all. It was about as open and shut a case as you can find when it comes to racially-based murders/lynchings. Here's an article explaining the charges... www.fox5atlanta.com/news/malice-murder-vs-felony-murder-a-look-at-the-ahmaud-arbery-murder-trial-chargesI think your shortcomings here are related to not understanding Georgia law/specific charges that were brought against all three. You can be found guilty of murder without being the person who pulled the trigger. Georgia has no "degree" of murder charges, like we do here in California. Many states have a "The hand of one is the hand of all" laws in place, but the short answer is that the verdict is justified based on the evidence. The judge also has latitude to levy different sentences, obviously, unless there is a mandatory stipulation attached to a particular charge. Your last sentence I don't know how to interpret other than the justice system is slanted towards a lack of justice for certain types of people. I agree with that wholeheartedly, but I'm sure considering your views here you mean something else entirely. I'm sure you can find whatever you're looking for though? I do want to clarify that according to the prosecution, Bryan blocked Arbery from escaping, presumably with his vehicle, which would constitute the false imprisonment charge. That act resulted in Arbery's death, which also makes him culpable for Arbery's murder. |
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Post by AztecWilliam on Feb 16, 2022 17:27:55 GMT -8
Not to be picky (but why not), but what was the evidence that he "falsely imprisoned" Arbery? Was that on the video? And what was the evidence that he "pursued Arbery"? Here's the point. If all you say is true, why was he not given the same sentence as was handed out to the elder McMichael, who, like Brian, did not pull the trigger? Something does not add up here. By the way, I wonder if you or I did some research, one of us might not find cases just as odious as this one in which the perpetrator(s) did not receive a sentence of life without possibility of parole. AzWm I don't know understand what you're trying to prove? Do your own research, there's tons and tons of articles referencing the case and the federal hate crime case is currently ongoing. The information isn't hard to find at all. It was about as open and shut a case as you can find when it comes to racially-based murders/lynchings. Here's an article explaining the charges... www.fox5atlanta.com/news/malice-murder-vs-felony-murder-a-look-at-the-ahmaud-arbery-murder-trial-chargesI think your shortcomings here are related to not understanding Georgia law/specific charges that were brought against all three. You can be found guilty of murder without being the person who pulled the trigger. Georgia has no "degree" of murder charges, like we do here in California. Many states have a "The hand of one is the hand of all" laws in place, but the short answer is that the verdict is justified based on the evidence. The judge also has latitude to levy different sentences, obviously, unless there is a mandatory stipulation attached to a particular charge. Your last sentence I don't know how to interpret other than the justice system is slanted towards a lack of justice for certain types of people. I agree with that wholeheartedly, but I'm sure considering your views here you mean something else entirely. I'm sure you can find whatever you're looking for though? I do want to clarify that according to the prosecution, Bryan blocked Arbery from escaping, presumably with his vehicle, which would constitute the false imprisonment charge. That act resulted in Arbery's death, which also makes him culpable for Arbery's murder. Your response is much appreciated. You have given very informative answers to almost all of my questions. Actually, I did some research of my own, though obviously your knowledge of the case is far greater than my own. But one or two points continue to confuse me. You say, "Bryan blocked Arbery from escaping, presumably with his vehicle". You do not send a 52 year old man to prison for 30 years by presuming anything. But then, I did not study the case as deeply as you did. The one thing that remains unclear in my mind is why was Bryan (and I base this question in part on the points you raise in your response) was given a break? (Well, the possibility of parole for someone who will not be eligible until he is 82 is clearly not much of a break. His chances of surviving, if nothing else health-wise, for that long in prison are probably no better than one in ten.) In what way was he not as guilty as the father of the triggerman? The whole incident is a horror story in so many ways. (Keep in mind that the three guilty men presumably have families. My guess is that those relatives will not have an easier time than Arbery's in dealing with the results of the case.) Again, let me say that your response is much appreciated. AzWm |
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