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Post by beefeater on Aug 18, 2012 8:18:44 GMT -8
No, you are wrong. If I learned one thing from the brilliant minds at AztecMesa, it is that if you care about something other than football or basketball, then you automatically lack the sophistication to understand the difference between a revenue generating sport, a revenue losing sport, and a revenue neutral sport. It is through my education here that I learned that this is actually the cause of the Big West's financial problems. People here cannot possibly care about other sports, else they would believe those sports generate revenue and then SDSU would stop supporting basketball and football and they would be in financial trouble just like the Big West. No, you must all be pure of revenue-generating mind! There is no other explanation for SDSU's success! Thank you for enlightening me, Aztecs! oh great, the little baby is back. Go ahead and like your water polo and volleyball - just don't pretend like they really matter. Sure, Monty. I won't pretend. Not that I ever did. You can keep on pretending, though. Pretend that you have no interest at all in anything but football and basketball. Pretend that you wouldn't be proud if SDSU won a national championship in some other sport. Pretend for as long as it suits you.
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Post by 78aztec82 on Aug 18, 2012 8:20:43 GMT -8
Riiight anteater. No need to troll and bait. We have higher aspirations than most schools in the BW. I get it, and it takes money to field programs like that and compete at a higher level. Our Oly Sports are about to get back full coaching staffs and better facilities and support in a very economically and CalNOW constrained environment. Comments like yours make me happy that we are merely passing through the BW for those sports while the Oly Sports situation develops. Just making a point is all. And, no offense, but you don't need to pretend that a little sarcasm on my part is the reason you don't want to be in the BWC. It's got nothing to do with me. The SDSU superiority is all Aztec. Enjoy your "passing through." Maybe start growing a beard to mark the hours until you are free to leave this terrible burden behind. I actually think that a number of our Oly sports will greatly benefit being in the BW. Your lack of understanding of our major sports aspiration gives me pause to think whether we'll be truly welcome there. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 9:05:25 GMT -8
The difference between the WAC now and the Big West in 2000-2001? The latter quickly accepted that football was not coming back for a long time (if ever), and invites to Northridge and Davis were issued. Men's soccer was reinstated as a Big West sponsored sport to satisfy the multisport requirement. Again, ensuring survival as an Olympic conference first and foremost. All the members tried to make it work and as you can see, it did. Edit: Looks like Idaho has just signed off on killing the WAC. They are poised for football independence and to join the Big Sky in everything else. I agree with most of what you said, but the big difference between the WAC and BW in 2001, is that WAC four isn't stable at all. The BW in 2001 was a group of CA schools with little to no option to move to other conferences, no matter what the delusional LB fans think, nobody wanted them. BTW, the BW added Riverside, not Davis in 2001. The ONLY BW school that had any hope of a conference invite was UOP. They finally got their invitation 10-11 years later. The WAC has two schools, Idaho & NMSU, that would move to another football conference in a heart beat. Two other schools that would accept a WCC invitation in a heart beat. I wanted the WAC to stay around because of the AQ in hoops. We all know if the WAC is dead, that bid to March Madness isn't going to a mid major, but to the 12th place team in the Big 10 or ACC or SEC. I didn't realize Riverside has only been a member for a decade or so. Seems like longer. IIRC, Davis completed their transition and became a full member in '07. I wrote them down because they were division 2 at the time of their invite ('02?) and that it followed the Northridge add rather quickly.
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Post by titanczar on Aug 18, 2012 9:09:49 GMT -8
I agree with most of what you said, but the big difference between the WAC and BW in 2001, is that WAC four isn't stable at all. The BW in 2001 was a group of CA schools with little to no option to move to other conferences, no matter what the delusional LB fans think, nobody wanted them. BTW, the BW added Riverside, not Davis in 2001. The ONLY BW school that had any hope of a conference invite was UOP. They finally got their invitation 10-11 years later. The WAC has two schools, Idaho & NMSU, that would move to another football conference in a heart beat. Two other schools that would accept a WCC invitation in a heart beat. I wanted the WAC to stay around because of the AQ in hoops. We all know if the WAC is dead, that bid to March Madness isn't going to a mid major, but to the 12th place team in the Big 10 or ACC or SEC. I didn't realize Riverside has only been a member for a decade or so. Seems like longer. IIRC, Davis completed their transition and became a full member in '07. I wrote them down because they were division 2 at the time of their invite ('02?) and that it followed the Northridge add rather quickly. Both UCR & CSN came into the BW at the same time. UCR had just completed their move from D2, while CSN had been D1 for about a decade. Then a couple years later, Davis was added.
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 9:14:13 GMT -8
Just making a point is all. And, no offense, but you don't need to pretend that a little sarcasm on my part is the reason you don't want to be in the BWC. It's got nothing to do with me. The SDSU superiority is all Aztec. Enjoy your "passing through." Maybe start growing a beard to mark the hours until you are free to leave this terrible burden behind. I actually think that a number of our Oly sports will greatly benefit being in the BW. Your lack of understanding of our major sports aspiration gives me pause to think we'll be truly welcome there. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards All of SDSU's sports not named basketball will thrive in this conference. The point most of us non-Aztecs are trying to pass onto you is that you can't neglect your other sports. Boise is learning this lesson the hard way. Is that one of the Hatfields, beefeater? dude is ancient.
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Post by beefeater on Aug 18, 2012 9:36:02 GMT -8
Aside from Long Beach, the BWC is THRILLED to have SDSU, so how anybody got the idea you wouldn't be welcome is beyond me. Long Beach is just afraid to accede their perch at the top of the hill is all. I'm sure on some level they are glad to have SDSU, as well.
No, believe me, I totally understand your concern about basketball and your "aspirations." But, Boise State has aspirations, too, and I don't see them shitting all over us like you guys. No, face it, a lot of you are being a-holes, purposefully, in the misguided belief that somehow you are going to get SDSU out of the Big West by complaining. I think a fair summation of this attitude is "f x x x you, we don't want to be here, we are vastly superior to you in every way, and we will be leaving soon, so f x x x you, again."
That's got nothing to do with "getting you." That's just SDSU being dicks.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2012 10:33:21 GMT -8
No one here doesn't care about other sports. There are a number of us here that lettered in Oly Sports. When it comes to program survival in desperate financial times, it is Football primarily and basketball that drive the bus. No, you are wrong. If I learned one thing from the brilliant minds at AztecMesa, it is that if you care about something other than football or basketball, then you automatically lack the sophistication to understand the difference between a revenue generating sport, a revenue losing sport, and a revenue neutral sport. It is through my education here that I learned that this is actually the cause of the Big West's financial problems. People here cannot possibly care about other sports, else they would believe those sports generate revenue and then SDSU would stop supporting basketball and football and they would be in financial trouble just like the Big West. No, you must all be pure of revenue-generating mind! There is no other explanation for SDSU's success! Thank you for enlightening me, Aztecs! 78-82 never said Big Lots schools were swimming in red ink so you misconstrue the issue - as usual. Big Lots schools are the antithesis of members of the Power 5 conferences. The latter schools turn a significant profit to megabucks. Big Lots schools turn zero profit. (Well, maybe a buck fitty when it's all said and done.) With this move, SDSU will move from being closer to the average Big Lots school to closer to a bottom tier Power 5 school. They'll still be earning double what we do in TV revenue but will be paying significantly more in travel expenses for their non-income generating teams. BTW, lost in your thinking is that YOU guys will be earning from us joining your conference. IIRC, we're paying a $1M entry fee to join your conference. That doesn't amount to much for us but for those of you now in the BLC, it's going to be about equivalent to a year's worth of TV revenue. Presumably the same is true of Boise in that they will pay you the same in addition to subsidizing travel. So that's TWO years of TV revenue. And with the addition of us and Hawaii, the BLC figures to become a two-bid league most years, so you'll realize what for you is a nice chunk of change that way. It's a marriage of convenience for both parties, just accept that. We have.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2012 10:42:54 GMT -8
Boise State has aspirations, too, and I don't see them shitting all over us like you guys. No, face it, a lot of you are being a-holes, purposefully, in the misguided belief that somehow you are going to get SDSU out of the Big West by complaining. I think a fair summation of this attitude is "f x x x you, we don't want to be here, we are vastly superior to you in every way, and we will be leaving soon, so f x x x you, again." That's got nothing to do with "getting you." That's just SDSU being dicks. Just wait until Boise actually starts playing in the conference. I guarantee your conference message board will have more than its share of donkey dicks. As to us, the attitude we cop began with the BLC dissing Boise, which begat concern over Boise not joining the BE and BE therefore withdrawing its invitation to SDSU. As dumb as that may seem to you, the prospect of my alma mater losing $6M-$10M per year in TV revenue and getting stuck in a dying MWC really stressed me out for a couple months. At the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers, I'll admit that the BLC was on firm ground in trying to squeeze every possible dime out of Boise. The only thing I thought was ridiculous was the constant argument from the rest of you that Boise would add nothing to your conference. Fact is, Boise has what for the BLC is a top flight arena and although their basketball team has been garbage, it is improving significantly and, with an infusion of BE money, figures to become one of the best in the BLC. It's the latter factor that I think scares the crap out of some of you and is thereal reason for your opposition to their joining.
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Post by 78aztec82 on Aug 18, 2012 10:52:15 GMT -8
I actually think that a number of our Oly sports will greatly benefit being in the BW. Your lack of understanding of our major sports aspiration gives me pause to think we'll be truly welcome there. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards All of SDSU's sports not named basketball will thrive in this conference. The point most of us non-Aztecs are trying to pass onto you is that you can't neglect your other sports. Boise is learning this lesson the hard way. Is that one of the Hatfields, beefeater? dude is ancient. We don't neglect our other sports if you look at our recent successes. We had to lay off coaches and staff, plus forced furloughs in the staff recently due to budget cuts. This is all about shoring the department up and raising their prospects. We've come competitive nationally to national in mens soccer, golf, womens waterpolo, track,etc. We'll be even better with nBE money and keep department talent. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by 78aztec82 on Aug 18, 2012 10:57:22 GMT -8
Aside from Long Beach, the BWC is THRILLED to have SDSU, so how anybody got the idea you wouldn't be welcome is beyond me. Long Beach is just afraid to accede their perch at the top of the hill is all. I'm sure on some level they are glad to have SDSU, as well. No, believe me, I totally understand your concern about basketball and your "aspirations." But, Boise State has aspirations, too, and I don't see them shitting all over us like you guys. No, face it, a lot of you are being a-holes, purposefully, in the misguided belief that somehow you are going to get SDSU out of the Big West by complaining. I think a fair summation of this attitude is "f x x x you, we don't want to be here, we are vastly superior to you in every way, and we will be leaving soon, so f x x x you, again." That's got nothing to do with "getting you." That's just SDSU being dicks. I don't see that as a prevailing attitude by most but SGF summed it up best. Wait till Boise fans show up! Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 11:00:48 GMT -8
All of SDSU's sports not named basketball will thrive in this conference. The point most of us non-Aztecs are trying to pass onto you is that you can't neglect your other sports. Boise is learning this lesson the hard way. Is that one of the Hatfields, beefeater? dude is ancient. We don't neglect our other sports if you look at our recent successes. We had to lay off coaches and staff, plus forced furloughs in the staff recently due to budget cuts. This is all about shoring the department up and raising their prospects. We've come competitive nationally to national in mens soccer, golf, womens waterpolo, track,etc. We'll be even better with nBE money and keep department talent. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards My perception comes from reading some of the other posters. "yeah we have these sports, but we'd rather not. who cares about baseball, or anything other than basketball?" I could be 100% dead wrong about my perception of your non-basketball sports and if so, I will admit it.
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 11:06:14 GMT -8
"the antithesis of power 5 conferences."
Y'all are gonna turn your noses up on this conference no matter what it does. It could add NMSU. Take the dunks from Boise. Kick out Riverside and CSUN. Become an espn mainstay like in yesteryear. Send three teams to the Dance every year even. Won't make one iota of difference to you.
Because why? What the conference currently is about - being proud of excellence in olympic sports - goes against everything SDSU fans seemingly stand for.
In addition, the fact that the Big West is one of the major winners in conference realignment - a conference that doesn't even play football - just has to sicken everyone on the Mesa. Even SGF admitted it has done well with Boise and in realignment overall, "at the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers."
'It's a marriage of convenience for both parties, just accept that. We have.' I'll believe it when both parties officially tie the knot.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2012 11:12:30 GMT -8
"the antithesis of power 5 conferences." Y'all are gonna turn your noses up on this conference no matter what it does. It could add NMSU. Take the dunks from Boise. Kick out Riverside and CSUN. Become an espn mainstay like in yesteryear. Send three teams to the Dance every year even. Won't make one iota of difference to you. Because why? What the conference currently is about - being proud of excellence in olympic sports - goes against everything SDSU fans seemingly stand for. In addition, the fact that the Big West is one of the major winners in conference realignment - a conference that doesn't even play football - just has to sicken everyone on the Mesa. Even SGF admitted it has done well with Boise and in realignment overall, "at the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers." 'It's a marriage of convenience for both parties, just accept that. We have.' I'll believe it when both parties officially tie the knot. I won't bother to search all over the internet for data but check this article about SDSU's Olympic sports: www.themwc.com/blog/2010/07/mwc-institutions-finish-strong-in-final-2009-10-directors-cup-standings.html66th out of 278 a year ago. I'm curious just where BLC schools finished. Any of them anywhere in the top 100? Those of us on this board simply don't pay attention to those other sports because we actually have an FBS football team, plus what is now a national caliber men's basketball team. So just admit it, will ya. If your school also had two teams like that, you wouldn't exactly be paying much attention to how your soccer or volleyball team was doing either.
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Post by 78aztec82 on Aug 18, 2012 11:17:47 GMT -8
"the antithesis of power 5 conferences." Y'all are gonna turn your noses up on this conference no matter what it does. It could add NMSU. Take the dunks from Boise. Kick out Riverside and CSUN. Become an espn mainstay like in yesteryear. Send three teams to the Dance every year even. Won't make one iota of difference to you. Because why? What the conference currently is about - being proud of excellence in olympic sports - goes against everything SDSU fans seemingly stand for. In addition, the fact that the Big West is one of the major winners in conference realignment - a conference that doesn't even play football - just has to sicken everyone on the Mesa. Even SGF admitted it has done well with Boise and in realignment overall, "at the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers." 'It's a marriage of convenience for both parties, just accept that. We have.' I'll believe it when both parties officially tie the knot. I won't bother to search all over the internet for data but check this article about SDSU's Olympic sports: www.themwc.com/blog/2010/07/mwc-institutions-finish-strong-in-final-2009-10-directors-cup-standings.html66th out of 278 a year ago. I'm curious just where BLC schools finished. Any of them anywhere in the top 100? Those of us on this board simply don't pay attention to those other sports because we actually have an FBS football team, plus what is now a national caliber men's basketball team. So just admit it, will ya. If your school also had two teams like that, you wouldn't exactly be paying much attention to how your soccer or volleyball team was doing either. 66th but constrained by the lack of total number of sports, I suspect. I also wager that we'll continue an upward trajectory. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 11:20:05 GMT -8
"the antithesis of power 5 conferences." Y'all are gonna turn your noses up on this conference no matter what it does. It could add NMSU. Take the dunks from Boise. Kick out Riverside and CSUN. Become an espn mainstay like in yesteryear. Send three teams to the Dance every year even. Won't make one iota of difference to you. Because why? What the conference currently is about - being proud of excellence in olympic sports - goes against everything SDSU fans seemingly stand for. In addition, the fact that the Big West is one of the major winners in conference realignment - a conference that doesn't even play football - just has to sicken everyone on the Mesa. Even SGF admitted it has done well with Boise and in realignment overall, "at the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers." 'It's a marriage of convenience for both parties, just accept that. We have.' I'll believe it when both parties officially tie the knot. I won't bother to search all over the internet for data but check this article about SDSU's Olympic sports: www.themwc.com/blog/2010/07/mwc-institutions-finish-strong-in-final-2009-10-directors-cup-standings.html66th out of 278 a year ago. I'm curious just where BLC schools finished. Any of them anywhere in the top 100? yep. Three of them - UC Irvine 69th, Long Beach State 87th, UC Santa Barbara 98th. So at least we can all claim we finished ahead of UNLV
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2012 11:24:06 GMT -8
What the heck. Took me all of about two minutes to find it. SDSU finished 75th in 2011-2012: grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nacda/sports/directorscup/auto_pdf/2010-11/misc_non_event/finald12011.pdfSince the best any BLC school did was the Beefeaters at 78th, had SDSU been a member of the conference already, we would have won the conference Director's Cup championship. (UCSB was next best at #112.) The bottom line is this. Does the BLC just want to rent SDSU for several years or does it actually want to try to improve itself long term by luring not just Boise, because SDSU basically demanded it, but also Fresno and NMSU? If it's the latter, the BLC will be talking to NMSU right now about the possibility of agreeing to join if, in two years, Fresno is offered football-only membership to the BE. That kind of proactive thinking is what GROWING conferences do.
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 11:30:06 GMT -8
What the heck. Took me all of about two minutes to find it. SDSU finished 75th in 2011-2012: Since the best any BLC school did was the Beefeaters at 78th, had SDSU been a member of the conference already, we would have won the conference Director's Cup championship. (UCSB was next best at #112.) Wrong year, chief. The results you posted are from '10-'11. Final standings from this just completed school year. grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nacda/sports/directorscup/auto_pdf/2011-12/misc_non_event/finalD1.pdfWhile it's true you finished ahead of Irvine (65th to 69th), I dunno if SDSU wins the BW conference cup championship because now you remove football from the equation.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2012 11:50:32 GMT -8
What the heck. Took me all of about two minutes to find it. SDSU finished 75th in 2011-2012: Since the best any BLC school did was the Beefeaters at 78th, had SDSU been a member of the conference already, we would have won the conference Director's Cup championship. (UCSB was next best at #112.) Wrong year, chief. The results you posted are from '10-'11. Final standings from this just completed school year. grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nacda/sports/directorscup/auto_pdf/2011-12/misc_non_event/finalD1.pdfWhile it's true you finished ahead of Irvine (65th to 69th), I dunno if SDSU wins the BW conference cup championship because now you remove football from the equation. Whatever. To repeat, excluding men's basketball, Olympic sports are 5% of the reason I care about SDSU athletics.
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Post by jdgaucho on Aug 18, 2012 12:06:41 GMT -8
Whatever. To repeat, excluding men's basketball, Olympic sports are 5% of the reason I care about SDSU athletics. Good to keep them around, though
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Post by beefeater on Aug 18, 2012 21:54:25 GMT -8
Boise State has aspirations, too, and I don't see them shitting all over us like you guys. No, face it, a lot of you are being a-holes, purposefully, in the misguided belief that somehow you are going to get SDSU out of the Big West by complaining. I think a fair summation of this attitude is "f x x x you, we don't want to be here, we are vastly superior to you in every way, and we will be leaving soon, so f x x x you, again." That's got nothing to do with "getting you." That's just SDSU being dicks. Just wait until Boise actually starts playing in the conference. I guarantee your conference message board will have more than its share of donkey dicks. As to us, the attitude we cop began with the BLC dissing Boise, which begat concern over Boise not joining the BE and BE therefore withdrawing its invitation to SDSU. As dumb as that may seem to you, the prospect of my alma mater losing $6M-$10M per year in TV revenue and getting stuck in a dying MWC really stressed me out for a couple months. At the risk of engendering the wrath of some of my peers, I'll admit that the BLC was on firm ground in trying to squeeze every possible dime out of Boise. The only thing I thought was ridiculous was the constant argument from the rest of you that Boise would add nothing to your conference. Fact is, Boise has what for the BLC is a top flight arena and although their basketball team has been garbage, it is improving significantly and, with an infusion of BE money, figures to become one of the best in the BLC. It's the latter factor that I think scares the crap out of some of you and is thereal reason for your opposition to their joining. We'll see if your prediction about Boise State comes true or not. As for the BWC's attitude toward Boise, I would point out that the ultimate indicator is votes, and apparently Boise got at least eight of ten, and I'm pretty sure UH wasn't one of them. Just like SDSU was admitted on a 9 out of 10 basis, the prevailing attitude of the BWC toward you guys and BSU is positive. But, keep in mind who the NAY voter was: Long Beach, and it is Long Beach fans who have also been the most vocal opponents of Boise. And that's the truth.
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