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Post by FULL_MONTY on Jul 25, 2010 7:55:11 GMT -8
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Post by retiredaztec on Jul 25, 2010 8:22:04 GMT -8
I think his comments about a "level playing field" compared to other schools in the conference during his tenure is valid as has been discussed on the board. I truly wanted him to succeed at SDSU for a number of reasons, but it just wasn't meant to be.
I echo Full_Monty's sentiment.
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Post by monty on Jul 25, 2010 8:31:44 GMT -8
I think his comments about a "level playing field" compared to other schools in the conference during his tenure is valid as has been discussed on the board. I truly wanted him to succeed at SDSU for a number of reasons, but it just wasn't meant to be. I echo Full_Monty's sentiment. We spend a fortune on football, we have 1st class facilities, how is our field not level with the other programs in the MWC? We weren't spending a ton on assistants back then, but Craft also seemed adamant on not having an OC, so it stands to reason he could have had one and/or used that money on other assistants. I don't think TCU was even in the league under craft, or they were there his last year, Utah was starting their rise, BYU was in a transitionary period. Sour grapes from tommy boy; though, time has passed and what seemed like a trough when he was here has become the peak with the 4 years we've had and his teams were at least fun to watch. I also wish an aztec alum best of luck. |
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Post by aztec70 on Jul 25, 2010 8:36:27 GMT -8
Good luck, Coach.
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Post by retiredaztec on Jul 25, 2010 9:10:39 GMT -8
We spend a fortune on football, we have 1st class facilities, how is our field not level with the other programs in the MWC? We weren't spending a ton on assistants back then, but Craft also seemed adamant on not having an OC, so it stands to reason he could have had one and/or used that money on other assistants. I don't think TCU was even in the league under craft, or they were there his last year, Utah was starting their rise, BYU was in a transitionary period. Sour grapes from tommy boy; though, time has passed and what seemed like a trough when he was here has become the peak with the 4 years we've had and his teams were at least fun to watch. I also wish an aztec alum best of luck. . Having lived in SLC the past ten years and immersed in the two prominent programs of the MWC I look at the "level playing field" as not just facilities, and certainly the resources for a competent coaching staff could be an argument, (and arguably who better to be OC than Craft, but that's another can of worms). I look at the community support here in SLC for not only BYU and Utah, but even Utah State. Maybe TC wasn't referring to this, but I always felt part of the success at BYU and Utah was due to the level of community support each school has. Even when State had exciting elements to market, ("Dark Side" defense, Adam Hall offense), the SD community responded with a collective yawn. Ultimately and arguably, State's biggest challenge for many years has been, in my opinion, a lack of cachet for this program to build on. Not to start another discussion, it's again, just my opinion. |
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Post by Winaztecs on Jul 25, 2010 9:13:44 GMT -8
I think his comments about a "level playing field" compared to other schools in the conference during his tenure is valid as has been discussed on the board. I truly wanted him to succeed at SDSU for a number of reasons, but it just wasn't meant to be. I echo Full_Monty's sentiment. We spend a fortune on football, we have 1st class facilities, how is our field not level with the other programs in the MWC? We weren't spending a ton on assistants back then, but Craft also seemed adamant on not having an OC, so it stands to reason he could have had one and/or used that money on other assistants. I don't think TCU was even in the league under craft, or they were there his last year, Utah was starting their rise, BYU was in a transitionary period. Sour grapes from tommy boy; though, time has passed and what seemed like a trough when he was here has become the peak with the 4 years we've had and his teams were at least fun to watch. I also wish an aztec alum best of luck. There's more to it than just $ and facilities. SDSU wasn't and still isn't on a level playing field., especially when it comes to support from the other side of campus. It's getting better, but until some restrictions are lifted, We will still miss out on some great players in all sports. |
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Post by Winaztecs on Jul 25, 2010 9:16:24 GMT -8
We spend a fortune on football, we have 1st class facilities, how is our field not level with the other programs in the MWC? We weren't spending a ton on assistants back then, but Craft also seemed adamant on not having an OC, so it stands to reason he could have had one and/or used that money on other assistants. I don't think TCU was even in the league under craft, or they were there his last year, Utah was starting their rise, BYU was in a transitionary period. Sour grapes from tommy boy; though, time has passed and what seemed like a trough when he was here has become the peak with the 4 years we've had and his teams were at least fun to watch. I also wish an aztec alum best of luck. . Having lived in SLC the past ten years and immersed in the two prominent programs of the MWC I look at the "level playing field" as not just facilities, and certainly the resources for a competent coaching staff could be an argument, (and arguably who better to be OC than Craft, but that's another can of worms). I look at the community support here in SLC for not only BYU and Utah, but even Utah State. Maybe TC wasn't referring to this, but I always felt part of the success at BYU and Utah was due to the level of community support each school has. Even when State had exciting elements to market, ("Dark Side" defense, Adam Hall offense), the SD community responded with a collective yawn. Ultimately and arguably, State's biggest challenge for many years has been, in my opinion, a lack of cachet for this program to build on. Not to start another discussion, it's again, just my opinion. It's lack of supprt fron the other side of campus he was referring to. I know there were a few "game breaking" players TC signed, but SDSU wouldn't allow admission when every other school in the MWC would have put out the red carpet for them. |
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Post by monty on Jul 25, 2010 10:11:12 GMT -8
I have heard about the admissions numerous times, can some quantify it both it what the requirements are, how they are tougher than our peers and how many players fall into this category. As far as i'm aware, most if not all MWC teams do not accept partial qualifiers.
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Post by aztecwin on Jul 25, 2010 10:43:20 GMT -8
I wish Craft the very best at Riverside. He had my full support while he was at SDSU. I did not find out about some negative things till he was gone and don't want to talk about it now. I think with the budget for assistants and other support he would have turned it around. Glad we have Hoke now and know that Long would never have got it done.
I will be following Riverside.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2010 10:57:08 GMT -8
I have heard about the admissions numerous times, can some quantify it both it what the requirements are, how they are tougher than our peers and how many players fall into this category. As far as i'm aware, most if not all MWC teams do not accept partial qualifiers. I've mellowed some regarding Craft's recruiting. I still think he was a terrible hire because his background violated the cardinal rule of Rivals Radio's Bill King that the principle qualification for a DIA head coach is experience as a head coach or coordinator at that level since only in that way can you learn to deal with APR and scholarship constraints and Craft had just two years of such experience. However, that was Rick Bay's fault, not Craft's. It was also pointed out to me by another poster that although many of the highly-rated Craft recruits never qualified for admission, most were offered a scholarship by a BCS school or two. On the latter point, to answer your question, I don't know the specifics, but I recall hearing John Kentera detail them after Tom was fired. In a nutshell, Kentera said that SDSU's administration had imposed certain admission requirements which were beyond those of either the NCAA or the MWC and that with the exception of AFA, they were stricter than anybody else in the conference. Considering how much money is at stake for the university with regard to fielding good versus bad teams, that's just dumb IMO. Although I think the NCAA and the conference have tightened things up so that SDSU now has more of an even playing field in recruiting, the Ronnie Hillman thing certainly gives me concern that the school is still shooting itself in the foot a bit. |
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Post by k5james on Jul 25, 2010 11:08:12 GMT -8
Although I think the NCAA and the conference have tightened things up so that SDSU now has more of an even playing field in recruiting, the Ronnie Hillman thing certainly gives me concern that the school is still shooting itself in the foot a bit. I think it may have been a blessing in disguise sgf. I think the Hillman situation allowed Hoke to get more pull in the admissions department. I think the Hillman situation is exactly why Ruffin was able to get in and why we offered the kid from AZ with questionable academics. |
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Post by aztech on Jul 25, 2010 11:16:33 GMT -8
I think it may have been a blessing in disguise sgf. I think the Hillman situation allowed Hoke to get more pull in the admissions department. I think the Hillman situation is exactly why Ruffin was able to get in and why we offered the kid from AZ with questionable academics. I've been thinking the same thing. We're on life support. The program needs all the administrative support it can get, even if that means they have to compromise. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2010 11:54:38 GMT -8
I think it may have been a blessing in disguise sgf. I think the Hillman situation allowed Hoke to get more pull in the admissions department. I think the Hillman situation is exactly why Ruffin was able to get in and why we offered the kid from AZ with questionable academics. I've been thinking the same thing. We're on life support. The program needs all the administrative support it can get, even if that means they have to compromise. I sure hope you guys are right. Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, ad nauseum. (Inside joke for James.) |
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Post by k5james on Jul 25, 2010 11:56:30 GMT -8
I've been thinking the same thing. We're on life support. The program needs all the administrative support it can get, even if that means they have to compromise. I sure hope you guys are right. Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, ad nauseum. (Inside joke for James.) ;D Man I hope we crush those guys and they go on a CSU style run like last year. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2010 12:11:12 GMT -8
I sure hope you guys are right. Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, Wyoming, ad nauseum. (Inside joke for James.) ;D Man I hope we crush those guys and they go on a CSU style run like last year. Totally agree. Nowhere Poke and the guy from Billings are both fine but the rest of their fans are so obnoxious it's really tough to ignore them and if we should manage to win at Laramie this year, I know I will no longer be able to. |
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Post by joshjones1 on Jul 25, 2010 12:16:07 GMT -8
Tom Craft is a jackal, and if you know any of his former players.....except maybe for his QB's, ask them what they think of Tom. I've spoken to a few of his ex players who aren't too find of him, and for you who know me well, I ain't referring to my cousin, who never had much to say about him at all.
As for an even playing field...I suppose if you refuse to hire an OC at all, don headsets to coordinate with an assistant up top and have all possible information, and then run off a strength coach with an impeccable reputation and bond with his players, just to hire a track coach........while ignoring both lines and recruiting skills players with little academic potential.......you're going to have trouble.
Other than the year we beat BYU and Utah....little good came from the Craft era.
Considering there's little chance he'd refer any of his players to SDSU, I don't wish him luck at all.
Chuck Long, from all reports, was a good man. Just an awful coach. I wish him well.
Not Tommy boy. Nice shades. ;D
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Post by monty on Jul 25, 2010 12:19:20 GMT -8
I have heard about the admissions numerous times, can some quantify it both it what the requirements are, how they are tougher than our peers and how many players fall into this category. As far as i'm aware, most if not all MWC teams do not accept partial qualifiers. I've mellowed some regarding Craft's recruiting. I still think he was a terrible hire because his background violated the cardinal rule of Rivals Radio's Bill King that the principle qualification for a DIA head coach is experience as a head coach or coordinator at that level since only in that way can you learn to deal with APR and scholarship constraints and Craft had just two years of such experience. However, that was Rick Bay's fault, not Craft's. It was also pointed out to me by another poster that although many of the highly-rated Craft recruits never qualified for admission, most were offered a scholarship by a BCS school or two. On the latter point, to answer your question, I don't know the specifics, but I recall hearing John Kentera detail them after Tom was fired. In a nutshell, Kentera said that SDSU's administration had imposed certain admission requirements which were beyond those of either the NCAA or the MWC and that with the exception of AFA, they were stricter than anybody else in the conference. Considering how much money is at stake for the university with regard to fielding good versus bad teams, that's just dumb IMO. Although I think the NCAA and the conference have tightened things up so that SDSU now has more of an even playing field in recruiting, the Ronnie Hillman thing certainly gives me concern that the school is still shooting itself in the foot a bit. This is what I've heard too in the past, but never a finger put on it and specifics given. I believe all students including athletes must meet the minimum math and language requirements (which are waived via a middle SAT score, something like 550 on each math and vebal and/or passing a test and/or taking math and english below the 100 level, something like math 90 or something). But that is an on-campus thing, and I would imagine most schools have something similar. It might be clear what i'm driving at, but I'm going to be specific: this sounds like flat out bitching and excuse-making - if we have kids that can't meet the bear minimum then they are very likely not going to stay in school and crush our APR or they are going to hold on for a while and not graduate. An inability to meet even the bottom requirements makes me wonder about their intelligence and/or their motor; I played ball with a kid that had a full ride to UCLA on the table and he couldn't pass the SAT, and although he was incredibly gifted athletically, he made some horrific mistakes that cost us on the field including a chance to play in the division finals, great athlete, dim bulb Craft comes in, APR comes in either his 1st or 2nd year, and it takes half a decade to crawl out from under that. There are plenty of D1a caliber athletes that can meet the minimum requirements. |
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Post by SD Johnny on Jul 25, 2010 13:02:53 GMT -8
Reading that article was like a flashback to reading his quotes after losses. Just more excuses and placing the blame as far from himself as possible.
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Post by tuff on Jul 25, 2010 13:33:03 GMT -8
We spend a fortune on football, we have 1st class facilities, how is our field not level with the other programs in the MWC? We weren't spending a ton on assistants back then, but Craft also seemed adamant on not having an OC, so it stands to reason he could have had one and/or used that money on other assistants. I don't think TCU was even in the league under craft, or they were there his last year, Utah was starting their rise, BYU was in a transitionary period. Sour grapes from tommy boy; though, time has passed and what seemed like a trough when he was here has become the peak with the 4 years we've had and his teams were at least fun to watch. I also wish an aztec alum best of luck. . Having lived in SLC the past ten years and immersed in the two prominent programs of the MWC I look at the "level playing field" as not just facilities, and certainly the resources for a competent coaching staff could be an argument, (and arguably who better to be OC than Craft, but that's another can of worms). I look at the community support here in SLC for not only BYU and Utah, but even Utah State. Maybe TC wasn't referring to this, but I always felt part of the success at BYU and Utah was due to the level of community support each school has. Even when State had exciting elements to market, ("Dark Side" defense, Adam Hall offense), the SD community responded with a collective yawn. Ultimately and arguably, State's biggest challenge for many years has been, in my opinion, a lack of cachet for this program to build on. Not to start another discussion, it's again, just my opinion. San Diego is NOT a sports town today. They haven't supported the Aztecs as a community since the Coryell years(and into Gilbert's). There was a small town mentality back then. There were billboards all over, cardboard schedules in retail establishments. Ads on bus benches. etc., etc. There was a PRIDE about Aztec football in general. You old timers can remember this. You have a mayor who never wears gear Or promotes the Aztecs ,and he's an alum. Not to mention a lot of other prominent alums who don't give a $#!+. I guess it's the culture, and I have no answer on how o correct it. But if the Aztecs are to succeed, they have to get local support just like the schools in Utah, Oklahoma, Oregon, et al. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2010 16:16:34 GMT -8
San Diego is NOT a sports town today. They haven't supported the Aztecs as a community since the Coryell years(and into Gilbert's). There was a small town mentality back then. There were billboards all over, cardboard schedules in retail establishments. Ads on bus benches. etc., etc. There was a PRIDE about Aztec football in general. You old timers can remember this. Yes, I DO remember that. As amazing as I'm sure it sounds to anybody under 35, it actually was like that. Oh for the days when SDSU actually had a well managed athletic department and a winning football team. |
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