|
Post by AztecWilliam on Apr 17, 2014 14:48:15 GMT -8
at this point, we should seriously consider going indy after this year. My usual default response to this suggestion is to say, "No damned way, man!" For a variety of reasons. However. . . . Maybe it's time to at least give this idea some consideration. Here's the thing. By now most of us realize that staying in the Mountain West Conference is not terribly preferable to being in the Big Sky Conference. The money we get from MWC membership is just a hairbreadth above miniscule. Furthermore, we have to deal with the fact that the conference sold its soul to Boise State to get the Broncos to come back. Now that BSU has proved to be mortal in football, what's the big deal? Why should they continue to get preferential treatment at the expense of the rest of the conference members? It is time, past time, to admit that we are almost certain never to get invited to join a power conference. The Pac-12 is such a longshot that even dreaming of joining that league is a foolish and counterproductive waste of time. The Big-12? Almost as long a shot, in my opinion, as is joining the Pac-12. What other chance do we have? The American Athletic Conference? Well, we did have a chance there, didn't we, but panicked and came crawling back to the MWC. Could there someday be a western division of the AAC, one that might include SDSU and perhaps UNLV or one other western school? Yes, that is a possibility; at least the idea Is not laughable on the face of it. The problem is, the AAC has no such plans currently and probably will not in the foreseeable future. That league is busy solidifying its position after the breakup of the Big East. They have enough on their plate right now. So where does that leave us? The usual uninspired thinking on the Mesa holds that membership in some DI conference is at least something. Well, it is something all right, but that something probably means stagnation and eternal damnation to the ghetto of DI football that will be the fate of all those schools not members or future members of the five power conferences that are moving toward isolating themselves from the have-nots. In other words, staying where we are is like being stranded on a desert island with a bunch of other hungry guys and only two or three coconut palms available as a food supply. What can we do other than hang around? Going independent in football is the only answer, with our other sports competing in the Big West. Is risky. Damned risky. But so is staying in the MWC. And I, for one, am tired of having to send our men and women to play at schools that have a permanent advantage when playing at their places. Becoming independent in football would not be easy, but it would not be impossible. We would, and this galls me, probably have to play BYU every year. And we would also have to schedule at least one FCS school every year, as well. I can see games against Navy and Army most years, as well, but that would not be undesirable. We seem to be able to schedule name schools now, and being independent would not make that any the less possible. Beating them is and will always be the question. We would have a lot of flexibility by being independent. I would think that seven home games a year would be easy, and maybe eight. As for bowl affiliations, if an Aztec team finishes with 9 or 10 wins, it is unlikely to stay home in December. But therein lies the risk. Aztec football is going to have to win, and win big. By that I mean at least 9 wins a year, with some wins against good teams. Seven or eight wins might not be enough to play in a bowl. And we are going to have to wake up the fan base. Crowds of 35,000 to 40,000 need to be the rule rather than the exception. BYU has no trouble going to bowls based largely on their impressive average attendance figures. We probably aren't going to average 60K a game, but consistently winning should help get our own attendance up to a level that would impress bowl committees. So, is football independence a big risk? Yes, it is. But staying where we are is a big risk, too. It's time to do something dramatic, to show some vision. One courageous act would be to build an on-campus stadium. Another would be to tell the MWC that we are no longer going to play second fiddle to BSU. We should declare, and believe, that we are too good for that. Let Wyoming and Colorado State and the others lick boots, but not us. AzWm
|
|
|
Post by laaztec on Apr 17, 2014 15:23:35 GMT -8
Hoke would have left sooner or later, so the issue goes far deeper. And we aren't limping forward...we're limping backward. Point taken. But I can tell you that I met Hoke once and I've met Rocky once. These men are like night and day. Hoke exudes energy, charisma and leadership. Rocky, well, I like the man. He's a good person. Hoke will be available after next season.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2014 15:25:21 GMT -8
Some people like Rocky more because he isn't fat.
|
|
|
Post by aztec70 on Apr 17, 2014 16:09:51 GMT -8
Teams with 25K in the stands of a 70K stadium do not get invites to better conferences. If you want the team to go up, we all need to show up. Yes they do. We were already invited to join the AAC. Besides attendance is down all across the country in every sport in every league. Do you think they would ask again?
|
|
|
Post by buck on Apr 17, 2014 16:13:01 GMT -8
Remember 10 years ago when we got like 4 games televised the whole season? Those were the days.
|
|
|
Post by uncledougy on Apr 17, 2014 16:22:37 GMT -8
Let's hope it's about fourteen AAC's and two MWC's. I think the AAC could survive for a while mainly because the P5's need softer OOC games. I think the MWC teams will be SDSU, Fresno, Boise and UNLV if they can get their crap together. That would be a decent league but it's still second rate football. Even though I am a football fan first, the writing is on the wall, SDSU is a basketball school now. Which is fine with me. It's a great thing having at least one major sport compete at a national level. Football will never get to the national level because they are handicapped by not having the budget of the P5 schools. Unless a miracle happen and SDSU ends up in a P5 conference SDSU football will never reach the heights that Basketball has reached. Not that long ago people were saying the same thing you are saying about the basketball program. It takes the right coach to elevate the program. If Fisher can do what he did with hoops, someone should be able to do something similar with football. It's not a matter of will it happen, but when will it happen. We just need the right coach to become available. Who it might be is the $64,000 question.
|
|
|
Post by retiredaztec on Apr 17, 2014 16:34:57 GMT -8
at this point, we should seriously consider going indy after this year. That would make sense if Aztec football had any legitimate marketability. I'd venture to say if the games were televised strictly in San Diego County, they would probably be out watched by reruns of The Big Bang Theory. Let's not even discuss any interest on a national level.
|
|
|
Post by aztech on Apr 17, 2014 16:54:09 GMT -8
I think the MWC teams will be SDSU, Fresno, Boise and UNLV if they can get their crap together. That would be a decent league but it's still second rate football. Even though I am a football fan first, the writing is on the wall, SDSU is a basketball school now. Which is fine with me. It's a great thing having at least one major sport compete at a national level. Football will never get to the national level because they are handicapped by not having the budget of the P5 schools. Unless a miracle happen and SDSU ends up in a P5 conference SDSU football will never reach the heights that Basketball has reached. Not that long ago people were saying the same thing you are saying about the basketball program. It takes the right coach to elevate the program. If Fisher can do what he did with hoops, someone should be able to do something similar with football. It's not a matter of will it happen, but when will it happen. We just need the right coach to become available. Who it might be is the $64,000 question. How many of you think Rocky can do what Northern Illinois has done the last couple of years? They are in a $#!+ conference like we are and have less attendance than we, yet they were nationally ranked. I just don't see Rocky coaching any team to an 11-1 record or an undefeated season. His bailiwick is limited to the MWC. Unfortunately that also satisfies the many who believe in him. For us to survive we must go beyond that line of thinking.
|
|
|
Post by AztecWilliam on Apr 17, 2014 17:14:09 GMT -8
at this point, we should seriously consider going indy after this year. That would make sense if Aztec football had any legitimate marketability. I'd venture to say if the games were televised strictly in San Diego County, they would probably be out watched by reruns of The Big Bang Theory. Let's not even discuss any interest on a national level.
Oh, heck, let's discuss it anyway!
I see your point, but the question of competing as an independent in football must be considered in long range terms. First of all, there is no possibility of moving to independent status this year, or next year, or maybe even the year after that. I don't know what the rules are in that regard; did BYU have to pay an exit fee to the MWC, or was a year's notice sufficient?
In other words, becoming independent is not feasible until about 2016 at the very least, and probably not until 2017. That would give the program about three years to improve enough so that independence would be practical. Now, if we hover around the 6, 7, maybe 8 win per year level, independence would not be advisable. But what if we win 10 games this year, 11 in 2015, and 12 in 2016? That would be at least two years in the Top-25, and (fingers crossed tightly here) a couple of good wins over power conference schools. That could also mean attendance running close to the 40,000 per game level, plus better recruiting.
The key question is this. Do we see a prosperous future for Aztec football if we are still in the MWC ten years from now? Personally, I don't. We need to start beating the crap out of schools such as Colorado State and Wyoming on a regular basis. We need to choose Rocky's successor very, very carefully. We need an on-campus stadium. And, most of all, we need a new status for our football program. If that means an invitation to a power conference, fine. Personally, I think that is a pipe dream, but I suppose it is not totally impossible. If I am correct, and if we decide that the MWC is a dead end, there are only two alternatives. One is to give up and drop football altogether. I reject that. The other is to take a deep breath and go independent.
I never used to be in favor of independence in football. My opinion has changed because, like a really good chess player who can see that he's cooked ten moves before he is actually checkmated, I believe that something dramatic must be done pretty quickly or the program will perish.
Now that I think about it, I suppose that one perhaps does not have to be a great chess player to see what's in the future for Aztec football if we drift along our present course. I suspect even a mediocre checkers player should be able to see what's coming.
AzWm
|
|
|
Post by uncledougy on Apr 17, 2014 17:26:38 GMT -8
You can't go independent in football.....if you think the TV money is bad in the MWC, it would be 1/4th that as an independent. Which network would pay for San Diego state football games? Are you serious? SDSU has zero leverage in that negotiation and would get screwed.
|
|
|
Post by AztecWilliam on Apr 17, 2014 17:30:38 GMT -8
Not that long ago people were saying the same thing you are saying about the basketball program. It takes the right coach to elevate the program. If Fisher can do what he did with hoops, someone should be able to do something similar with football. It's not a matter of will it happen, but when will it happen. We just need the right coach to become available. Who it might be is the $64,000 question. How many of you think Rocky can do what Northern Illinois has done the last couple of years? They are in a $#!+ conference like we are and have less attendance than we, yet they were nationally ranked. I just don't see Rocky coaching any team to an 11-1 record or an undefeated season. His bailiwick is limited to the MWC. Unfortunately that also satisfies the many who believe in him. For us to survive we must go beyond that line of thinking.
I am not extremely familiar with MAC, but I do believe I am correct in saying that it's a much weaker conference than even the MWC. That would be one reason why Northern Illinois has done so well recently. I other words, a pretty good team (as opposed to an excellent one) has a much better chance of dominating back there. I would guess that SDSU would have gone undefeated had we been in the MAC last season instead of NIU. But let's think beyond the issue of Rocky Long. I, and I think most fans, believe that Rocky has done a good job given the assets at his disposal. It's not like Rocky had a bunch of four and five star athletes similar to what Brady Hoke inherited at Michigan. But long range, it will be up to Rocky's successor to get the program to the 10 wins or more per season level that will be required to make Aztec football a nationally recognized brand. The degree of commitment to football excellence displayed by our AD and school president is going to be crucial. If they have little minds dominated by small-time goals, we are going nowhere. AzWm
|
|
|
Post by AztecWilliam on Apr 17, 2014 17:34:07 GMT -8
You can't go independent in football.....if you think the TV money is bad in the MWC, it would be 1/4th that as an independent. Which network would pay for San Diego state football games? Are you serious? SDSU has zero leverage in that negotiation and would get screwed. We must consider that aspect of the situation, for sure. But whatever money we would receive would not have to be shared with a bunch of other schools. All of this is moot unless we can get the program beyond the 7 or 8 win per season level. If we can become a regular Top-10 resident, going indy just might work. At least we would not have to send our players on yak caravans to Laramie or Colorado Springs. AzWm
|
|
|
Post by standiego on Apr 17, 2014 18:09:21 GMT -8
If the Big East / now AAC had offered SDSU the opportunity to be both a football and basketball member ,believe we would have stayed with them but they didn't make the offer . Then who blinked first BOISE - all for their great money deal with the MW . They got money deal for football but even their football coach said enough and bailed . Then BSU had a chance to play in a lower ranked MBB T .They bailed sure seems they are happy being small time . Sure would prefer being in the AAC if they would let us play basketball and football.
|
|
|
Post by gocoaztec on Apr 17, 2014 18:39:49 GMT -8
This thread reminds me of a school of fish that feed off each others cr*p. 1. We are on National TV at least 8 times. Indy we'd very be lucky to be on 4 times, for even less money. 2. If we went indy the rest of our sports, especially MBB, would be in a worse situation than the MWC. 3. Speaking of the MBB, we sell 12,000+ tickets for MWC mbb games -- imagine that! But, we can't sell any for football -- very odd. 4. Playing football (and MBB?) in the AAC time zones would be a huge disadvantage that would make all the "altitude" complaints seem even more silly than they are. 5. If we could fill the extra 40,000 seats in the Q, we'd more than make up the "CBS loves us factor". 6. If a reasonable percentage of our alumni made even a small contribution we'd make as much as a P5 TV deal. 7. The G5 conferences will have one access bowl slot, and that gives us a better chance to play in a big bowl game than at least half of the P5 schools that are stuck at the bottom of their conference and have virtually no chance. As an indy, we'd have no chance of a big bowl. 8. We are a western school and there are only 2 western conferences with FBS football. We are in one and unlikely to get into the other. 9. Boise State made some noise and money while in the real WAC, we can do the same in the MWC. 10. The AAC (Big East at the time) only wanted us because of the Boise connection -- they never wanted just us. I could continue but that's enough. You may now go back to your feeding. Go Aztecs!
|
|
|
Post by sdaztecs92115 on Apr 17, 2014 19:01:34 GMT -8
I have an idea. STOP BITCHING!
We haven't been this consistently good in quite a few years. Remain calm, it will work out. Just keep winning and going to bowl games. We will get to where every Aztec fan knows we can.
GO AZTECS!
|
|
|
Post by adammclane on Apr 17, 2014 19:16:11 GMT -8
We're the 3rd or 4th best team in the MWC, we bring in 30k-35k fans per game, and you guys think we're getting screwed on a TV deal.
Delusional.
I know it's a long off-season, but sheesh... this thread is insane. We should be happy to be on TV at all.
|
|
|
Post by SD Johnny on Apr 18, 2014 2:59:48 GMT -8
An on campus stadium is required to pull off independence. Trying it while still playing at the Q would be an absolute disaster.
|
|
|
Post by 78aztec82 on Apr 18, 2014 3:39:47 GMT -8
Edit: BTW, the primary reason we're screwed is because CBS has opted to choose us for waaaay too many games. So contrary to what L.A.Aztec thinks, we might not be a big ratings maker, but it's apparent we're superior to almost everyone else in our woebegone conference. So, the better we do in football the less we make in bonus money. Brilliant!!!!! I love this plan and this conference! I especially like how USU is already close to making Boise money. We are in battered spouse syndrome mode! Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
|
|
|
Post by 78aztec82 on Apr 18, 2014 3:40:41 GMT -8
We're the 3rd or 4th best team in the MWC, we bring in 30k-35k fans per game, and you guys think we're getting screwed on a TV deal. Delusional. I know it's a long off-season, but sheesh... this thread is insane. We should be happy to be on TV at all. We are relative to what we gave up. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
|
|
|
Post by 78aztec82 on Apr 18, 2014 3:42:57 GMT -8
Do you think they would ask again? No. Their stance apparently has become, "We're above asking teams to join us." Begging teams to join isn't what the Big Ten does, and I think the AAC wants to create the impression that they're superior to leagues like the MWC. I don't blame them. You gotta walk the walk. That's right, that's how it works. To be big, you have to think and act big. Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
|
|