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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 8:41:52 GMT -8
They cannot. They were allowed all the revenues from the conference based on the fact that they said they needed that to rebuild the conference. If they don't do that, the other schools will sue to have them repay those fees and the court that issued the decision has said they retain jurisdiction to ensure all schools are treated "fairly." The PAC2 has plenty of money to add 6 MWC schools (or 4 MWC and 2 AAC schools) even if they don't ask those schools to pay a portion of their exit fees. Personally, with what SDSU would leave behind in terms of tournament credits, SDSU shouldn't be forced to pay a single dime. They likely will, however. Isn't it true that the Pac2 has to expand by 2026 or they'll no longer be an official conference? They can't wait to see how the ACC shakes out since the clock is ticking. Yes, they have to be up and running with a minimum of 8 schools by 2026. I think they're waiting to see that all departing schools are fully committed to their new conferences before making moves to invite new members. Utah has until Aug. 4th before they are committed to the B12. Not sure about the Zona schools. Arizona fired their AD and "asked" their President to resign since they made the decision to move. I don't think its likely they come back but Utah might like the flexibility to move to the B1G in the future which they would likely be able to negotiate should they rethink their decision and stay with the PAC. To be honest, the conference could have survived with OSU, Wazzu, Cal, Stanford, Utah, ASU & Zona and adding SDSU to be a decent western conference. Could even add UNLV and CSU to get to 10. Personally, I would prefer to be in a smaller conference where you play every team each year in FB and twice for BB. |
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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 8:46:04 GMT -8
Isn't it true that the Pac2 has to expand by 2026 or they'll no longer be an official conference? They can't wait to see how the ACC shakes out since the clock is ticking. I have seen a couple articles suggesting they may ask for an extension on the two-year grace period, but I think the remarks by WSU's outgoing president make that an unlikelihood. Not sure that would be granted anyway. And they would probably only do that to extend their pipe dream of a Big12 or ACC invite. Yes, I heard the same thing but I think the chances of getting an extension is highly unlikely. However, this next season, schools are going to realize how difficult travel is and you will hear complaints from every sport outside of football. That is why I think we will see a breakoff of the top 30-40 schools in FB before 2030. Hopefully, it is just football. |
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Post by Boise Aztec on Jul 1, 2024 12:26:02 GMT -8
The “wad” Will be less than half of the reported fees to exit the MWC and the schools will be on the hook for a portion of it… Though the PAC2 agreed in writing that for the initial school, it would be $10M and each additional school would add $500K so the payment schedule would be: 1. 10 2. 10.5 3. 11 4. 11.5 5. 12 6. 12.5 Total: $67.5M However, SDSU would be leaving behind $14M or so in tournament credits so they may be be able to bargain with that a bit. Let's say the total is $60M for simplicity. If the PAC pays 50% of the fees then the average per school would be 30/6 for $5M each paid over 3 years so $1.67M/year. SDSU, being the biggest prize and leaving behind the most money could pay significantly less. But, even at $67.5M and given the same terms that would be $5.625M or $1.88M/year. What I am being told is that the block leaving the MWC, and going to the new P8/10 are expecting to have their exit fees greatly reduced… The plan would be to vote as a block on all matters in the league to “slow down” everything to include a new tv deal and to vote together to not give the MWC a new GOR… With six members voting to reject any GOR, tv deals, sign contracts, agree to conference schedules, etc. the five members left behind would be forced to allow them to leave at a fraction of what is in place right now. The five left behind would also have to waive the parts of the contract with the P2 that require payment to them for each school that moves to the P2… You are talking about ~$5m per team and most of it would be covered by OSU/WSU. |
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Post by Gundo on Jul 1, 2024 12:33:34 GMT -8
Though the PAC2 agreed in writing that for the initial school, it would be $10M and each additional school would add $500K so the payment schedule would be: 1. 10 2. 10.5 3. 11 4. 11.5 5. 12 6. 12.5 Total: $67.5M However, SDSU would be leaving behind $14M or so in tournament credits so they may be be able to bargain with that a bit. Let's say the total is $60M for simplicity. If the PAC pays 50% of the fees then the average per school would be 30/6 for $5M each paid over 3 years so $1.67M/year. SDSU, being the biggest prize and leaving behind the most money could pay significantly less. But, even at $67.5M and given the same terms that would be $5.625M or $1.88M/year. What I am being told is that the block leaving the MWC, and going to the new P8/10 are expecting to have their exit fees greatly reduced… The plan would be to vote as a block on all matters in the league to “slow down” everything to include a new tv deal and to vote together to not give the MWC a new GOR… With six members voting to reject any GOR, tv deals, sign contracts, agree to conference schedules, etc. the five members left behind would be forced to allow them to leave at a fraction of what is in place right now. The five left behind would also have to waive the parts of the contract with the P2 that require payment to them for each school that moves to the P2… You are talking about ~$5m per team and most of it would be covered by OSU/WSU. When TNT Sports (Warner Bros/Discovery owned) loses the NBA Media Rights, they will insert themselves into the national picture for additional NCAA broadcasting rights, they currently have a piece of March Madness as well. The Big East just signed a Rights deal with WB/D, as did the MWC football schedule for 2024. |
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Post by 94sdsu on Jul 1, 2024 12:48:00 GMT -8
Wouldn't the PAC 2 be silly to do anything until they see how the ACC shakes out? If a couple of ACC schools leaving, it's very likely that they backfill with a western wing to help out Calford and both WSU and OSU would be logical additions (as would SDSU). If that happens, they get back into an existing P4 that won't loss it status even if FSU, Clemson, UNC and Miami all leave.
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Post by docmm on Jul 1, 2024 12:58:30 GMT -8
Wouldn't the PAC 2 be silly to do anything until they see how the ACC shakes out? If a couple of ACC schools leaving, it's very likely that they backfill with a western wing to help out Calford and both WSU and OSU would be logical additions (as would SDSU). If that happens, they get back into an existing P4 that won't loss it status even if FSU, Clemson, UNC and Miami all leave. Not sure about the specifics but if all we West-based schools get into the ACC, wouldn't Oregon State and Washington State lose all that PAC2 $ if they went too? |
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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 13:34:43 GMT -8
Though the PAC2 agreed in writing that for the initial school, it would be $10M and each additional school would add $500K so the payment schedule would be: 1. 10 2. 10.5 3. 11 4. 11.5 5. 12 6. 12.5 Total: $67.5M However, SDSU would be leaving behind $14M or so in tournament credits so they may be be able to bargain with that a bit. Let's say the total is $60M for simplicity. If the PAC pays 50% of the fees then the average per school would be 30/6 for $5M each paid over 3 years so $1.67M/year. SDSU, being the biggest prize and leaving behind the most money could pay significantly less. But, even at $67.5M and given the same terms that would be $5.625M or $1.88M/year. What I am being told is that the block leaving the MWC, and going to the new P8/10 are expecting to have their exit fees greatly reduced… The plan would be to vote as a block on all matters in the league to “slow down” everything to include a new tv deal and to vote together to not give the MWC a new GOR… With six members voting to reject any GOR, tv deals, sign contracts, agree to conference schedules, etc. the five members left behind would be forced to allow them to leave at a fraction of what is in place right now. The five left behind would also have to waive the parts of the contract with the P2 that require payment to them for each school that moves to the P2… You are talking about ~$5m per team and most of it would be covered by OSU/WSU. That is something I've brought up on other boards, how can the MWC get a new media rights deal if half the teams are looking to leave? You mention 11. Does Hawaii not have a vote? Also, what have you heard about AFA. I've heard they may not be that eager to join the PAC, at least not in all sports. For me, AFA as football only paired with Gonzaga would be a very good add. If not AFA then I think Hawaii FB only paired with Zaga would be workable. Now I did see the MWC has teamed up with truTV to cover some FB games, but I don't think that would be a completely new deal. They are getting a lot of games that re not quality, SDSU against Texas A&M (not that one) and about half of New Mexico's games. Edited to Add: The MWC doesn't have a GOR which is different than the exit fees. A GOR binds the schools to a third party, their media partner(s), which makes it harder to get out of. And, have you heard of what media companies might be interested in the new PAC? And, finally, what about AAC teams like Memphis, Tulane and UTSA? |
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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 13:37:01 GMT -8
Wouldn't the PAC 2 be silly to do anything until they see how the ACC shakes out? If a couple of ACC schools leaving, it's very likely that they backfill with a western wing to help out Calford and both WSU and OSU would be logical additions (as would SDSU). If that happens, they get back into an existing P4 that won't loss it status even if FSU, Clemson, UNC and Miami all leave. Not sure about the specifics but if all we West-based schools get into the ACC, wouldn't Oregon State and Washington State lose all that PAC2 $ if they went too? Yes, but they would consider that to be worth it. I'm not sure how I feel about that. The ACC is a good conference but our BB team would be subject to quite a bit more travel across 3 time zones. The ACC would have to take OSU/Wazzu/SDSU and, likely, UNLV to make it work. |
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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 13:40:12 GMT -8
Wouldn't the PAC 2 be silly to do anything until they see how the ACC shakes out? If a couple of ACC schools leaving, it's very likely that they backfill with a western wing to help out Calford and both WSU and OSU would be logical additions (as would SDSU). If that happens, they get back into an existing P4 that won't loss it status even if FSU, Clemson, UNC and Miami all leave. One thing I would expect is that exit fees would be rather small, if any, in a revamped PAC. But, the only teams that might have a chance for elevation would be SDSU, UNLV and Oregon St. I also read something from the PAC commish that the deal would be in the 5 year range. |
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Post by docmm on Jul 1, 2024 13:56:54 GMT -8
All this talk gets me into yet another emotionally vulnerable position where I start to long for and then eventually lust after leaving this a-hole of a conference and its' horrible travel and elevation games.
But is Lucy going to pull the football away one more time? When will I learn?
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Post by AZTEC4LIFE1992 on Jul 1, 2024 13:57:19 GMT -8
I just don't see them paying this much for 5-6 schools. I do not see this amount as being realistic and it would be negotiated down considerably. Also, how can you justify a school being worth that much when you look at the current media deal in place and the value of each school. There is just no way I see this happening as you noted Gundo. Also, I do think I somewhat understand the language and the agreement in place, but no way this is actually what is going to be paid for 5-6 teams. I just don't see this happening IMO. I think the PAC 2 has about $230M they only get to keep if they have a conference but they don't want all the MWC dregs too. Paying $65M still leaves them a lot of money for their own programs. Either they will need to have a good TV contract or share some of the 230m with the MWC 6 to compensate for loss of ncaa tourney credit payments. Would a TNT/TBS/TRU and Apple TV contract with new PAC be substantially more than MWC? |
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Post by docmm on Jul 1, 2024 13:58:25 GMT -8
I think the PAC 2 has about $230M they only get to keep if they have a conference but they don't want all the MWC dregs too. Paying $65M still leaves them a lot of money for their own programs. Either they will need to have a good TV contract or share some of the 230m with the MWC 6 to compensate for loss of ncaa tourney credit payments. Would a TNT/TBS/TRU and Apple TV contract with new PAC be substantially more than MWC? I would think so, especially after losing the NBA. |
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Post by Boise Aztec on Jul 1, 2024 14:17:00 GMT -8
What I am being told is that the block leaving the MWC, and going to the new P8/10 are expecting to have their exit fees greatly reduced… The plan would be to vote as a block on all matters in the league to “slow down” everything to include a new tv deal and to vote together to not give the MWC a new GOR… With six members voting to reject any GOR, tv deals, sign contracts, agree to conference schedules, etc. the five members left behind would be forced to allow them to leave at a fraction of what is in place right now. The five left behind would also have to waive the parts of the contract with the P2 that require payment to them for each school that moves to the P2… You are talking about ~$5m per team and most of it would be covered by OSU/WSU. That is something I've brought up on other boards, how can the MWC get a new media rights deal if half the teams are looking to leave? You mention 11. Does Hawaii not have a vote? Also, what have you heard about AFA. I've heard they may not be that eager to join the PAC, at least not in all sports. For me, AFA as football only paired with Gonzaga would be a very good add. If not AFA then I think Hawaii FB only paired with Zaga would be workable. Now I did see the MWC has teamed up with truTV to cover some BB games, but I don't think that would be a completely new deal. They are getting a lot of games that re not quality, SDSU against Texas A&M (not that one) and about half of New Mexico's games. Edited to Add: The MWC doesn't have a GOR which is different than the exit fees. A GOR binds the schools to a third party, their media partner(s), which makes it harder to get out of. And, have you heard of what media companies might be interested in the new PAC? And, finally, what about AAC teams like Memphis, Tulane and UTSA? That is a lot to cover… I wrote GOR, but meant exit fees… The TNT deal is only picking up games that had not been selected by current partners and is minimal… State wants AFA to be one of the six, but AFA may not want to come… Hawaii wouldn’t be able to vote on BB schedule, for example… I have nothing in the AAC schools |
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Post by 94sdsu on Jul 1, 2024 15:03:38 GMT -8
That is something I've brought up on other boards, how can the MWC get a new media rights deal if half the teams are looking to leave? You mention 11. Does Hawaii not have a vote? Also, what have you heard about AFA. I've heard they may not be that eager to join the PAC, at least not in all sports. For me, AFA as football only paired with Gonzaga would be a very good add. If not AFA then I think Hawaii FB only paired with Zaga would be workable. Now I did see the MWC has teamed up with truTV to cover some BB games, but I don't think that would be a completely new deal. They are getting a lot of games that re not quality, SDSU against Texas A&M (not that one) and about half of New Mexico's games. Edited to Add: The MWC doesn't have a GOR which is different than the exit fees. A GOR binds the schools to a third party, their media partner(s), which makes it harder to get out of. And, have you heard of what media companies might be interested in the new PAC? And, finally, what about AAC teams like Memphis, Tulane and UTSA? That is a lot to cover… I wrote GOR, but meant exit fees… The TNT deal is only picking up games that had not been selected by current partners and is minimal… State wants AFA to be one of the six, but AFA may not want to come… Hawaii wouldn’t be able to vote on BB schedule, for example… I have nothing in the AAC schools Why does State want AFA to be one of the six? Simply because the other options suck? I've never been to Reno, but wouldn't be opposed to adding them if AFA didn't want to come as it seems like a nice place to visit and they've been pretty good with their athletics. |
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Post by Gundo on Jul 1, 2024 15:17:22 GMT -8
Lets review 2024 and how the leagues have expanded, the Big 12 Conference consists of 16 member schools:
University of Arizona
Arizona State University
Baylor University
Brigham Young University (BYU)
University of Central Florida (UCF)
University of Cincinnati
University of Colorado Boulder
University of Houston
Iowa State University
University of Kansas
Kansas State University
Oklahoma State University
Texas Christian University (TCU)
Texas Tech University
University of Utah
West Virginia University
This lineup includes new additions from the Pac-12: Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, and Utah, while Texas and Oklahoma have departed for the SEC.
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Post by Gundo on Jul 1, 2024 15:19:15 GMT -8
In 2024, the Big Ten Conference includes 18 member schools:
University of Illinois
Indiana University
University of Iowa
University of Maryland
University of Michigan
Michigan State University
University of Minnesota
University of Nebraska
Northwestern University
Ohio State University
Pennsylvania State University (Penn State)
Purdue University
Rutgers University
University of Wisconsin
University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA)
University of Southern California (USC)
University of Oregon
University of Washington
The additions of UCLA, USC, Oregon, and Washington mark the expansion of the conference from 14 to 18 schools.
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Post by docmm on Jul 1, 2024 15:21:50 GMT -8
That is a lot to cover… I wrote GOR, but meant exit fees… The TNT deal is only picking up games that had not been selected by current partners and is minimal… State wants AFA to be one of the six, but AFA may not want to come… Hawaii wouldn’t be able to vote on BB schedule, for example… I have nothing in the AAC schools Why does State want AFA to be one of the six? Simply because the other options suck? I've never been to Reno, but wouldn't be opposed to adding them if AFA didn't want to come as it seems like a nice place to visit and they've been pretty good with their athletics. I could see AFA if we're still worried about academics and kissing the feet of the academic elitists in the old PAC10 but in these Wild West days of conference expansion, schools like Grand Canyon "University" and DeVry University would even be considered if the $ numbers worked. |
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Post by Gundo on Jul 1, 2024 15:21:52 GMT -8
n 2024, the Southeastern Conference (SEC) consists of 16 member schools:
University of Alabama
University of Arkansas
Auburn University
University of Florida
University of Georgia
University of Kentucky
Louisiana State University (LSU)
University of Mississippi (Ole Miss)
Mississippi State University
University of Missouri
University of Oklahoma
University of South Carolina
University of Tennessee
University of Texas at Austin
Texas A&M University
Vanderbilt University (Commodores)
The conference expanded to include Oklahoma and Texas, which officially joined on July 1, 2024
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Post by Gundo on Jul 1, 2024 15:23:31 GMT -8
In 2024, the Atlantic Coast Conference (ACC) includes 18 member schools:
Boston College
Clemson University
Duke University
Florida State University
Georgia Institute of Technology (Georgia Tech)
University of Louisville
University of Miami
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
North Carolina State University
University of Notre Dame (partial member)
University of Pittsburgh
Syracuse University
University of Virginia
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University (Virginia Tech)
Wake Forest University
University of California, Berkeley (Cal)
Southern Methodist University (SMU)
Stanford University
These additions expand the conference from 15 to 18 schools.
"Reports have indicated that Stanford and Cal are expected to enter the league with just 30% shares of the money generated from the ACC’s multi-media rights deal with ESPN, while SMU won’t receive any share for the first nine years of membership. The Athletic’s Stewart Mandel reported on Thursday morning Stanford and Cal will receive a 70% share in Year 8, a 75% share in Year 9 and 100% shares in Years 10-12." per Sports Business Journal.
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Post by Den60 on Jul 1, 2024 15:24:11 GMT -8
I think the PAC 2 has about $230M they only get to keep if they have a conference but they don't want all the MWC dregs too. Paying $65M still leaves them a lot of money for their own programs. Either they will need to have a good TV contract or share some of the 230m with the MWC 6 to compensate for loss of ncaa tourney credit payments. Would a TNT/TBS/TRU and Apple TV contract with new PAC be substantially more than MWC? When the PAC was 4, there was talk that adding SDSU, CSU, UNLV, Tulane, Memphis, and Rice the deal would be worth about $11M/school. Fresno and Boise would not be invited as Calford wouldn't be in a conference with them. |
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