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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 14, 2011 20:49:23 GMT -8
Pirates Roll Behind Correia From Elias: Kevin Correia notched his 11th win of the season after the Pirates jumped out to an early 8-0 lead and coasted to a 10-2 triumph at Washington. Correia has accounted for 25.6 percent (11 of 43) of his team's victories this season, the highest percentage for any major-league pitcher. about 10 days ago | Elias Sports Bureau MLB - Correia Loves the Road Kevin Correia captured his 9th road win of the season on Sunday against the Nationals. He's only the 4th Pirates pitcher since 1990 with at least 9 road wins in a season. Since the beginning of the expansion era (1961) no Pirates pitcher has won that many games on the road before the All-Star Break. about 11 days ago | ESPN Stats and Information
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 14, 2011 20:54:41 GMT -8
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 15, 2011 7:58:00 GMT -8
Your article states: Most observers seem to think the Pirates overpaid.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 15, 2011 8:01:21 GMT -8
Pirates Roll Behind Correia From Elias: Kevin Correia notched his 11th win of the season after the Pirates jumped out to an early 8-0 lead and coasted to a 10-2 triumph at Washington. Correia has accounted for 25.6 percent (11 of 43) of his team's victories this season, the highest percentage for any major-league pitcher. about 10 days ago | Elias Sports Bureau MLB - Correia Loves the Road Kevin Correia captured his 9th road win of the season on Sunday against the Nationals. He's only the 4th Pirates pitcher since 1990 with at least 9 road wins in a season. Since the beginning of the expansion era (1961) no Pirates pitcher has won that many games on the road before the All-Star Break. about 11 days ago | ESPN Stats and Information Wins is a bad way to measure a pitcher's worth. Correia has pitched well on the road but has sucked at home - just like last year. The best overall measure of a pitcher is ERA. ERA shows Correia is not as good as the Pitchers the Padres signed instead. In addition the Padres got a first round pick by letting Correia walk and will get another first round pick by letting his replacements walk. So the Padres get better pitchers and 2 first round picks. It is a no brainer. It was a very good decision to let him walk. The Padres in 2011 are better for that and the future is better for that decision.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 15, 2011 8:11:27 GMT -8
Pirates Roll Behind Correia From Elias: Kevin Correia notched his 11th win of the season after the Pirates jumped out to an early 8-0 lead and coasted to a 10-2 triumph at Washington. Correia has accounted for 25.6 percent (11 of 43) of his team's victories this season, the highest percentage for any major-league pitcher. about 10 days ago | Elias Sports Bureau MLB - Correia Loves the Road Kevin Correia captured his 9th road win of the season on Sunday against the Nationals. He's only the 4th Pirates pitcher since 1990 with at least 9 road wins in a season. Since the beginning of the expansion era (1961) no Pirates pitcher has won that many games on the road before the All-Star Break. about 11 days ago | ESPN Stats and Information The Pitrates have scored more runs for Correia than for their other pitchers. This has nothing to do with Correia. That is why wins are not a good measure of a pitcher's worth. The table below shows why wins is a bad measure by comparing Correia and one of his fellow Pirate starters. One who is a much better pitcher with a much worse record. Player | ERA | Wins | Losses | Run Support | 6+ Support | 3- support | Correia | 4.01 | 11 | 7 | 4.9 | 10 | 8 | Maholm | 2.96 | 6 | 9 | 3.0 | 3 | 14 |
If you pitch a pitcher who would lose any game that his team scored 3 or less runs and win any game his team scored 6 or more runs, Correia would be 10-8 and Maholm would be 3-14. Wins says a lot about run support. If Correia had Maholm's run support, his record would be significantly worse than Maholm's 6-9. If Maholm had Correia's run support his record would be significantly better than Correia's 11-7.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 15, 2011 8:27:50 GMT -8
No, I said "apparently not a hitters park". Is it really the park or the players we have or their belief that they're not suppose to be able to hit here? That is why I was very surprised at you, of all people, using park adjustments to color Correia's ERA. Since our opponents have shown even bigger splits at Petco Park versus the road than our hitters over the 7 years it has been open, then maybe everyone has that same belief. How could so many hitters be so stupid? And what about all those hitters who think hitting at Coors field somehow makes you hit better. Stupid hitters. Read the article I posted and you might wake up. It's as I said, he fell apart after his brother passed away. That's understandable from my point of view. Do you think the guy is a machine? Correia was quoted in the article: "I had some off-the-field distractions, but I still had the question in my mind: Was that the reason or was my skill level just not what it was?". This comfirms my contention that it was a good idea not to sign him. Why take a chance that it was his skill level, when better options were available, at a lower price? Even he didn't know if it was his skill level that caused an ERA over 5.00 in the biggest pitchers park in baseball.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 15, 2011 9:23:43 GMT -8
No, I said "apparently not a hitters park". Is it really the park or the players we have or their belief that they're not suppose to be able to hit here? That is why I was very surprised at you, of all people, using park adjustments to color Correia's ERA. Since our opponents have shown even bigger splits at Petco Park versus the road than our hitters over the 7 years it has been open, then maybe everyone has that same belief. How could so many hitters be so stupid? And what about all those hitters who think hitting at Coors field somehow makes you hit better. Stupid hitters. Read the article I posted and you might wake up. It's as I said, he fell apart after his brother passed away. That's understandable from my point of view. Do you think the guy is a machine? Correia was quoted in the article: "I had some off-the-field distractions, but I still had the question in my mind: Was that the reason or was my skill level just not what it was?". This comfirms my contention that it was a good idea not to sign him. Why take a chance that it was his skill level, when better options were available, at a lower price? Even he didn't know if it was his skill level that caused an ERA over 5.00 in the biggest pitchers park in baseball. Sometimes you're like to talking to a wall. For whatever reason, the players appear to be psyched out by some ball parks and psyched by others. Is it based on facts or do they create the facts? Maybe the Pads ought to bring in Anthony Robbins or Marshall Sylver to work on their heads. Will it work? Who knows. Will it hurt? I doubt it. You're once again assuming that it would have taken $4m per year for 2 years to sign Correia. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have. I'd worry more about the wasted $7mill or whatever we're paying Ludwick. He's the first to go and hopefully we'll get something in return that might help in the short-term. But that's another subject and another thread.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 15, 2011 9:27:40 GMT -8
That is why I was very surprised at you, of all people, using park adjustments to color Correia's ERA. Since our opponents have shown even bigger splits at Petco Park versus the road than our hitters over the 7 years it has been open, then maybe everyone has that same belief. How could so many hitters be so stupid? And what about all those hitters who think hitting at Coors field somehow makes you hit better. Stupid hitters. Correia was quoted in the article: "I had some off-the-field distractions, but I still had the question in my mind: Was that the reason or was my skill level just not what it was?". This comfirms my contention that it was a good idea not to sign him. Why take a chance that it was his skill level, when better options were available, at a lower price? Even he didn't know if it was his skill level that caused an ERA over 5.00 in the biggest pitchers park in baseball. Sometimes you're like to talking to a wall. For whatever reason, the players appear to be psyched out by some ball parks and psyched by others. Is it based on facts or do they create the facts? Maybe the Pads ought to bring in Anthony Robbins or Marshall Sylver to work on their heads. Will it work? Who knows. Will it hurt? I doubt it. You're once again assuming that it would have taken $4m per year for 2 years to sign Correia. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have. I'd worry more about the wasted $7mill or whatever we're paying Ludwick. He's the first to go and hopefully we'll get something in return that might help in the short-term. But that's another subject and another thread. And I get psyched out when I run up hill. For whatever reason I don't run as fast and get tired more quickly.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 17, 2011 9:31:34 GMT -8
Sometimes you're like to talking to a wall. For whatever reason, the players appear to be psyched out by some ball parks and psyched by others. Is it based on facts or do they create the facts? Maybe the Pads ought to bring in Anthony Robbins or Marshall Sylver to work on their heads. Will it work? Who knows. Will it hurt? I doubt it. You're once again assuming that it would have taken $4m per year for 2 years to sign Correia. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have. I'd worry more about the wasted $7mill or whatever we're paying Ludwick. He's the first to go and hopefully we'll get something in return that might help in the short-term. But that's another subject and another thread. And I get psyched out when I run up hill. For whatever reason I don't run as fast and get tired more quickly. Good for you. Actually hills can psych you out. Back when I use to backpack a lot and had steep hills in front, I just looked a few yards ahead and not at the big hill and it was easier to deal with.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 20, 2011 11:52:14 GMT -8
Correia now has a worse ERA than any pitcher on the Padres roster. To review:
1. More expensive than any Padres pitcher. 2. Higher ERA than any Padres pitcher.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 21, 2011 21:36:31 GMT -8
Correia now has a worse ERA than any pitcher on the Padres roster. To review: 1. More expensive than any Padres pitcher. 2. Higher ERA than any Padres pitcher. Can't you read? How many times have I said that it wouldn't have taken $4m per year to keep him on the pads? I KNOW
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 22, 2011 8:57:57 GMT -8
Correia now has a worse ERA than any pitcher on the Padres roster. To review: 1. More expensive than any Padres pitcher. 2. Higher ERA than any Padres pitcher. Can't you read? How many times have I said that it wouldn't have taken $4m per year to keep him on the pads? I KNOW So you are buddies with Correia. That explains everything. You don't care about the Padres winning - only that your buddy stays on the team.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 23, 2011 10:06:12 GMT -8
Can't you read? How many times have I said that it wouldn't have taken $4m per year to keep him on the pads? I KNOW So you are buddies with Correia. That explains everything. You don't care about the Padres winning - only that your buddy stays on the team. Did I say I was his buddy? Geezus Bill, I would think that someone who usually appears pretty bright wouldn't make that assumption and then write it out in this forum. No, I've met him once. I just know some people that have inside info that he was NEVER offered a new contract. He wanted to stay in SDiego and was pissed when he wasn't offered an opportunity to do so. So again, you assumed that it would have taken $4mill/yr to keep him when I KNOW it wouldn't. Stick to stats
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 25, 2011 8:00:10 GMT -8
4.2 innings 7 runs in a loss to St Louis on Saturday...The Padres made the right decision to not sign him. His 4 starts in July, he has a 7.28 ERA. Just like last year, he is fading down the stretch. The Pirates, like the Padres, may remove him as a starter.
His ERA has increased every month of the season.
2.65 Cory Luebke 3.05 Tim Stauffer 3.19 Dustin Moseley 3.29 Aaron Harang 3.88 Clayton Richard 4.05 Mat Latos 4.38 Kevin Correia
You were wise to not take my challenge.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 25, 2011 9:54:33 GMT -8
4.2 innings 7 runs in a loss to St Louis on Saturday...The Padres made the right decision to not sign him. His 4 starts in July, he has a 7.28 ERA. Just like last year, he is fading down the stretch. The Pirates, like the Padres, may remove him as a starter. His ERA has increased every month of the season. 2.65 Cory Luebke 3.05 Tim Stauffer 3.19 Dustin Moseley 3.29 Aaron Harang 3.88 Clayton Richard 4.05 Mat Latos 4.38 Kevin Correia You were wise to not take my challenge. As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I thought their manager had overused him as he was leading the team in innings. With the heat/humidity that the East has had for weeks now, it would destroy anybody.
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Post by AztecBill on Jul 25, 2011 10:30:14 GMT -8
4.2 innings 7 runs in a loss to St Louis on Saturday...The Padres made the right decision to not sign him. His 4 starts in July, he has a 7.28 ERA. Just like last year, he is fading down the stretch. The Pirates, like the Padres, may remove him as a starter. His ERA has increased every month of the season. 2.65 Cory Luebke 3.05 Tim Stauffer 3.19 Dustin Moseley 3.29 Aaron Harang 3.88 Clayton Richard 4.05 Mat Latos 4.38 Kevin Correia You were wise to not take my challenge. As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I thought their manager had overused him as he was leading the team in innings. With the heat/humidity that the East has had for weeks now, it would destroy anybody. Anybody? Paul Maholm pitches for the Pirates, has started the same number of games as Correia, has pitched 5 more innings, and has an ERA of 3.26.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2011 12:19:01 GMT -8
Bill is slaughtering Bruce on this one. Anyone who has read Bruce's posts on baseball, knows that he knows very little about the game.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 25, 2011 21:27:17 GMT -8
Bill is slaughtering Bruce on this one. Anyone who has read Bruce's posts on baseball, knows that he knows very little about the game. Josh- You're too funny. You've got nothing to add to the discussion so you try to pile on like some immature idiot. Congrats, you've accomplished your goal. Come back when you actually have any ounce of info. Yes, I've read your bull$#!+ on the other board and there's NOTHING there either. 2 for 2. You're batting 1.000. Congrats! You must be so proud. Why don't you start a thread about something you're an expert in.....tick tick tick....oh that's right...ya got nothing.
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Post by aztecbruce on Jul 25, 2011 21:30:09 GMT -8
As I mentioned in an earlier post in this thread, I thought their manager had overused him as he was leading the team in innings. With the heat/humidity that the East has had for weeks now, it would destroy anybody. Anybody? Paul Maholm pitches for the Pirates, has started the same number of games as Correia, has pitched 5 more innings, and has an ERA of 3.26. Did I say Correia was the best pitcher on the Pirates? Never did. Did I ever say that Correia would have been the best pitcher on the Pads? Never did Besides Maholm is only 6 and 10. Plus he's only 29 years old. Same ol Bill...just put 1 or 2 stats to prove HIS point but NEVER puts the full picture. Correia -30 walks Maholm- 45 walks. "Pirates starter Paul Maholm allowed five hits in the first inning, including a pair of two-run home runs to Albert Pujols and David Freese. So Bill- what's your point? I know Josh has no point. He just likes to act like an idiot. He couldn't find stats if you put them right in front of him. Even if he had anything in front of him, he couldn't figure out what the hell they meant.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2011 7:44:26 GMT -8
LOL!! I love it!
I don't think I need to post any stats. Bill has done a tremendous job. He has provided numbers to show a strong argument that letting Correia walk was the right move. The rotation members have performed as good as KC (arguably better), and the Padres also received compensation for KC's departure.
Discussing stats with you Bruce is usually a waste of time. You know very little about baseball and have proven it countless times over the years. For gods sake, you use Win-Loss records for pitchers, as if that's a telling stat, lol. Run support drives that . Justin Masterson (SDSU alum) has been all star caliber all season and is just a game over .500 record wise, with an ERA under 3. Doug Fister of Seattle has a 3.30 ERA and a 1.17 WHIP (i doubt you know what that means, but it's good), but is 3-11. Nolan Ryan was once 8-16, with a 2.76 ERA!! For Houston. 86 I believe. So keep preaching Maholm's W-L record, big guy.
You're just a bunch of temper and hot air. Most people know it. I own you in a sports debate, and would do so on any sport. Your mindless retort is just insult, emoticons, and bull$#!+. It doesn't faze me.
The Padres staff has outperformed KC, and we got a high draft pick for letting his 5+ ERA walk to Pittsburgh. He gave up 20 homers last year, and already has allowed 16 this year (8th WORST in the NL). He always allowed a lot of long balls. Fact support letting KC walk, though now that I know you had a beer with him and kissed his ass at Dick's Last Resort downtown, I really wish we had kept him. You can't put a number on key intangibles like those.
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