|
|
Post by sdsu2000 on Nov 15, 2024 12:56:35 GMT -8
Just a guess. UNM wants nothing to do with NMSU and the conference knows this and doesn’t want to do anything to upset them. I’m also guessing SJSU has made it known that it wouldn’t be in their best interest to have Sacramento State join the MW. IMO, Sacramento State would be a superior athletic program in 5-10 years than SJSU if they joined the MW.
|
|
|
|
Post by panammaniac on Nov 15, 2024 13:47:45 GMT -8
Just a guess. UNM wants nothing to do with NMSU and the conference knows this and doesn’t want to do anything to upset them. I’m also guessing SJSU has made it known that it wouldn’t be in their best interest to have Sacramento State join the MW. IMO, Sacramento State would be a superior athletic program in 5-10 years than SJSU if they joined the MW. Good guess - it's been true for years. I've said it before on here, but you guys have never really experienced a true rivalry. You had BYU as a rival for a while, but that was a relatively short lived rivalry from competing for the WAC title for a few years (I was a hardcore SDSU fan/season ticket holder and didn't even know NMSU existed back then, so I'm not trolling or talking crap by saying this). I remember at least a few of those matchups being big national TV games at a sold out Qualcomm Stadium, which was a huge deal back then. You have Fresno as sort of a rivalry, but not really. NMSU has two natural rivals - UTEP because they're 45 minutes away, and UNM, the cross-state rival who we absolutely despise. I don't think there are any two schools on the planet that hate each other as much as NMSU and UNM do. UTEP is a lot closer to us but we actually peacefully coexist with them. It's more of a fun rivalry. UNM is the one where there's always fights in the stands and other nastiness going on. Stuff like that makes for good TV viewing, and my earlier point was there was a time when the TV media valued stuff like that. It made for a good TV story and good ratings. As for rivalry games being out of conference, that often is not the case. One recent example is Oklahoma and OSU won't be playing each other anytime soon. It's not in the plans. Texas and A&M didn't play each other after A&M left for the SEC. Now Texas is in the SEC and back to playing A&M, but A&M isn't particularly thrilled about it. NMSU, UMM, and UTEP all play each other every year in football and twice in basketball....but the annual basketball home and home went away this year because of scheduling difficulties, and now because UTEP leaving CUSA and schedule commitments they're saying we may end up not playing UTEP in football for a couple years. That's a travesty - the local rival game is usually the biggest attendance game of the year for whoever's hosting it. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 14:42:08 GMT -8
Sac State is a lot more like San Diego State, and UC Davis is a lot like UCSD. (At least in regards to how they are viewed in their market)
On the other hand, San Jose State is a lot more like CSU Fullerton or Long Beach State to be honest.
It is a miracle that SJSU has a football team still, TBH.
|
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 14:49:14 GMT -8
UNM, NMSU, and UTEP being in the same conference for football or basketball is like if we were in the same conference with UCSD, and USD. It makes no sense.
|
|
|
|
Post by panammaniac on Nov 15, 2024 15:02:14 GMT -8
UNM, NMSU, and UTEP being in the same conference for football or basketball is like if we were in the same conference with UCSD, and USD. It makes no sense. It's not close to the same thing. All three (NMSU, UNM, and UTEP) play FBS football. The three of them have had a 100+ year rivalry. They're all similarly sized schools with similar cultures in a highly polarized region. Their athletics are all on the same level and have been for ages. Any two of those schools playing each other in any sport is a sold out house regardless of how good or how bad the teams are at that time. They're not all in the same city like SDSU, USD, and UCSD - there's some distance between them (NMSU-UTEP 40 miles, NMSU-UNM 250 miles). It's like I mentioned in my earlier post - SDSU fans don't know what a real rivalry looks like because you've never really had one. I don't mean that to be disrespectful at all. I just know because I'm a San Diego kid born and raised, and I didn't know what a real rivalry was until I went out there. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 15:34:56 GMT -8
UNM, NMSU, and UTEP being in the same conference for football or basketball is like if we were in the same conference with UCSD, and USD. It makes no sense. It's not close to the same thing. All three (NMSU, UNM, and UTEP) play FBS football. The three of them have had a 100+ year rivalry. They're all similarly sized schools with similar cultures in a highly polarized region. Their athletics are all on the same level and have been for ages. Any two of those schools playing each other in any sport is a sold out house regardless of how good or how bad the teams are at that time. They're not all in the same city like SDSU, USD, and UCSD - there's some distance between them (NMSU-UTEP 40 miles, NMSU-UNM 250 miles). It's like I mentioned in my earlier post - SDSU fans don't know what a real rivalry looks like because you've never really had one. I don't mean that to be disrespectful at all. I just know because I'm a San Diego kid born and raised, and I didn't know what a real rivalry was until I went out there. You are missing the point. Rivalries do not matter anymore. If you think rivalries are important, go watch HS football instead. Market size, Revenue, Venues, TVs, Tourism, Academics, etc. are all more important than everyone in your small(ish) town showing up on a Friday night. 100 years of a local rivalry is cute, though. Good for you. UCSD, USD, and SDSU blow those 3 schools out of the water in regards to what really matters. |
|
|
|
Post by sdsuball on Nov 15, 2024 16:05:08 GMT -8
I have access to ESRI software that pulls these numbers. They are based on 60 miles from the major Hwy intersections near each school. If you want me to private message you the actual report I can. Please don't. Utah's population is very concentrated in the cities that run north south along the border of the Great Salt Lake and the mountains to the east. I'm assuming that 60 miles includes some of the cities just north of SLC like Ogden. FWIW it does still seem like a high number - I would have guessed 600K. |
|
|
|
Post by Den60 on Nov 15, 2024 16:11:33 GMT -8
I am big on how much market share you have, combined with how many students who living on or near campus, who are not commuting from their parents to class. San Diego State is great because it has a ton of both. San Jose State is terrible because it has neither. (even though it is in a big market) I don't now much about Texas State, but are they more like us, or more like San Jose State? EDIT: For example, Wyoming has 100% of no people, and SJSU has 0% of tons of people. TexSts spending, currently, is a bit below SJSU university right now but they are in the Sun Belt conference so their media deal is less than that of the MWC. But, they have their own 30K stadium and a nice 10K arena. Plus, football is a sacred event in Texas. I think they would come into the PAC at a lesser share to start with. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 16:26:59 GMT -8
The 60 mile drive catches the north part of the city of SLC.
And for Texas State, I'm still on the fence. I think the PAC would be better off funding the buyout of a MW or AAC team, if they have to.
Saying Texas State is like SJSU makes me uncomfortable, LOL.
|
|
|
|
Post by aztech on Nov 15, 2024 16:38:47 GMT -8
I am big on how much market share you have, combined with how many students who living on or near campus, who are not commuting from their parents to class. San Diego State is great because it has a ton of both. San Jose State is terrible because it has neither. (even though it is in a big market) I don't now much about Texas State, but are they more like us, or more like San Jose State? EDIT: For example, Wyoming has 100% of no people, and SJSU has 0% of tons of people. TexSts spending, currently, is a bit below SJSU university right now but they are in the Sun Belt conference so their media deal is less than that of the MWC. But, they have their own 30K stadium and a nice 10K arena. Plus, football is a sacred event in Texas. I think they would come into the PAC at a lesser share to start with. It sure has been awfully quiet on the nPac front. Are they still in court fighting the exit fees? |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 16:47:23 GMT -8
TexSts spending, currently, is a bit below SJSU university right now but they are in the Sun Belt conference so their media deal is less than that of the MWC. But, they have their own 30K stadium and a nice 10K arena. Plus, football is a sacred event in Texas. I think they would come into the PAC at a lesser share to start with. It sure has been awfully quiet on the nPac front. Are they still in court fighting the exit fees? From what I understand, they are negotiating a new TV deal in the hopes that the new payout to each team will be higher, so they can then go back to the teams that turned them down, and see if they would reconsider. UNLV seems like the obvious school they would prefer to add, at this point. EDIT: They will go one by one to every MW (except Wyoming) and AAC school (not in the EST), and then if they all say no, they will look to CUSA. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 16:53:41 GMT -8
It is pretty funny to me that there are schools in the MW willing to get leapfrogged by a CUSA school to save a few million dollars today.
Incredibly cheap and shortsighted.
|
|
|
|
Post by panammaniac on Nov 15, 2024 20:46:51 GMT -8
It's not close to the same thing. All three (NMSU, UNM, and UTEP) play FBS football. The three of them have had a 100+ year rivalry. They're all similarly sized schools with similar cultures in a highly polarized region. Their athletics are all on the same level and have been for ages. Any two of those schools playing each other in any sport is a sold out house regardless of how good or how bad the teams are at that time. They're not all in the same city like SDSU, USD, and UCSD - there's some distance between them (NMSU-UTEP 40 miles, NMSU-UNM 250 miles). It's like I mentioned in my earlier post - SDSU fans don't know what a real rivalry looks like because you've never really had one. I don't mean that to be disrespectful at all. I just know because I'm a San Diego kid born and raised, and I didn't know what a real rivalry was until I went out there. You are missing the point. Rivalries do not matter anymore. If you think rivalries are important, go watch HS football instead. Market size, Revenue, Venues, TVs, Tourism, Academics, etc. are all more important than everyone in your small(ish) town showing up on a Friday night. 100 years of a local rivalry is cute, though. Good for you. UCSD, USD, and SDSU blow those 3 schools out of the water in regards to what really matters. No, I totally get your point. I also think that’s what’s wrong with college sports today. Things that used to matter and actually make college sports awesome don’t matter anymore. You don’t need the big rivalry games with a lot of story and history behind them, but oh my good, bring in Sac State who's never played a single game of FBS football because they have money and are in a huge market. Who wants to watch a heated basketball game between NMSU and UNM when you can watch Wyoming vs NDSU instead? NDSU got the conference into the central time zone after all. We have west coast teams playing in east coast conferences. It’s all just utterly absurd. But absurdity is fine as long as it puts more money in a select few schools’ pockets. Rivalries and traditional bowl games with conference tie-ins that go back decades are a big part of what college football special. Now I couldn’t give two craps about college football outside of my Alma mater because greed snd the P4 has ruined it all. I don’t even watch any of the CFP games because I don’t care. Why should I care about a game between Ohio State and Oregon? I have zero ties to either school. But hey, it’s what the masses want I guess - or what the masses watch because it’s what the TV gods shove down their throats. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 15, 2024 22:22:48 GMT -8
I agree with everything you just said but I am not naive enough to think there is anything you or I can do about it.
Welcome to the real world Peter Pan.
|
|
|
|
Post by LostAztec on Nov 16, 2024 6:42:41 GMT -8
The 60 mile drive catches the north part of the city of SLC. And for Texas State, I'm still on the fence. I think the PAC would be better off funding the buyout of a MW or AAC team, if they have to. Saying Texas State is like SJSU makes me uncomfortable, LOL. The majority of USU grads live in Salt Lake County the we suburban counties in between. |
|
|
|
Post by standiego on Nov 16, 2024 10:45:41 GMT -8
what the New PAC wants or needs is a decent TV Deal and so a school that has a good amount of TV Viewers
Travel concerns are also important plus maybe an area that could expand recruiting
|
|
|
|
Post by Gundo on Nov 16, 2024 12:02:08 GMT -8
It is pretty funny to me that there are schools in the MW willing to get leapfrogged by a CUSA school to save a few million dollars today. Incredibly cheap and shortsighted. The Mountain West Conference (MWC) TV deal is worth approximately $4 million per school, compared to $750,000 for Conference USA (CUSA). Looking at the future MWC lineup, which includes Wyoming, UNLV, New Mexico, Nevada, San Jose State, Air Force, Hawai’i, UTEP, and Grand Canyon University (for basketball and Olympic sports), it’s hard to envision a significant increase in TV revenue, even with media inflation. CUSA also seems unlikely to overtake the MWC in TV earnings. Regarding potential FCS additions, schools like Tarleton State, North Dakota State (NDSU), South Dakota State (SDSU), Montana, Montana State, and Sacramento State would face substantial financial hurdles. These include paying entrance fees to the MWC and a $5 million application fee to the NCAA, along with increased annual spending on athletics to meet FBS standards. In my opinion, only Tarleton State and Sacramento State bring TV markets that might attract network interest. Tarleton, located in the Dallas-Fort Worth DMA, has invested tens of millions in facility upgrades, while Sacramento State offers access to the Sacramento DMA, pro facilities, and NIL funding. However, I don’t see schools like Northern Illinois (NIU) or Toledo leaving the MAC and finding a new conference for their other sports. NDSU could be a potential exception, becoming the next Boise State of the FCS-to-FBS transition. Since 2011, NDSU has a record of 149–12 (.925), including a historic 22-game playoff win streak, cementing their status as the most dominant FCS program of the decade. Since moving to Division I in 2004, the Bison have an impressive 202–39 (.838) overall record, making them a compelling candidate for FBS consideration? |
|
|
|
Post by Den60 on Nov 16, 2024 12:45:20 GMT -8
TexSts spending, currently, is a bit below SJSU university right now but they are in the Sun Belt conference so their media deal is less than that of the MWC. But, they have their own 30K stadium and a nice 10K arena. Plus, football is a sacred event in Texas. I think they would come into the PAC at a lesser share to start with. It sure has been awfully quiet on the nPac front. Are they still in court fighting the exit fees? The MWC asked for an extension in the court case and they need resolution sooner than later. That tells me they are negotiating with the PAC over both the exit and "poaching" fees. I have heard the total number for the 6 departing schools will be in the $65-85M range. And the reason why you aren't hearing much is that the PAC no longer has schools like Washington and Arizona that are leaking information to sabotage their media rights deal, exit penalties and future expansion. That is a good thing. |
|
|
|
Post by AzTex on Nov 16, 2024 13:02:12 GMT -8
It is pretty funny to me that there are schools in the MW willing to get leapfrogged by a CUSA school to save a few million dollars today. Incredibly cheap and shortsighted. The Mountain West Conference (MWC) TV deal is worth approximately $4 million per school, compared to $750,000 for Conference USA (CUSA). Looking at the future MWC lineup, which includes Wyoming, UNLV, New Mexico, Nevada, San Jose State, Air Force, Hawai’i, UTEP, and Grand Canyon University (for basketball and Olympic sports), it’s hard to envision a significant increase in TV revenue, even with media inflation. CUSA also seems unlikely to overtake the MWC in TV earnings. Regarding potential FCS additions, schools like Tarleton State, North Dakota State (NDSU), South Dakota State (SDSU), Montana, Montana State, and Sacramento State would face substantial financial hurdles. These include paying entrance fees to the MWC and a $5 million application fee to the NCAA, along with increased annual spending on athletics to meet FBS standards. In my opinion, only Tarleton State and Sacramento State bring TV markets that might attract network interest. Tarleton, located in the Dallas-Fort Worth DMA, has invested tens of millions in facility upgrades, while Sacramento State offers access to the Sacramento DMA, pro facilities, and NIL funding. However, I don’t see schools like Northern Illinois (NIU) or Toledo leaving the MAC and finding a new conference for their other sports. NDSU could be a potential exception, becoming the next Boise State of the FCS-to-FBS transition. Since 2011, NDSU has a record of 149–12 (.925), including a historic 22-game playoff win streak, cementing their status as the most dominant FCS program of the decade. Since moving to Division I in 2004, the Bison have an impressive 202–39 (.838) overall record, making them a compelling candidate for FBS consideration? But not including, when they were ranked #1 small college, their historic 0-36 loss in 1966 to ... San Diego State College who was #2 before the game. That gave us the Small College Division national championship that year. |
|
|
|
Post by aztucho on Nov 16, 2024 15:46:37 GMT -8
Hell yes to Memphis and UTSA.
Okay with UNLV and Nevada.
I'll tolerate (while holding my nose) Sacramento State or Texas State.
Hell to the no to any other school in the Big Sky or from the Dakotas.
|
|
