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Post by Den60 on Oct 30, 2021 19:35:35 GMT -8
If the vaccines actually worked to stop the spread of COVID, we wouldn't need to have a mask mandate. The pharma companies have created a vaccine that doesn't stop one from getting or spreading the disease, which means it will create mutations that will evade protection from the vaccine and lead to a never ending "requirement" to get "vaccinated" each year, twice per year. Great business model for them. We should have only vaccinated those at risk and then allowed the disease to progress at those who were best equipped to fight the disease off knowing what is necessary for healthy individuals (as well as those at risk) for them to prime their immune system to fight off the infection. Instead, we are allowing pharma companies to ensure our immune system is based on a subscription service. And there are people on here that feel someone like me is "stupid." This is no different than the common cold or flu. All these viruses constantly mutate, which requires yearly vaccines. Covid is no different. The fact that we got a very effective vaccine (though not 100% perfect) in such a short amount of time is miraculous and a testament to human ingenuity. I have zero problem getting a yearly covid shot along with my flu shot, and am incredibly thankful we live in a time when I can get these to protect my health. All that being said, adding a mask “mandate” on top of this, and then allowing people to remove said mask for as long as they want to eat or drink is beyond stupid and completely illogical. Well, we don't know the long term effects of these genetic based vaccines, and I would argue about their effectiveness. It was also recommended that the pharma companies test for ADE but it was not required. Of course the pharmas didn't do that testing, it was not required. COVID has something like a .003% mortality rate, mainly to those with other comorbidities. Your flu shot is much different than your COVID shot, by the way. When you get your flu shot it is a killed version of the virus. The body sees that, and reacts to it like a normal infection. These new vaccines are different, never been put into widespread use. They create a single spike protein that the body will recognize later on. The spike protein itself, however, is cytotoxic. Killed versions of a virus are not. That is why we are seeing higher levels of adverse reactions to these vaccines than we have seen before. As we force more young and healthy people to get "vaccinated" we are going to see more suffer irreversible harm. |
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Post by Den60 on Oct 30, 2021 19:36:26 GMT -8
What the hell dude. I never said I was or wasn't Vaccinated. I asked a simple question. Your the one being the jerk. It's simple... 1. Vaccination has proven to not be the miracle people were sold. 2. You can still get AND SPREAD Covid even if your vaccinated. 3. So why are vaccinated people given a free pass? You couldn’t be more wrong on point #1. Only 4% of the people dying of COVID now are vaccinated. 96% of the deaths are by unvaccinated people. Did you ever take a math class? Source, please. |
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Post by junior on Oct 30, 2021 19:48:15 GMT -8
You couldn’t be more wrong on point #1. Only 4% of the people dying of COVID now are vaccinated. 96% of the deaths are by unvaccinated people. Did you ever take a math class? Source, please. Why must you turn every thread you're on into your own Covid-19 $#!+show? If you feel the need to threadshit, please do it on someone else's thread, OK? Good grief. |
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Post by aztecking on Oct 30, 2021 20:50:45 GMT -8
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Post by aztecdan8 on Oct 30, 2021 23:09:46 GMT -8
goaztecs.com/news/2021/10/29/mens-basketball-mens-and-womens-hoops-entrance-protocols-set-for-viejas-arena.aspx?fbclid=IwAR3fIaqFtAceavVwB0UFE1P54oSuRXSThLhd2qb02WRxFxqtxHl6TUlNhb4Essentially, you'll need to either download an app and put your information in there or bring your Covid Vaxx card. Alternatively, if you're Faculty/Staff/Student, you already should have clearance via Healtheconnect, but that's no easy access either ever since they started with the DFA last semester. Seems like it should be easy, but I predict a storm a brewin' when it comes to some of our more senior fans. Hopefully everyone will remain calm and patient through the first few games. I think the public app or the SDSU app (for faculty/staff/students) should work out best, and if anyone needs help getting their non-digital cards digitized into an app I sure hope that SDSU and/or Aztec Club provides assistance for those who might need it. I'll be happy to help. Just remember your masks … Hopefully by the end of the season, this will all be in the rearview mirror and the Aztecs will be headed to NCAAs again. I'm reading it and #3 option is to bring your original vaccination card + a photo ID. Pretty sure that will be easy enough for most of us.. Leave extra time to get in early. It’s going to be a slog early in the season getting in I do have to question that if every fan coming in is either vaxed or has a negative test, why the masks? Just seems overkill and not really following science. I live in the Bay Area and always fly down for at least a couple home games a season. This mask requirement when everybody in the building is either vaxed or tested negative just seems dumb to me. It’s just too much IMO. Plus most masks offer middling to virtually no protection according to several studies by highly respected organizations. |
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Post by azman on Oct 30, 2021 23:18:52 GMT -8
This is no different than the common cold or flu. All these viruses constantly mutate, which requires yearly vaccines. Covid is no different. The fact that we got a very effective vaccine (though not 100% perfect) in such a short amount of time is miraculous and a testament to human ingenuity. I have zero problem getting a yearly covid shot along with my flu shot, and am incredibly thankful we live in a time when I can get these to protect my health. All that being said, adding a mask “mandate” on top of this, and then allowing people to remove said mask for as long as they want to eat or drink is beyond stupid and completely illogical. Well, we don't know the long term effects of these genetic based vaccines, and I would argue about their effectiveness. It was also recommended that the pharma companies test for ADE but it was not required. Of course the pharmas didn't do that testing, it was not required. COVID has something like a .003% mortality rate, mainly to those with other comorbidities. Your flu shot is much different than your COVID shot, by the way. When you get your flu shot it is a killed version of the virus. The body sees that, and reacts to it like a normal infection. These new vaccines are different, never been put into widespread use. They create a single spike protein that the body will recognize later on. The spike protein itself, however, is cytotoxic. Killed versions of a virus are not. That is why we are seeing higher levels of adverse reactions to these vaccines than we have seen before. As we force more young and healthy people to get "vaccinated" we are going to see more suffer irreversible harm. I realize its a different type of vaccine, but its also been in development for 15 years and went through 3 phases of testing. Also, the spike protein by itself is NOT toxic. It’s just there for the immune system to recognize and mount a response to. All anyone needs to do to answer this question is compare chance of vaccine side effects to Covid infection side effects. It’s not even close. Just read this one short article, it’s very clear. I will also mention, the kids version of the vaccine is only a 10 microgram dose, vs. 100 micrograms for the Moderna adult dose. The side effects for kids will be very, very rare. www.healthline.com/health-news/vaccine-side-effects-vs-covid-19-damage-theres-no-comparison#Young-adult-reaction |
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Post by Den60 on Oct 31, 2021 12:53:40 GMT -8
And there are people on here that feel someone like me is "stupid." No. Never stupid, just possibly a little ignorant… but the great news is that anyone can learn. We don't all learn at the same rate, so it's never a good idea to think of someone who's possibly a little slower at the uptake as simply being "stupid". What's exciting about the science is that observations are not just someone's random opinions. They're actual, observable, facts. The facts are something that can be replicated over and over again … There's real data. Go SDSU RESEARCH!Go Aztecs!!research.sdsu.edu/covid-19-projectsNope, not ignorant. I have read a lot of the subject and I can and have posted data bring some light to the discussion. Despite high vaccination rates, we are still seeing plenty of new cases, you can look at Israel, the UK and the US and see that with your own eyes. The FDA had to change the definition of a vaccine from something that provides "immunity" to a disease to something that provides "protection" from a disease.That's a rather significant change, eh? A Dr. Seuss book held in front of Alec Baldwin would have provided some extra level of protection for Halyna Hutchins, though she still likely would have been killed. Again, if the vaccines were working there would no longer be a reason for mask mandates. They aren't and are, instead driving mutations that will require us to get rather risky jabs twice annually for the foreseeable future and that will include young and healthy people who likely will be at a higher risk of a serious adverse reaction to the vaccine than they have from getting the disease itself. |
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Post by Den60 on Oct 31, 2021 12:55:50 GMT -8
Why must you turn every thread you're on into your own Covid-19 $#!+show? If you feel the need to threadshit, please do it on someone else's thread, OK? Good grief. Gee, isn't this thread about COVID? All I asked for is for someone to back their claims up with a source. |
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Post by Den60 on Oct 31, 2021 13:13:15 GMT -8
Well, we don't know the long term effects of these genetic based vaccines, and I would argue about their effectiveness. It was also recommended that the pharma companies test for ADE but it was not required. Of course the pharmas didn't do that testing, it was not required. COVID has something like a .003% mortality rate, mainly to those with other comorbidities. Your flu shot is much different than your COVID shot, by the way. When you get your flu shot it is a killed version of the virus. The body sees that, and reacts to it like a normal infection. These new vaccines are different, never been put into widespread use. They create a single spike protein that the body will recognize later on. The spike protein itself, however, is cytotoxic. Killed versions of a virus are not. That is why we are seeing higher levels of adverse reactions to these vaccines than we have seen before. As we force more young and healthy people to get "vaccinated" we are going to see more suffer irreversible harm. I realize its a different type of vaccine, but its also been in development for 15 years and went through 3 phases of testing. Also, the spike protein by itself is NOT toxic. It’s just there for the immune system to recognize and mount a response to. All anyone needs to do to answer this question is compare chance of vaccine side effects to Covid infection side effects. It’s not even close. Just read this one short article, it’s very clear. I will also mention, the kids version of the vaccine is only a 10 microgram dose, vs. 100 micrograms for the Moderna adult dose. The side effects for kids will be very, very rare. www.healthline.com/health-news/vaccine-side-effects-vs-covid-19-damage-theres-no-comparison#Young-adult-reactionThe third phase of testing is ongoing and won't be finished until sometime in 2023. As for kids, they are already at low risk of serious complications from COVID, the ones who have died had significant additional comorbidities the great majority of time. But, we are going to mandate healthy kids to get jabbed if they want to have a somewhat normal life. One of the FDA officials that approved the Pfizer vaccine for those over 5 said that they really won't know all the potential side effects until the vaccine is mass distributed. So, if you have young kids and you want them to be guinea pigs then please feel free. Oh, one of the things we are finding out is that the Pfizer vaccines, which is a much lower does than the Moderna (both mRNA vaccines) is less effective and lasts a shorter amount of time. The Moderna vaccine, however, has a higher incident of adverse reactions which is why some EU countries will not approve it for use in those under 30. You know, the whole myocarditis/pericarditis thing. But, we are going to water down a Pfizer vaccine for kids for who knows what protection that provides them when they are not at high risk of becoming seriously ill from the disease. I am more than happy to support anyone who wants to get vaccinated. However, I am very much against coercing people to get them. I also wish that debate as to the efficacy and inherent risks of these vaccines was not being censored. |
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Post by azman on Oct 31, 2021 13:35:53 GMT -8
I realize its a different type of vaccine, but its also been in development for 15 years and went through 3 phases of testing. Also, the spike protein by itself is NOT toxic. It’s just there for the immune system to recognize and mount a response to. All anyone needs to do to answer this question is compare chance of vaccine side effects to Covid infection side effects. It’s not even close. Just read this one short article, it’s very clear. I will also mention, the kids version of the vaccine is only a 10 microgram dose, vs. 100 micrograms for the Moderna adult dose. The side effects for kids will be very, very rare. www.healthline.com/health-news/vaccine-side-effects-vs-covid-19-damage-theres-no-comparison#Young-adult-reactionThe third phase of testing is ongoing and won't be finished until sometime in 2023. As for kids, they are already at low risk of serious complications from COVID, the ones who have died had significant additional comorbidities the great majority of time. But, we are going to mandate healthy kids to get jabbed if they want to have a somewhat normal life. One of the FDA officials that approved the Pfizer vaccine for those over 5 said that they really won't know all the potential side effects until the vaccine is mass distributed. So, if you have young kids and you want them to be guinea pigs then please feel free. Oh, one of the things we are finding out is that the Pfizer vaccines, which is a much lower does than the Moderna (both mRNA vaccines) is less effective and lasts a shorter amount of time. The Moderna vaccine, however, has a higher incident of adverse reactions which is why some EU countries will not approve it for use in those under 30. You know, the whole myocarditis/pericarditis thing. But, we are going to water down a Pfizer vaccine for kids for who knows what protection that provides them when they are not at high risk of becoming seriously ill from the disease. I am more than happy to support anyone who wants to get vaccinated. However, I am very much against coercing people to get them. I also wish that debate as to the efficacy and inherent risks of these vaccines was not being censored. If you would like to see the actual study data, it’s right here for you. I would hope everyone actually believes in math and science, vs. opinions of Tucker Carlson and some dumbasses on Facebook. Effectiveness: Immune responses of children 5 through 11 years of age were comparable to those of individuals 16 through 25 years of age. In addition, the vaccine was found to be 90.7% effective in preventing COVID-19 in children 5 through 11. Safety: The vaccine’s safety was studied in approximately 3,100 children age 5 through 11 who received the vaccine and no serious side effects have been detected in the ongoing study. www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-authorizes-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-emergency-use-children-5-through-11-years-age |
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Post by standiego on Oct 31, 2021 13:54:58 GMT -8
The CDC has stated that the Vaccines are working - Vaccinations can cut back on the severity of Covid - so fewer people will have to go to the Hospitals - Hospital workers are already over loaded . The more Covid cases causes less space for others who also need to be treated for other illnesses .
Vaccinations have Not been said to eliminate Covid but slow it down and make it milder . People who are in closed areas similar to arenas are being asked to wear masks to also prevent the spread . Again this is our Primary source of information in the US .
You bring up Israel , who is also advocating a third vaccination .
Basic question that you refuse to answer - What would you advocate for slowing Covid down . ? Please answer basic question - ?
Is getting Vaccinations and wearing masks in close areas - an inconvenience - yes . If it helps slowing Covid - A PANDEMIC down is it worth it ? Yes It has made going to Sporting Events , Work , School more possible . People have been able to do these things this year because we have gotten Vaccinations and have worn masks .
Why cause the Division - Why look for more Mis and Dis Information that you provide - If you have answers and solutions provide them . Please provide them .
You are an intelligent individual that thrives on causing Division - is there a purpose to Divide Aztec Fans( on this board with your posts - Is that your Purpose or who are you trying to make look bad this time or is it to just Vent against SDSU Administration . These are medical issues with rules provided by the CDC
- People realize your Credibility on these issues is minimal as you spread your Rumors -
in the past - it was that SDSU NIXED an invitation to join the BIG 12 - Then you replied that you did not start the False rumor -" You Merely repeated it ". Mis or Dis Information at its best . Or are you back to the strategy of " Alternative Facts "
You need to be held accountable for your words - Words Do Matter . You had also termed getting Vaccinations as being "JABBED " when they are Vaccinations being done by professionals . Are Children still being required to show vaccinations for a variety of Illnesses before they start school ? Yes . Are they being " Jabbed " or are those of us who get a Flu shot getting Jabbed also . charged Words do excite your base .
Cases of Covid are still happening . People are still passing away from it . So until you provide better answers then stop trying to make it difficult for people trying to slow this down .
If you have better solutions then please tell our Athletic Department what they need to do .
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Post by aztecmichael on Oct 31, 2021 14:15:39 GMT -8
The CDC has stated that the Vaccines are working - Vaccinations can cut back on the severity of Covid - so fewer people will have to go to the Hospitals - Hospital workers are already over loaded . The more Covid cases causes less space for others who also need to be treated for other illnesses . Vaccinations have Not been said to eliminate Covid but slow it down and make it milder . People who are in closed areas similar to arenas are being asked to wear masks to also prevent the spread . Again this is our Primary source of information in the US . You bring up Israel , who is also advocating a third vaccination . Basic question that you refuse to answer - What would you advocate for slowing Covid down . ? Please answer basic question - ? Is getting Vaccinations and wearing masks in close areas - an inconvenience - yes . If it helps slowing Covid - A PANDEMIC down is it worth it ? Yes It has made going to Sporting Events , Work , School more possible . People have been able to do these things this year because we have gotten Vaccinations and have worn masks . Why cause the Division - Why look for more Mis and Dis Information that you provide - If you have answers and solutions provide them . Please provide them . You are an intelligent individual that thrives on causing Division - is there a purpose to Divide Aztec Fans( on this board with your posts - Is that your Purpose or who are you trying to make look bad this time or is it to just Vent against SDSU Administration . These are medical issues with rules provided by the CDC - People realize your Credibility on these issues is minimal as you spread your Rumors - in the past - it was that SDSU NIXED an invitation to join the BIG 12 - Then you replied that you did not start the False rumor -" You Merely repeated it ". Mis or Dis Information at its best . Or are you back to the strategy of " Alternative Facts " You need to be held accountable for your words - Words Do Matter . You had also termed getting Vaccinations as being "JABBED " when they are Vaccinations being done by professionals . Are Children still being required to show vaccinations for a variety of Illnesses before they start school ? Yes . Are they being " Jabbed " or are those of us who get a Flu shot getting Jabbed also . charged Words do excite your base . Cases of Covid are still happening . People are still passing away from it . So until you provide better answers then stop trying to make it difficult for people trying to slow this down . If you have better solutions then please tell our Athletic Department what they need to do . Stan, contrary opinions do not cause division. You should want as many contrary opinions as possible. I have a close relative by marriage who dealt with the communists in Vietnam after the South fell---this is the kind of crap they experienced. Real scientists will tell you, not what they know, but that they know that there is more they DON'T know. Science is not "settled" It is constantly evolving and proven "facts" have changed countless times in human history. Just curious, if republicans were censoring you, and saying you are promoting mis-information by having another opinion, how would you feel? We should ALL welcome dissent---it is good for the world. |
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Post by Den60 on Oct 31, 2021 14:18:23 GMT -8
The third phase of testing is ongoing and won't be finished until sometime in 2023. As for kids, they are already at low risk of serious complications from COVID, the ones who have died had significant additional comorbidities the great majority of time. But, we are going to mandate healthy kids to get jabbed if they want to have a somewhat normal life. One of the FDA officials that approved the Pfizer vaccine for those over 5 said that they really won't know all the potential side effects until the vaccine is mass distributed. So, if you have young kids and you want them to be guinea pigs then please feel free. Oh, one of the things we are finding out is that the Pfizer vaccines, which is a much lower does than the Moderna (both mRNA vaccines) is less effective and lasts a shorter amount of time. The Moderna vaccine, however, has a higher incident of adverse reactions which is why some EU countries will not approve it for use in those under 30. You know, the whole myocarditis/pericarditis thing. But, we are going to water down a Pfizer vaccine for kids for who knows what protection that provides them when they are not at high risk of becoming seriously ill from the disease. I am more than happy to support anyone who wants to get vaccinated. However, I am very much against coercing people to get them. I also wish that debate as to the efficacy and inherent risks of these vaccines was not being censored. If you would like to see the actual study data, it’s right here for you. I would hope everyone actually believes in math and science, vs. opinions of Tucker Carlson and some dumbasses on Facebook. Effectiveness: Immune responses of children 5 through 11 years of age were comparable to those of individuals 16 through 25 years of age. In addition, the vaccine was found to be 90.7% effective in preventing COVID-19 in children 5 through 11. Safety: The vaccine’s safety was studied in approximately 3,100 children age 5 through 11 who received the vaccine and no serious side effects have been detected in the ongoing study. www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-authorizes-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-emergency-use-children-5-through-11-years-ageAgain, I linked to data, and no it didn't come from Tucker Carlson. Just a simple test, if the vaccines work so well then why the mask mandates? If you have young kids and want to vaccinate them, then go ahead. Just don't demand that other parents do so as well. Simple concept, grounded in liberty and freedom. If the vaccine works, then why the hell do you care if someone else is vaccinated? If it is just because you complied and want everyone else to comply as well, then we have no common ground to even enter a debate. |
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Post by azteccc on Oct 31, 2021 14:43:49 GMT -8
Just a simple test, if the vaccines work so well then why the mask mandates? If you have young kids and want to vaccinate them, then go ahead. Just don't demand that other parents do so as well. Simple concept, grounded in liberty and freedom. If the vaccine works, then why the hell do you care if someone else is vaccinated? If it is just because you complied and want everyone else to comply as well, then we have no common ground to even enter a debate. Pro-vaccine mandate folks can't answer this, because it is unanswerable. I think it stems from a deep desire by everyone to get back to some sense of normalcy as quickly as possible. Everyone is over this shlt, right? The dirty secret that people are coming around to in droves (I include myself here, as realizing it late in the process) is that it doesn't matter, we aren't going back to "normal" even if 100% of the world is vaccinated. The question becomes risk tolerance vs. what you're willing to give up as a society. For the current profile of disease risk of death and serious hospitalization, I don't for the life of me understand the calculus pro-mandate people are doing. And that's okay, except the problem is that is not a courtesy they are giving to other people who do not share their extremely low risk tolerance. Due to their own extremely low risk tolerance, they are saying go make this medical decision or you will be unable to participate in society. That's dangerous, no matter how you want to justify it. |
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Post by azman on Oct 31, 2021 14:44:08 GMT -8
Why must you turn every thread you're on into your own Covid-19 $#!+show? If you feel the need to threadshit, please do it on someone else's thread, OK? Good grief. Gee, isn't this thread about COVID? All I asked for is for someone to back their claims up with a source. I did. With two different links. You have not responded them. |
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Post by junior on Oct 31, 2021 14:50:37 GMT -8
Why must you turn every thread you're on into your own Covid-19 $#!+show? If you feel the need to threadshit, please do it on someone else's thread, OK? Good grief. Gee, isn't this thread about COVID? All I asked for is for someone to back their claims up with a source. |
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Post by azman on Oct 31, 2021 14:52:14 GMT -8
Just a simple test, if the vaccines work so well then why the mask mandates? If you have young kids and want to vaccinate them, then go ahead. Just don't demand that other parents do so as well. Simple concept, grounded in liberty and freedom. If the vaccine works, then why the hell do you care if someone else is vaccinated? If it is just because you complied and want everyone else to comply as well, then we have no common ground to even enter a debate. Pro-vaccine mandate folks can't answer this, because it is unanswerable. I think it stems from a deep desire by everyone to get back to some sense of normalcy as quickly as possible. Everyone is over this shlt, right? The dirty secret that people are coming around to in droves (I include myself here, as realizing it late in the process) is that it doesn't matter, we aren't going back to "normal" even if 100% of the world is vaccinated. The question becomes risk tolerance vs. what you're willing to give up as a society. For the current profile of disease risk of death and serious hospitalization, I don't for the life of me understand the calculus pro-mandate people are doing. And that's okay, except the problem is that is not a courtesy they are giving to other people who do not share their extremely low risk tolerance. Due to their own extremely low risk tolerance, they are saying go make this medical decision or you will be unable to participate in society. That's dangerous, no matter how you want to justify it. Do you know how many people have unnecessarily died because of this view? Hell, there have been multiple conservative talk radio hosts that have. And that is a very small subset of people. If you dont want vaccine mandates, then public schools and the military should should stop requiring measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc. as well, right? People seem to forget that “vaccine mandates” have existed for 50+ years already. I am in agreement that the mask mandates are going too far with a vaccine available. Especially with a loophole for eating and drinking which makes masking completely ineffective. |
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Post by azteccc on Oct 31, 2021 15:09:25 GMT -8
Pro-vaccine mandate folks can't answer this, because it is unanswerable. I think it stems from a deep desire by everyone to get back to some sense of normalcy as quickly as possible. Everyone is over this shlt, right? The dirty secret that people are coming around to in droves (I include myself here, as realizing it late in the process) is that it doesn't matter, we aren't going back to "normal" even if 100% of the world is vaccinated. The question becomes risk tolerance vs. what you're willing to give up as a society. For the current profile of disease risk of death and serious hospitalization, I don't for the life of me understand the calculus pro-mandate people are doing. And that's okay, except the problem is that is not a courtesy they are giving to other people who do not share their extremely low risk tolerance. Due to their own extremely low risk tolerance, they are saying go make this medical decision or you will be unable to participate in society. That's dangerous, no matter how you want to justify it. Do you know how many people have unnecessarily died because of this view? Hell, there have been multiple conservative talk radio hosts that have. And that is a very small subset of people. If you dont want vaccine mandates, then public schools and the military should should stop requiring measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc. as well, right? People seem to forget that “vaccine mandates” have existed for 50+ years already. I am in agreement that the mask mandates are going too far with a vaccine available. Especially with a loophole for eating and drinking which makes masking completely ineffective. When the U.S. government stops allowing people to die every day because they can't afford insulin or cancer treatment, I might be more sympathetic to that view. How many have died unnecessarily because of my view? I don't think any? What could we have done different, exactly? I dunno. If you could point me to examples of the Texases and Floridas of the world killing more people than the Californias or New Yorks, I'd be interested to see it. I haven't thus far. ktla.com/news/california/despite-california-and-florida-governors-drastically-different-approaches-the-states-saw-almost-identical-outcomes-in-covid-19-case-rates/And at this point, not last year or yesterday, everyone who would like to be vaccinated has had ample opportunity, you would agree, right? If the vaccines prevent deaths, then any unvaccinated person who contracts the disease and dies is taking on that risk themselves. We let base jumpers go base jumping all the time. |
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Post by myownwords on Oct 31, 2021 15:19:47 GMT -8
Pro-vaccine mandate folks can't answer this, because it is unanswerable. I think it stems from a deep desire by everyone to get back to some sense of normalcy as quickly as possible. Everyone is over this shlt, right? The dirty secret that people are coming around to in droves (I include myself here, as realizing it late in the process) is that it doesn't matter, we aren't going back to "normal" even if 100% of the world is vaccinated. The question becomes risk tolerance vs. what you're willing to give up as a society. For the current profile of disease risk of death and serious hospitalization, I don't for the life of me understand the calculus pro-mandate people are doing. And that's okay, except the problem is that is not a courtesy they are giving to other people who do not share their extremely low risk tolerance. Due to their own extremely low risk tolerance, they are saying go make this medical decision or you will be unable to participate in society. That's dangerous, no matter how you want to justify it. Do you know how many people have unnecessarily died because of this view? Hell, there have been multiple conservative talk radio hosts that have. And that is a very small subset of people. If you dont want vaccine mandates, then public schools and the military should should stop requiring measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc. as well, right? People seem to forget that “vaccine mandates” have existed for 50+ years already. I am in agreement that the mask mandates are going too far with a vaccine available. Especially with a loophole for eating and drinking which makes masking completely ineffective. I think that any conclusions and discussions about vaccine mandates need some "contexts" and respect for both views. The news and politicians have neither. Particularly with regard to measles, small pox, polio, mumps, chicken pox and perhaps others, these have only human vectors. They did not, could not reside in "dormant" times in other species, thus the vaccines ended them. Covid can, and does infect other species, thus rendering it a cyclical disease no matter what we do and will never be eradicated. "Experts" knew this a year ago, or more, so did many politicians. Second, Covid mutates, the aforementioned do not, thus rendering the vaccines impotent with time---as we see, with more and more "boosters' needed. , Third, these Covid vaccines have barely been tested for a year, the others YEARS and have been around for--as you say--40 or 50 or more years yielding results. Fourth, ALWAYS be suspicious of politicians who aggressively push citizens in one direction, especially by force. They claimed the vaccine was safe for pregnant persons (term "woman" is frowned upon now) back in February and March when the vaccine came out only 3 months before that, and as far as I know it still takes NINE months for gestation and more than that to see if problems arise from said injection. Look up thalidomide. Fifth, never listen to doctors and politicians who fail to even give a nod to the 100 million people in the country who've gotten the damn virus. . Sixth, the vaccine is nowhere near as helpful as first advertised---thus the tri-mandates of masking, distancing AND Vaccinations. Next you will be seeing a MANDATE for a booster and another booster after that. Don't laugh, it's coming. |
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Post by azman on Oct 31, 2021 16:42:36 GMT -8
Do you know how many people have unnecessarily died because of this view? Hell, there have been multiple conservative talk radio hosts that have. And that is a very small subset of people. If you dont want vaccine mandates, then public schools and the military should should stop requiring measles, mumps, chicken pox, etc. as well, right? People seem to forget that “vaccine mandates” have existed for 50+ years already. I am in agreement that the mask mandates are going too far with a vaccine available. Especially with a loophole for eating and drinking which makes masking completely ineffective. When the U.S. government stops allowing people to die every day because they can't afford insulin or cancer treatment, I might be more sympathetic to that view. How many have died unnecessarily because of my view? I don't think any? What could we have done different, exactly? I dunno. If you could point me to examples of the Texases and Floridas of the world killing more people than the Californias or New Yorks, I'd be interested to see it. I haven't thus far. ktla.com/news/california/despite-california-and-florida-governors-drastically-different-approaches-the-states-saw-almost-identical-outcomes-in-covid-19-case-rates/And at this point, not last year or yesterday, everyone who would like to be vaccinated has had ample opportunity, you would agree, right? If the vaccines prevent deaths, then any unvaccinated person who contracts the disease and dies is taking on that risk themselves. We let base jumpers go base jumping all the time. Yes, I agree everyone has had ample time to be vaccinated, and that’s kind of my point. A lot of people are dead, who would still be alive if they had just gotten vaccinated. But they didn’t, because they would rather believe what they heard from Tucker Carlson or some conspiracy theorist on YouTube, or read on a Facebook post from their crazy uncle. This kind of misinformation is literally killing thousands of people. As far as stats go, here is a simple one. Number of deaths per 100k people, by state. You will notice 6 of the top 8 are low vaccination states. The other two (NY and NJ) were where the first outbreaks were, when we had no vaccines or effective treatments. www.statista.com/statistics/1109011/coronavirus-covid19-death-rates-us-by-state/ |
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