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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 13:12:52 GMT -8
How again has SD "been the better organization - hands down"? They've been running their organization with about half the income that the Dodgers have had at their disposal over the last 20 years. That's reflected in the salary totals. The Dodgers should have had a much, much better record over that time than the Padres have, but it's pretty much even. Given that, you have to say that the Padres are the better run organization. Doing more with less. (Or just doing as much with much less would be more accurate.) So in this discussion the Dodgers, while out performing the Padres, are penalized because they have a broader fan base and are able to generate more income. Got it.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 15, 2010 13:20:48 GMT -8
They've been running their organization with about half the income that the Dodgers have had at their disposal over the last 20 years. That's reflected in the salary totals. The Dodgers should have had a much, much better record over that time than the Padres have, but it's pretty much even. Given that, you have to say that the Padres are the better run organization. Doing more with less. (Or just doing as much with much less would be more accurate.) So in this discussion the Dodgers, while out performing the Padres, are penalized because they have a broader fan base and are able to generate more income. Got it. They're simply in a larger city with 3 times the population to draw from. It's only the geography that gives them more income. The Padres literally have to do more with less to beat them - and they often do. Over the last 14 years the Pads have certainly done more.
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 13:22:42 GMT -8
this. Also, you wanna compare playoff records? They've been running their organization with about half the income that the Dodgers have had at their disposal over the last 20 years. That's reflected in the salary totals. The Dodgers should have had a much, much better record over that time than the Padres have, but it's pretty much even. Given that, you have to say that the Padres are the better run organization. Doing more with less. (Or just doing as much with much less would be more accurate.) I guess that depends on if you think it matters if you lose a series 4-0 or 4-2. Personally I don't think that matters...bottom line is, did you move on or did you get sent home? Look, this is a silly debate to get into w/ Padre fans. You haven't won jack. Ever. Not once. Arizona has won once, the Angels have won once, hell, the Marlins have won twice! You want to compare franchises...look around your own stadium. San Diego has 5 retired numbers...2 of them are Dodgers!!
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 13:25:29 GMT -8
So in this discussion the Dodgers, while out performing the Padres, are penalized because they have a broader fan base and are able to generate more income. Got it. They're simply in a larger city with 3 times the population to draw from. It's only the geography that gives them more income. The Padres literally have to do more with less to beat them - and they often do. Over the last 14 years the Pads have certainly done more. The Padres have certainly done more? I can only assume this "more" refers to your WS loss in 98...because there's nothing else that exceeds what LA has done.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 15, 2010 14:01:51 GMT -8
They're simply in a larger city with 3 times the population to draw from. It's only the geography that gives them more income. The Padres literally have to do more with less to beat them - and they often do. Over the last 14 years the Pads have certainly done more. The Padres have certainly done more? I can only assume this "more" refers to your WS loss in 98...because there's nothing else that exceeds what LA has done. The Dodgers went, what, 10+ years without a playoff appearance? During that time the Pads owned the Dodgers. And, yes, playoff appearances DO count even if you get sent home when your salary is half that of your opponents. MLB is not the NFL - there is not a level playing field, and you know it. The Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Dodgers, Cubs, and White Sox all have a huge adgantage over everyone else. They can sign free agents at will. The Padres (and other mid market teams) can't - because the large market teams don't want them to be able to compete with them year in and year out. That's why I gave up on baseball years ago.
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Post by Bob Forsythe on Sept 15, 2010 14:02:06 GMT -8
this. Also, you wanna compare playoff records? I guess that depends on if you think it matters if you lose a series 4-0 or 4-2. Personally I don't think that matters...bottom line is, did you move on or did you get sent home? Look, this is a silly debate to get into w/ Padre fans. You haven't won jack. Ever. Not once. Arizona has won once, the Angels have won once, hell, the Marlins have won twice! You want to compare franchises...look around your own stadium. San Diego has 5 retired numbers...2 of them are Dodgers!! As always, a Dogger fan will revert to the team's past glories. But I suppose that's all they have to go on. =Bob
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 14:08:30 GMT -8
The Padres have certainly done more? I can only assume this "more" refers to your WS loss in 98...because there's nothing else that exceeds what LA has done. The Dodgers went, what, 10+ years without a playoff appearance? During that time the Pads owned the Dodgers. And, yes, playoff appearances DO count even if you get sent home when your salary is half that of your opponents. MLB is not the NFL - there is not a level playing field, and you know it. The Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Dodgers, Cubs, and White Sox all have a huge adgantage over everyone else. They can sign free agents at will. The Padres (and other mid market teams) can't - because the large market teams don't want them to be able to compete with them year in and year out. That's why I gave up on baseball years ago. Who said playoff appearances don't count? They count very much & the Dodgers have had almost twice as many as San Diego since 1988...which is why I am struggling with this whole "the Padres have done more in the last 20 years" argument.
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 14:08:55 GMT -8
I guess that depends on if you think it matters if you lose a series 4-0 or 4-2. Personally I don't think that matters...bottom line is, did you move on or did you get sent home? Look, this is a silly debate to get into w/ Padre fans. You haven't won jack. Ever. Not once. Arizona has won once, the Angels have won once, hell, the Marlins have won twice! You want to compare franchises...look around your own stadium. San Diego has 5 retired numbers...2 of them are Dodgers!! As always, a Dogger fan will revert to the team's past glories. But I suppose that's all they have to go on. =Bob Better than having no glories at all.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 15, 2010 14:11:16 GMT -8
The Dodgers went, what, 10+ years without a playoff appearance? During that time the Pads owned the Dodgers. And, yes, playoff appearances DO count even if you get sent home when your salary is half that of your opponents. MLB is not the NFL - there is not a level playing field, and you know it. The Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Dodgers, Cubs, and White Sox all have a huge adgantage over everyone else. They can sign free agents at will. The Padres (and other mid market teams) can't - because the large market teams don't want them to be able to compete with them year in and year out. That's why I gave up on baseball years ago. Who said playoff appearances don't count? They count very much & the Dodgers have had almost twice as many as San Diego since 1988...which is why I am struggling with this whole "the Padres have done more in the last 20 years" argument. 1988 was 22 years ago, not 20. And I said over the last 14 years. And the Dodgers should NEVER have a worse record than the Padres given the inequities of income due solely to geography. Like I said - the NFL's got the right idea so that EVERY team has an equal shot financially. MLB is full of crap and run by the top 6 or 7 money earners who don't want the bottom teams to be competitive year in and year out. They make sure that the money stays with the big boys - which includes the Dodgers.
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 14:22:50 GMT -8
Who said playoff appearances don't count? They count very much & the Dodgers have had almost twice as many as San Diego since 1988...which is why I am struggling with this whole "the Padres have done more in the last 20 years" argument. 1988 was 22 years ago, not 20. And I said over the last 14 years. And the Dodgers should NEVER have a worse record than the Padres given the inequities of income due solely to geography. Like I said - the NFL's got the right idea so that EVERY team has an equal shot financially. MLB is full of crap and run by the top 6 or 7 money earners who don't want the bottom teams to be competitive year in and year out. They make sure that the money stays with the big boys - which includes the Dodgers. Yes 2010-1988 is 22. Sorry, didn't realize I needed to be so specific. I was somehow under the impression we were comparing since LA last won the WS. Last 14 years...kind of an odd number of years for you to choose isn't it? I mean, 20, 15, 10, 5...since LA last won the WS are all a lot less subjective than 14. Hmmm....wonder what happened 14 years ago which would make you pick that number? You wouldn't be trying to cherry pick here would you? Hey, no worries, I get it..it's a money argument. The Padres suck because the system is unfair and it's not their fault.
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Post by Spud on Sept 15, 2010 14:23:20 GMT -8
this. Also, you wanna compare playoff records? I guess that depends on if you think it matters if you lose a series 4-0 or 4-2. Personally I don't think that matters...bottom line is, did you move on or did you get sent home? Look, this is a silly debate to get into w/ Padre fans. You haven't won jack. Ever. Not once. Arizona has won once, the Angels have won once, hell, the Marlins have won twice! You want to compare franchises...look around your own stadium. San Diego has 5 retired numbers...2 of them are Dodgers!! LOL dodger fans going to the ¨we have championships¨well...Let me lay a quote on you from the great coach Mike Ditka... sums up dodger fans...
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 14:25:53 GMT -8
I guess that depends on if you think it matters if you lose a series 4-0 or 4-2. Personally I don't think that matters...bottom line is, did you move on or did you get sent home? Look, this is a silly debate to get into w/ Padre fans. You haven't won jack. Ever. Not once. Arizona has won once, the Angels have won once, hell, the Marlins have won twice! You want to compare franchises...look around your own stadium. San Diego has 5 retired numbers...2 of them are Dodgers!! LOL dodger fans going to the ¨we have championships¨well...Let me lay a quote on you from the great coach Mike Ditka... sums up dodger fans... "You can't build a reputation on what you are going to do." - Henry Ford
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 15, 2010 14:33:22 GMT -8
1988 was 22 years ago, not 20. And I said over the last 14 years. And the Dodgers should NEVER have a worse record than the Padres given the inequities of income due solely to geography. Like I said - the NFL's got the right idea so that EVERY team has an equal shot financially. MLB is full of crap and run by the top 6 or 7 money earners who don't want the bottom teams to be competitive year in and year out. They make sure that the money stays with the big boys - which includes the Dodgers. Yes 2010-1988 is 22. Sorry, didn't realize I needed to be so specific. I was somehow under the impression we were comparing since LA last won the WS. Last 14 years...kind of an odd number of years for you to choose isn't it? I mean, 20, 15, 10, 5...since LA last won the WS are all a lot less subjective than 14. Hmmm....wonder what happened 14 years ago which would make you pick that number? You wouldn't be trying to cherry pick here would you? Hey, no worries, I get it..it's a money argument. The Padres suck because the system is unfair and it's not their fault. The Padres suck? Who's been in first place all year long? Which team went to the World Series more recently? The Padres have a NL Pennant a lot more recently than the Dodgers do. By your standards the Dodgers REALLY suck. And, yes, the system is unfair and unbalanced. The teams in the largest markets win more often than everyone else combined. That's not a good business model to follow for the league to prosper.
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Post by justafan on Sept 15, 2010 14:36:47 GMT -8
Wow!
Hello there Aztec fans...welcome to Dodgers/Padre talk.
But first, a word from our sponsor.....
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 15, 2010 14:53:59 GMT -8
Yes 2010-1988 is 22. Sorry, didn't realize I needed to be so specific. I was somehow under the impression we were comparing since LA last won the WS. Last 14 years...kind of an odd number of years for you to choose isn't it? I mean, 20, 15, 10, 5...since LA last won the WS are all a lot less subjective than 14. Hmmm....wonder what happened 14 years ago which would make you pick that number? You wouldn't be trying to cherry pick here would you? Hey, no worries, I get it..it's a money argument. The Padres suck because the system is unfair and it's not their fault. The Padres suck? Who's been in first place all year long? Which team went to the World Series more recently? The Padres have a NL Pennant a lot more recently than the Dodgers do. By your standards the Dodgers REALLY suck. And, yes, the system is unfair and unbalanced. The teams in the largest markets win more often than everyone else combined. That's not a good business model to follow for the league to prosper. There is no doubt that this year the Padres are having a better season...I don't think that was ever in question. Over the last 14 years (as you wanted to look at), LA has been to the playoffs more times than San Diego and has a better cumulative record. Neither has won a championship. It's becoming more apparent that the single item you have to argue San Diego as being more successful (in your completely unbiased window of time) is that you lost the World Series in 1998. If I have not said so before, congratulations on your second place finish. I was at SDSU at the time, it was a fun year for Padre fans...you actually had some sellouts by the end of the season. You've made it clear that you're upset because LA has more resources and you feel it's unfair. I'm sure somehow, someway, it's the Dodger's fault that only 20,000 people will go to a game at your beautiful downtown ballpark.
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Post by sancarlosaztec on Sept 15, 2010 15:02:52 GMT -8
What the hell does this have to do with banning the troll tomsbestfriend? There is an offtopic forum isn't there? ( I never look at it, but I'm almost sure the mod set that up).
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2010 16:01:12 GMT -8
Not really. That was the year when the Dodgers had a 2 game lead with 3 to play against the Padres at home, and were swept. Kind of a changing of the guard moment. And, AGAIN, I have no horse in this race. Go Twins. Go Orioles. Last 14 years...kind of an odd number of years for you to choose isn't it? .
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 22, 2010 13:33:08 GMT -8
Over the last 27 years the Padres can match the Dodgers year for year in NL West Pennants.
LAD....SDP 1985 1984 1988 1996 1995 1998 2004 2006 2008 2007 2009 2010
Over that same time the Dodgers won the NL pennant once and the Padres twice:
LAD....SDP 1988 1984 ...... 1998
Over that same time the Dodgers won the WS once and the Padres Zero.
LAD....SDP 1988 .......
That is pretty close over the last 27 years. The Padres have won the NL Pennant more and the Dodgers won the WS once.
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Post by AztecTom on Sept 22, 2010 23:07:15 GMT -8
Padres beat the suck ass dodgers again 3-1.
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Post by seasonticketholder on Sept 28, 2010 8:06:13 GMT -8
Over the last 27 years the Padres can match the Dodgers year for year in NL West Pennants. LAD....SDP 1985 1984 1988 1996 1995 1998 2004 2006 2008 2007 2009 2010 Over that same time the Dodgers won the NL pennant once and the Padres twice: LAD....SDP 1988 1984 ...... 1998 Over that same time the Dodgers won the WS once and the Padres Zero. LAD....SDP 1988 .......
That is pretty close over the last 27 years. The Padres have won the NL Pennant more and the Dodgers won the WS once. Yeah, let's look at the last 27 years...first it was 14, now 27...you guys are too much! Forget numbers like 15, 20, 25, or 30...let's pick a point where we did something good and start from there. Even in your cherry picked stats, you still need to pad. LA and SD match NL West championships huh....looks to me like you gave yourself the 2010 championship & if the season ended today you'd be sitting at home with the LA fans...not that you wouldn't be sitting at home already since no one goes to Padres games. I know you're trying, but I think it's time to give it up. Be happy you "might" get one on LA this year, but let's not get carried away.
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