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Post by ignoranus on Oct 2, 2014 11:25:29 GMT -8
Walton redshirted.
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Post by sdaztecs92115 on Oct 2, 2014 11:31:45 GMT -8
Some of you are really debating this? Must be a boring time for you.
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Post by Fishn'Aztec on Oct 2, 2014 11:37:43 GMT -8
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Post by fisherville on Oct 2, 2014 13:46:06 GMT -8
You are both wrong. It does indeed depend on the circumstances, but how can having a terrible year in which you seldom play and when you play look awful help you? It does not, of course. AzWm You are right, I should have just been reffering to Cheatham and Pope's situation, neither is looking to stay in school for a 5th year so it doesn't benefit them. Some lower ranked guys that are realistic about NBA dreams and won't get playing time might benefit from a redshirt year.
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Post by haleiwaaztec on Oct 2, 2014 14:49:04 GMT -8
Unless either has a setback I don't think they will redshirt. I am hopeful that Pope can get back to action after Maui so he can get some good minutes for our weaker slate of home games. I suspect Z may get in a few of those games as well in mid to late December. That being said, this team is deep as Chol, Spencer, JJ will rotate among the C/PF spots all season long. We have enough players to fill the SF spot (Shepard, Polee, Allen and Shrigley) that SDSU can still win against good teams. Remember it was just a few season ago that Franklin was basically playing the PF spot with Tapley, Rahon and Thames on the perimeter - and that team won 26 games!
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Post by HighNTight on Oct 2, 2014 14:55:58 GMT -8
Rocky Long said this in his presser on Tuesday ... I think it applies to basketball too:
"As far as redshirting goes, you don't worry about redshirting anymore. Every player that you recruit now wants to play right away. If they have an opportunity to play, they play and they're happy about it. You don't decide who you're redshirting until the end of the year anyway because you don't know what the season is going to bring as far as players having to play or getting to play. In the last five years, I've never had a freshman say when I said, `Hey, we would like to play you' or `You get a chance to play' in the last five years, I've never had a freshman tell me, `Coach, I want to redshirt.' Ten years ago, kids would tell you that. Ten years ago kids would say, `Coach, I don't want to play. I want to redshirt because I'll be better as a fifth-year senior.' Now they come in and want to play right away because they figure they're going out early to the NFL."
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2014 15:01:16 GMT -8
You are both wrong. It does indeed depend on the circumstances, but how can having a terrible year in which you seldom play and when you play look awful help you? It does not, of course. AzWm You are right, I should have just been reffering to Cheatham and Pope's situation, neither is looking to stay in school for a 5th year so it doesn't benefit them. Some lower ranked guys that are realistic about NBA dreams and won't get playing time might benefit from a redshirt year.
As a team who is recruiting well, why would you want a player who isn't good enough to occupy a scholarship for five years? Shouldn't you just let him to as he is easily replaced?
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 2, 2014 15:05:29 GMT -8
Redshirting seems uncommon in Men's Basketball. Cheriet, Shelton and Shrigley are the only cases I can think of for the Aztecs in recent years. With players the calibre of Zylan and Pope it isn't happening. They came to play ball this season and health permitting they will. Cheriet and Shelton were not coaches choices. Shrigley hurt the Aztecs by red shirting. In retrospect it was a mistake.
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Post by nonpostpete on Oct 2, 2014 16:19:07 GMT -8
Redshirting seems uncommon in Men's Basketball. Cheriet, Shelton and Shrigley are the only cases I can think of for the Aztecs in recent years. With players the calibre of Zylan and Pope it isn't happening. They came to play ball this season and health permitting they will. Cheriet and Shelton were not coaches choices. Shrigley hurt the Aztecs by red shirting. In retrospect it was a mistake. Bill, I know that you truly believe this opinion as you have stated that redshirting Shrigley was a mistake on numerous occasions. However, Shrigley was a perfect redshirt candidate, IMO, and it could pay off well for him and Aztecs. Two years ago, Tapley and Thames were the starting guards and Jamaal started at SF. Rahon was the designated 3 pt shooter off the bench, Polee and Shepard were also wings coming off bench and ahead of Shrigley, with La Bradford as backup PG. Shrigley faced a situation with minimal playing opportunity, even if there were some injuries. However, with Tapley and Rahon graduating, the next season would open up a place in the rotation for his skill set and he filled it well as a redshirt freshman. Shrigley is a role player, rotation guy who will get solid minutes for 4 years and help the team. We'd rather have 4 years of him contributing than 3 years of him contributing and one where he basically sat on the bench. You have mentioned that because Thames was hurt for a few games that season, the team could have used Shrigley and that the team regrets the decision, but I disagree. Shrigely does not play PG, so he would not have helped fill that role. Tapley, JJ, Shepard filled in the PG duties while Thames was out and LaBradford also saw some additional time. One of the games, Polee didn't even play, which shows that due to the experience of Rahon, Tapley, JJ, Shepard it was hard to get minutes as a wing, even when wings were helping to fill the PG role during games Thames missed. Rahon had some bad shooting games, but so did Shrigley last season. So, who is to say we would have gotten a better shooting performance out of a true freshman in Shrigley rather than senior Rahon. IMO, if he did not redshirt, Shrigley would have sat and it would have been a waste. Players like Matt Shrigley, who are good enough to fill a true rotation role, but who have a glut ahead of them at the position when they are a frosh and who are not likely to leave early for NBA are good redshirt candidates if they are willing. He was willing and it will be a win-win for Aztecs. As for Pope and Cheatham, they have much higher prospects for NBA careers and potentially leaving early. Only injury should cause a redshirt of such players. We will see if the injury to either leads to a redshirt.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2014 17:21:37 GMT -8
I don't see the value of having a peripheral role player on scholarship for five years. There are only so many slots available. Should we have redshirted Labradford or Alec allowing them an extra year to develop? They would have been better as a fifth year seniors. Would that fifth year senior be better than the recruits and transfers coming in? Hello Josh Davis! We are talking big boy basketball.
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 2, 2014 19:34:17 GMT -8
Cheriet and Shelton were not coaches choices. Shrigley hurt the Aztecs by red shirting. In retrospect it was a mistake. Bill, I know that you truly believe this opinion as you have stated that redshirting Shrigley was a mistake on numerous occasions. However, Shrigley was a perfect redshirt candidate, IMO, and it could pay off well for him and Aztecs. Two years ago, Tapley and Thames were the starting guards and Jamaal started at SF. Rahon was the designated 3 pt shooter off the bench, Polee and Shepard were also wings coming off bench and ahead of Shrigley, with La Bradford as backup PG. Shrigley faced a situation with minimal playing opportunity, even if there were some injuries. However, with Tapley and Rahon graduating, the next season would open up a place in the rotation for his skill set and he filled it well as a redshirt freshman. Shrigley is a role player, rotation guy who will get solid minutes for 4 years and help the team. We'd rather have 4 years of him contributing than 3 years of him contributing and one where he basically sat on the bench. You have mentioned that because Thames was hurt for a few games that season, the team could have used Shrigley and that the team regrets the decision, but I disagree. Shrigely does not play PG, so he would not have helped fill that role. Tapley, JJ, Shepard filled in the PG duties while Thames was out and LaBradford also saw some additional time. One of the games, Polee didn't even play, which shows that due to the experience of Rahon, Tapley, JJ, Shepard it was hard to get minutes as a wing, even when wings were helping to fill the PG role during games Thames missed. Rahon had some bad shooting games, but so did Shrigley last season. So, who is to say we would have gotten a better shooting performance out of a true freshman in Shrigley rather than senior Rahon. IMO, if he did not redshirt, Shrigley would have sat and it would have been a waste. Players like Matt Shrigley, who are good enough to fill a true rotation role, but who have a glut ahead of them at the position when they are a frosh and who are not likely to leave early for NBA are good redshirt candidates if they are willing. He was willing and it will be a win-win for Aztecs. As for Pope and Cheatham, they have much higher prospects for NBA careers and potentially leaving early. Only injury should cause a redshirt of such players. We will see if the injury to either leads to a redshirt. Most of what you wrote is why he red shirted but reality demonstrates how even instances that overwhelmingly makes a case for red shirting often turn on reality. Thames missed 4 conference games and had limited minutes in many other games and Rahon had such a bad year, that Shrigley would have beat him for minutes. Shrigley would have been better last season with his experience.
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Post by benaztecfan on Oct 2, 2014 19:41:14 GMT -8
Fisher all but admitted in hindsight it may have been a mistake to redshirt Shrigley given the injuries and the state of the team that year.
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Post by Gundo on Oct 2, 2014 23:34:07 GMT -8
Amazing how one topic zig zags around to a totally different tangent. BTW, I don't think that Walton Redshirted, back in the day freshman weren't eligible as I recall
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Post by ignoranus on Oct 3, 2014 6:19:45 GMT -8
Bill did not. My reference was to his son who played for SDSU.
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 3, 2014 7:03:25 GMT -8
Bill did not. My reference was to his son who played for SDSU. To be clear, if we weren't recruiting 4 star players with regularity and were we not talking about 4 star players and we couldn't get stud graduate transfers, my position would be different.
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Post by standiego on Oct 3, 2014 7:39:15 GMT -8
Believe Bill's son did red shirt but it was not his freshman year . Full practices just starting . Red shirting talk does not need to even begin until the guys are able to play and as always it needs to be a mutual decision of Both the player and the coach . A player can start out on the red Shirt list and move to the active roster at any time but not the other way around . Think the emphasis now will be on the guys that can play and see what they can do.
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 3, 2014 8:58:50 GMT -8
Believe Bill's son did red shirt but it was not his freshman year . Full practices just starting . Red shirting talk does not need to even begin until the guys are able to play and as always it needs to be a mutual decision of Both the player and the coach . A player can start out on the red Shirt list and move to the active roster at any time but not the other way around . Think the emphasis now will be on the guys that can play and see what they can do. It may be a mutual decision in the end but one of them makes the request and the other responds. Both Walton and Cheriet requested. Both Shrigley and Jamaal were asked to redshirt. Lukily for the Aztecs Jamaal denied the coaches request. Technically either side can force the issue but I can't see that happening.
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Post by standiego on Oct 3, 2014 9:05:00 GMT -8
As Zeigler's article in the UT today stated . Talk about red shirting is PREMATURE .
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Post by ignoranus on Oct 3, 2014 9:10:47 GMT -8
And, luckily for the Aztecs, JF took his Mother's advice and did NOT declare for the NBA after his freshman year.
The Walton lad redshirted after his junior year.
Note to an earlier poster: I had expressed no opinion on redshirting, just stated the fact that Walton did so.
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 3, 2014 9:58:47 GMT -8
And, luckily for the Aztecs, JF took his Mother's advice and did NOT declare for the NBA after his freshman year. The Walton lad redshirted after his junior year. Note to an earlier poster: I had expressed no opinion on redshirting, just stated the fact that Walton did so. Jamaal had no thought of declaring after his freshman year. No one took exception to your Walton statement.
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