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Post by AztecBill on Sept 10, 2013 17:07:07 GMT -8
Both players are 24 years old.
.229 .324 .420 .744 Rizzo
.260 .336 .436 .772 Average MLB 1B
-.031 -.012 -.013 -.028
.247 .290 .431 .721 Gyorko
.261 .321 .386 .707 Average MLB 2B
-.014 -.031 +.045 +.014
Gyorko is an above average 2B offensively while Rizzo is below average. Gyorko has a higher SLG as a 2B than Rizzo as a 1B.
For what it is worth.
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 20, 2013 12:00:59 GMT -8
.229 .323 .416 .739 Rizzo
.260 .336 .436 .772 Average MLB 1B
-.031 -.013 -.020 -.033
.251 .299 .434 .733 Gyorko
.261 .321 .386 .707 Average MLB 2B
-.010 -.022 +.048 +.026
Gyorko increases his stats while Rizzo lowers his. Gyorko is only .006 OPS points behind Rizzo, while increasing his position adjusted lead in OPS to .059.
Meanwhile Andrew Cashner passes Rizzo in ESPN's WAR.
ESPN WAR
Rizzo
2.1 Batting
0.5 Fielding
2.6 Total WAR
Cashner
0.7 Batting
2.3 Pitching
0.0 Fielding
3.0 Total WAR
Time will tell but the trade looks much better now.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 21, 2013 10:26:28 GMT -8
.229 .323 .416 .739 Rizzo .260 .336 .436 .772 Average MLB 1B -.031 -.013 -.020 -.033 .251 .299 .434 .733 Gyorko .261 .321 .386 .707 Average MLB 2B -.010 -.022 +.048 +.026 Gyorko increases his stats while Rizzo lowers his. Gyorko is only .006 OPS points behind Rizzo, while increasing his position adjusted lead in OPS to .059.
Meanwhile Andrew Cashner passes Rizzo in ESPN's WAR. ESPN WARRizzo 2.1 Batting 0.5 Fielding 2.6 Total WARCashner 0.7 Batting 2.3 Pitching 0.0 Fielding 3.0 Total WAR
Time will tell but the trade looks much better now. And the Cubs have committed over $40 mil to Rizzo through 2019. On the other hand, as Gyorko keeps developing, we will see just how long the Padres hang onto him. |
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 23, 2013 8:46:33 GMT -8
.229 .323 .416 .739 Rizzo .260 .336 .436 .772 Average MLB 1B -.031 -.013 -.020 -.033 .251 .299 .434 .733 Gyorko .261 .321 .386 .707 Average MLB 2B -.010 -.022 +.048 +.026 Gyorko increases his stats while Rizzo lowers his. Gyorko is only .006 OPS points behind Rizzo, while increasing his position adjusted lead in OPS to .059.
Meanwhile Andrew Cashner passes Rizzo in ESPN's WAR. ESPN WARRizzo 2.1 Batting 0.5 Fielding 2.6 Total WARCashner 0.7 Batting 2.3 Pitching 0.0 Fielding 3.0 Total WAR
Time will tell but the trade looks much better now. And the Cubs have committed over $40 mil to Rizzo through 2019. On the other hand, as Gyorko keeps developing, we will see just how long the Padres hang onto him. The Padres already have control over Gyorko until 2019. |
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Post by aardvark on Sept 24, 2013 10:29:51 GMT -8
And the Cubs have committed over $40 mil to Rizzo through 2019. On the other hand, as Gyorko keeps developing, we will see just how long the Padres hang onto him. The Padres already have control over Gyorko until 2019. Yes they do, but they don't have to keep him. If he develops into a top-of-the-line 2nd baseman, would ownership trade him even before free agency? I just want to see how this new ownership group handles players that were developed in the Padres system. Will they eventually pay the high salaries, or just keep bringing up replacements from the farm system? Only time will tell. |
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 24, 2013 16:24:10 GMT -8
The Padres already have control over Gyorko until 2019. Yes they do, but they don't have to keep him. If he develops into a top-of-the-line 2nd baseman, would ownership trade him even before free agency? I just want to see how this new ownership group handles players that were developed in the Padres system. Will they eventually pay the high salaries, or just keep bringing up replacements from the farm system? Only time will tell. They could sign him and then trade him. Owners "showing you" will happen long before we face any Gyorko question. Will Venable will be a test case in a couple of years. He just signed for 2 years. That brings him to his normal time to be a free agent. They didn't add a year. I would have taken an extra year being added, as an indication. Chase Headley's case is complicated by his relatively poor season. I would like the Padres to take every spare dollar in their off season budget and sign Hunter Pence. Quentin, Venable, and Pence could be a great outfield. |
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Post by aardvark on Sept 24, 2013 22:17:58 GMT -8
Yes they do, but they don't have to keep him. If he develops into a top-of-the-line 2nd baseman, would ownership trade him even before free agency? I just want to see how this new ownership group handles players that were developed in the Padres system. Will they eventually pay the high salaries, or just keep bringing up replacements from the farm system? Only time will tell. They could sign him and then trade him. Owners "showing you" will happen long before we face any Gyorko question. Will Venable will be a test case in a couple of years. He just signed for 2 years. That brings him to his normal time to be a free agent. They didn't add a year. I would have taken an extra year being added, as an indication. Chase Headley's case is complicated by his relatively poor season. I would like the Padres to take every spare dollar in their off season budget and sign Hunter Pence. Quentin, Venable, and Pence could be a great outfield. Other than Quentin being lucky to play 100 games and Pence not being available (either because the Giants will re-sign him or because he will command more than the Padres would ever be willing to pay), you are absolutely correct. |
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 25, 2013 8:12:49 GMT -8
They could sign him and then trade him. Owners "showing you" will happen long before we face any Gyorko question. Will Venable will be a test case in a couple of years. He just signed for 2 years. That brings him to his normal time to be a free agent. They didn't add a year. I would have taken an extra year being added, as an indication. Chase Headley's case is complicated by his relatively poor season. I would like the Padres to take every spare dollar in their off season budget and sign Hunter Pence. Quentin, Venable, and Pence could be a great outfield. Other than Quentin being lucky to play 100 games and Pence not being available (either because the Giants will re-sign him or because he will command more than the Padres would ever be willing to pay), you are absolutely correct. The Padres are going to need some luck. Quentin and Luebke both being healthy all year would be a huge plus. But teams have lucky years some times. Oakland this year is a game away from the Red Sox for the best record in baseball. They are mainly there because of good luck. They have a number of veterans having career years and have had good health. Bartolo Colon's ERA (2.64) at 40 years old is better than any year of his career. Oakland also has Josh Donaldson who put up .270 .354 .486 .840 over 3 years in "AAA" and at 27, in his first full year in the majors, is hitting .305 .386 .506 .892. A surprise like that would be nice too. But the padres have the pieces to be next year's Oakland. If they are real lucky they could be incredible. LF Quentin (comes back healthy) CF Venable (showing that this year is no fluke, that he is just a late bloomer) RF Pence (Padres open their wallets and add a piece at a steep price) 1B Alonso (without the hand injury and another year of progress is more what we would expect after last year) 2B Gyorko (continues to develop) SS Cabrera (Continues his development and has a year similar to this year) 3B Headly (shows more of last year than this year) C Grandal (continues to develop and shows more of last year than this) Luck. We don't have to have all that to win. If we did have all the luck described above we could lead baseball in scoring. |
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Post by aardvark on Sept 25, 2013 19:09:24 GMT -8
Other than Quentin being lucky to play 100 games and Pence not being available (either because the Giants will re-sign him or because he will command more than the Padres would ever be willing to pay), you are absolutely correct. The Padres are going to need some luck. Quentin and Luebke both being healthy all year would be a huge plus. But teams have lucky years some times. Oakland this year is a game away from the Red Sox for the best record in baseball. They are mainly there because of good luck. They have a number of veterans having career years and have had good health. Bartolo Colon's ERA (2.64) at 40 years old is better than any year of his career. Oakland also has Josh Donaldson who put up .270 .354 .486 .840 over 3 years in "AAA" and at 27, in his first full year in the majors, is hitting .305 .386 .506 .892. A surprise like that would be nice too. But the padres have the pieces to be next year's Oakland. If they are real lucky they could be incredible. LF Quentin (comes back healthy) CF Venable (showing that this year is no fluke, that he is just a late bloomer) RF Pence (Padres open their wallets and add a piece at a steep price) 1B Alonso (without the hand injury and another year of progress is more what we would expect after last year) 2B Gyorko (continues to develop) SS Cabrera (Continues his development and has a year similar to this year) 3B Headly (shows more of last year than this year) C Grandal (continues to develop and shows more of last year than this) Luck. We don't have to have all that to win. If we did have all the luck described above we could lead baseball in scoring. A healthy Quentin is an oxymoron. He has played 130 games in his career one time. Since he became a starter, he is averaging 107 games per season. In his 2 seasons with the Padres, he has played in a total of 168 games. Pence will not happen, especially when the Padres see just how far they would have to open their wallet. To me, what is most important to the Padres is starting pitching. They need to get some guys healthy. I have my doubts about Luebke ever coming back, but I hope he proves me wrong. Maybin is a huge question mark--I am hoping he gets back next year, as that would free up Venable to go back to RF, and leave Denorfia as the 4th outfielder who would gets lots of playing time. If the Padres could get 120-130 games out of Quentin, the Padres would be ecstatic. And it would be nice to see the Padres get off to a decent start in April and May, instead of burying themselves early like they have been lately. |
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 26, 2013 8:48:19 GMT -8
The Padres are going to need some luck. Quentin and Luebke both being healthy all year would be a huge plus. But teams have lucky years some times. Oakland this year is a game away from the Red Sox for the best record in baseball. They are mainly there because of good luck. They have a number of veterans having career years and have had good health. Bartolo Colon's ERA (2.64) at 40 years old is better than any year of his career. Oakland also has Josh Donaldson who put up .270 .354 .486 .840 over 3 years in "AAA" and at 27, in his first full year in the majors, is hitting .305 .386 .506 .892. A surprise like that would be nice too. But the padres have the pieces to be next year's Oakland. If they are real lucky they could be incredible. LF Quentin (comes back healthy) CF Venable (showing that this year is no fluke, that he is just a late bloomer) RF Pence (Padres open their wallets and add a piece at a steep price) 1B Alonso (without the hand injury and another year of progress is more what we would expect after last year) 2B Gyorko (continues to develop) SS Cabrera (Continues his development and has a year similar to this year) 3B Headly (shows more of last year than this year) C Grandal (continues to develop and shows more of last year than this) Luck. We don't have to have all that to win. If we did have all the luck described above we could lead baseball in scoring. A healthy Quentin is an oxymoron. He has played 130 games in his career one time. Since he became a starter, he is averaging 107 games per season. In his 2 seasons with the Padres, he has played in a total of 168 games. Pence will not happen, especially when the Padres see just how far they would have to open their wallet. To me, what is most important to the Padres is starting pitching. They need to get some guys healthy. I have my doubts about Luebke ever coming back, but I hope he proves me wrong. Maybin is a huge question mark--I am hoping he gets back next year, as that would free up Venable to go back to RF, and leave Denorfia as the 4th outfielder who would gets lots of playing time. If the Padres could get 120-130 games out of Quentin, the Padres would be ecstatic. And it would be nice to see the Padres get off to a decent start in April and May, instead of burying themselves early like they have been lately. What everyone is saying about Quentin was being said about Cashner before this season. Quentin can come back and be healthy. But maybe Quentin being a DH is the best option long term. That would either mean the NL going DH (doubtful in the short term) or a trade. |
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Post by aardvark on Sept 26, 2013 21:21:32 GMT -8
A healthy Quentin is an oxymoron. He has played 130 games in his career one time. Since he became a starter, he is averaging 107 games per season. In his 2 seasons with the Padres, he has played in a total of 168 games. Pence will not happen, especially when the Padres see just how far they would have to open their wallet. To me, what is most important to the Padres is starting pitching. They need to get some guys healthy. I have my doubts about Luebke ever coming back, but I hope he proves me wrong. Maybin is a huge question mark--I am hoping he gets back next year, as that would free up Venable to go back to RF, and leave Denorfia as the 4th outfielder who would gets lots of playing time. If the Padres could get 120-130 games out of Quentin, the Padres would be ecstatic. And it would be nice to see the Padres get off to a decent start in April and May, instead of burying themselves early like they have been lately. What everyone is saying about Quentin was being said about Cashner before this season. Quentin can come back and be healthy. But maybe Quentin being a DH is the best option long term. That would either mean the NL going DH (doubtful in the short term) or a trade. Quentin has a long history of being injured during the season. Cashner, not so much. At this point, I'm more worried about Cashner getting hurt running the bases than I am about him pitching. I would not be against trading Quentin, but with his no-trade clause, the Padres would probably have to sweeten the pot and send money with him in a trade to get him to waive his no-trade provision. If he is going to stay in the big leagues long-term, it will be as a DH, which means it won't be here. |
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Post by AztecBill on Sept 30, 2013 13:46:24 GMT -8
What everyone is saying about Quentin was being said about Cashner before this season. Quentin can come back and be healthy. But maybe Quentin being a DH is the best option long term. That would either mean the NL going DH (doubtful in the short term) or a trade. Quentin has a long history of being injured during the season. Cashner, not so much. At this point, I'm more worried about Cashner getting hurt running the bases than I am about him pitching. I would not be against trading Quentin, but with his no-trade clause, the Padres would probably have to sweeten the pot and send money with him in a trade to get him to waive his no-trade provision. If he is going to stay in the big leagues long-term, it will be as a DH, which means it won't be here. "Sending money" doesn't "sweeten the pot" for the player but for the team accepting him in a trade. If he feels his health is in question, he will want to DH. If he doesn't, then maybe it is worth the risk. We won't get value in return, equal to a healthy Quentin. The Padres may gamble on his being healthy since the return on that is much higher than the value of the trade. The gamble may be the better option. We just give him plenty of rest. |
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Post by aardvark on Sept 30, 2013 18:42:52 GMT -8
Quentin has a long history of being injured during the season. Cashner, not so much. At this point, I'm more worried about Cashner getting hurt running the bases than I am about him pitching. I would not be against trading Quentin, but with his no-trade clause, the Padres would probably have to sweeten the pot and send money with him in a trade to get him to waive his no-trade provision. If he is going to stay in the big leagues long-term, it will be as a DH, which means it won't be here. "Sending money" doesn't "sweeten the pot" for the player but for the team accepting him in a trade. If he feels his health is in question, he will want to DH. If he doesn't, then maybe it is worth the risk. We won't get value in return, equal to a healthy Quentin. The Padres may gamble on his being healthy since the return on that is much higher than the value of the trade. The gamble may be the better option. We just give him plenty of rest. I knew I should have re-worded that comment about sending money along when/if trading Quentin. That is what I meant. I do agree with you that it may be best to gamble on Quentin's health--but they will still be very fortunate if they get over 120 games out of him. We can only hope. |
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 1, 2013 12:51:14 GMT -8
"Sending money" doesn't "sweeten the pot" for the player but for the team accepting him in a trade. If he feels his health is in question, he will want to DH. If he doesn't, then maybe it is worth the risk. We won't get value in return, equal to a healthy Quentin. The Padres may gamble on his being healthy since the return on that is much higher than the value of the trade. The gamble may be the better option. We just give him plenty of rest. I knew I should have re-worded that comment about sending money along when/if trading Quentin. That is what I meant. I do agree with you that it may be best to gamble on Quentin's health--but they will still be very fortunate if they get over 120 games out of him. We can only hope. The Padres are in position to make a 3-1 trade. The Padres minor league depth coming of age is nice but it also creates 40 man roster problems. Giving up 3 major league or near major league players for 1 major league star or MLB ready stud prospect, is a solution to those problems and will boost the lineup. We need a Latos-type trade in reverse. |
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Post by cvtower on Oct 1, 2013 17:31:03 GMT -8
Even though I know he is also injury prone, I would prefer Kyle Blanks over Carlos Quentin. I like how he's been improving with his at-bats, having more patience and control, compared to his earlier free swinging ways
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Post by aztecmusician on Oct 2, 2013 19:17:55 GMT -8
Other than Quentin being lucky to play 100 games and Pence not being available (either because the Giants will re-sign him or because he will command more than the Padres would ever be willing to pay), you are absolutely correct. The Padres are going to need some luck. Quentin and Luebke both being healthy all year would be a huge plus. But teams have lucky years some times. Oakland this year is a game away from the Red Sox for the best record in baseball. They are mainly there because of good luck. They have a number of veterans having career years and have had good health. Bartolo Colon's ERA (2.64) at 40 years old is better than any year of his career. Oakland also has Josh Donaldson who put up .270 .354 .486 .840 over 3 years in "AAA" and at 27, in his first full year in the majors, is hitting .305 .386 .506 .892. A surprise like that would be nice too. But the padres have the pieces to be next year's Oakland. If they are real lucky they could be incredible. LF Quentin (comes back healthy) CF Venable (showing that this year is no fluke, that he is just a late bloomer) RF Pence (Padres open their wallets and add a piece at a steep price) 1B Alonso (without the hand injury and another year of progress is more what we would expect after last year) 2B Gyorko (continues to develop) SS Cabrera (Continues his development and has a year similar to this year) 3B Headly (shows more of last year than this year) C Grandal (continues to develop and shows more of last year than this) Luck. We don't have to have all that to win. If we did have all the luck described above we could lead baseball in scoring. There was a point this season for about a week where Carlos Quentin was the hottest hitter in the NL, the Padres want that in their lineup. Eventually he is going to have that "career year" when he hits .315 with 40HR. When he breaks down the Padres have Denorfia, Maybin and Amarista on the bench ready to go. |
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Post by AztecBill on Oct 3, 2013 7:57:34 GMT -8
Even though I know he is also injury prone, I would prefer Kyle Blanks over Carlos Quentin. I like how he's been improving with his at-bats, having more patience and control, compared to his earlier free swinging ways .275 .363 .493 .855 Carlos Quentin .243 .305 .379 .684 Kyle Blanks Why would you rather have Kyle Blanks be the Padres Left Fielder? Are you a Dodger fan? Kyle Blanks Post All-Star Game .197 .258 .213 .471 How is he "improving with his at-bats"? |
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