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Post by AztecWilliam on Aug 16, 2012 19:04:12 GMT -8
I favor free market approaches to almost everything, and that includes medicine.
AzWm
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Post by AlwaysAnAztec on Aug 17, 2012 8:41:04 GMT -8
I favor free market approaches to almost everything, and that includes medicine. AzWm By that do you mean that only those who can afford medical treatment should receive it?
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 17, 2012 8:43:16 GMT -8
I favor free market approaches to almost everything, and that includes medicine. AzWm So why the restrictions on Canadian drugs?
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Post by aztecwin on Aug 17, 2012 16:02:09 GMT -8
I favor free market approaches to almost everything, and that includes medicine. AzWm So why the restrictions on Canadian drugs? You are probably asking the wrong question of the wrong folks. We do need some kind of protection for the people who invest billions in R & D, but there must be some middle ground for get control over at least generic drug prices. Complex problem! Maybe there is no good path for reducing the price of drugs and keeping making advances in drug development. Or are pharmaceutical drugs the question?
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 17, 2012 16:41:58 GMT -8
So why the restrictions on Canadian drugs? You are probably asking the wrong question of the wrong folks. We do need some kind of protection for the people who invest billions in R & D, but there must be some middle ground for get control over at least generic drug prices. Complex problem! Maybe there is no good path for reducing the price of drugs and keeping making advances in drug development. Or are pharmaceutical drugs the question? I was just stating if someone is for a free market, shouldn't we lift those restrictions.
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Post by tuff on Aug 17, 2012 16:45:42 GMT -8
Replace the word "doctors" with "teachers" and I bet you, and most conservatives, would disagree. Why should doctors should make as much money as they possibly can from their profession but teachers should work for free. I was thinking the same thing. I see William didn't respond to this at all sans his doctors should make a ton of money. Although teachers didn't spend as much for their education, why is it right wingers expect them to work for 20 grand less (state of AZ) starting with a masters degree than the average person with the same level of education? If it's the hours, think again. Although teachers get a lot of days off, their total hours works in a year matches or exceeds the 9-5 business hour stiffs. So why no noise about them being entitled to more money like doctors? I love how they get on libs for entitlements. lol You are kidding. Right. Do teachers spend years interning? Are they on call 24/7. Do they have the overhead of rent, equipment costs, paying receptionist and nurses salarys and their benefits? Do teachers carry a $100,000 or more of malpractice insurance premiums every year. Damn right doctors deseve a helluva lot more money. And teachers get 3 m onths off of vacation ta boot. If you ask me, they are overpaid judging from the results students are achieving today.
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 20, 2012 18:05:08 GMT -8
I was thinking the same thing. I see William didn't respond to this at all sans his doctors should make a ton of money. Although teachers didn't spend as much for their education, why is it right wingers expect them to work for 20 grand less (state of AZ) starting with a masters degree than the average person with the same level of education? If it's the hours, think again. Although teachers get a lot of days off, their total hours works in a year matches or exceeds the 9-5 business hour stiffs. So why no noise about them being entitled to more money like doctors? I love how they get on libs for entitlements. lol You are kidding. Right. Do teachers spend years interning? Are they on call 24/7. Do they have the overhead of rent, equipment costs, paying receptionist and nurses salarys and their benefits? Do teachers carry a $100,000 or more of malpractice insurance premiums every year. Damn right doctors deseve a helluva lot more money. And teachers get 3 m onths off of vacation ta boot. If you ask me, they are overpaid judging from the results students are achieving today. Three months off? As soon as you said that, you told me you know nothing about teachers or our education system.
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Post by aztec70 on Aug 20, 2012 19:03:59 GMT -8
I was thinking the same thing. I see William didn't respond to this at all sans his doctors should make a ton of money. Although teachers didn't spend as much for their education, why is it right wingers expect them to work for 20 grand less (state of AZ) starting with a masters degree than the average person with the same level of education? If it's the hours, think again. Although teachers get a lot of days off, their total hours works in a year matches or exceeds the 9-5 business hour stiffs. Most physicians are not self employed. They are employees. So why no noise about them being entitled to more money like doctors? I love how they get on libs for entitlements. lol You are kidding. Right. Do teachers spend years interning? Are they on call 24/7. Do they have the overhead of rent, equipment costs, paying receptionist and nurses salarys and their benefits? Do teachers carry a $100,000 or more of malpractice insurance premiums every year. Damn right doctors deseve a helluva lot more money. And teachers get 3 m onths off of vacation ta boot. If you ask me, they are overpaid judging from the results students are achieving today.
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Post by tuff on Aug 21, 2012 15:36:49 GMT -8
You are kidding. Right. Do teachers spend years interning? Are they on call 24/7. Do they have the overhead of rent, equipment costs, paying receptionist and nurses salarys and their benefits? Do teachers carry a $100,000 or more of malpractice insurance premiums every year. Damn right doctors deseve a helluva lot more money. And teachers get 3 m onths off of vacation ta boot. If you ask me, they are overpaid judging from the results students are achieving today. Three months off? As soon as you said that, you told me you know nothing about teachers or our education system. Okay. So they work all 12 months. Still doesn;t change what I stated.
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 21, 2012 15:56:55 GMT -8
Three months off? As soon as you said that, you told me you know nothing about teachers or our education system. Okay. So they work all 12 months. Still doesn;t change what I stated. If interning and student loans are all that's needed to qualify for a hefty salary, then you better change your view.
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Post by tuff on Aug 21, 2012 20:51:57 GMT -8
Okay. So they work all 12 months. Still doesn;t change what I stated. If interning and student loans are all that's needed to qualify for a hefty salary, then you better change your view. There is a lot more to it than that. But as I said earlier, next time you get real sick or need major surgery, get it from a teacher.. Their education requirements and training aren't even close to the levels a doctor goes through. Plus a practice is like opening and maintaining a small business. Now, that is pressure.
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 22, 2012 9:43:26 GMT -8
If interning and student loans are all that's needed to qualify for a hefty salary, then you better change your view. There is a lot more to it than that. But as I said earlier, next time you get real sick or need major surgery, get it from a teacher.. Their education requirements and training aren't even close to the levels a doctor goes through. Plus a practice is like opening and maintaining a small business. Now, that is pressure. Your defensive post implies I said doctors do not earn their salaries. Why is that? All I've been stating is teachers are underpaid. You've demostrated your lack of knowledge about their work load already so we won't debate that. Do I believe they should be on equal financial footing as doctors? Not even close. However, it would help if teachers with masters degrees earned at least as much as their private sector counter parts with the same level of education. For their work and training they're worth 50-75K a year depending on where they live for cost of living adjustments.
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Post by AlwaysAnAztec on Aug 22, 2012 10:13:44 GMT -8
There is a lot more to it than that. But as I said earlier, next time you get real sick or need major surgery, get it from a teacher.. Their education requirements and training aren't even close to the levels a doctor goes through. Plus a practice is like opening and maintaining a small business. Now, that is pressure. Your defensive post implies I said doctors do not earn their salaries. Why is that? All I've been stating is teachers are underpaid. You've demostrated your lack of knowledge about their work load already so we won't debate that. Do I believe they should be on equal financial footing as doctors? Not even close. However, it would help if teachers with masters degrees earned at least as much as their private sector counter parts with the same level of education. For their work and training they're worth 50-75K a year depending on where they live for cost of living adjustments. +1
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2012 12:05:55 GMT -8
There is a lot more to it than that. But as I said earlier, next time you get real sick or need major surgery, get it from a teacher.. Their education requirements and training aren't even close to the levels a doctor goes through. Plus a practice is like opening and maintaining a small business. Now, that is pressure. Your defensive post implies I said doctors do not earn their salaries. Why is that? All I've been stating is teachers are underpaid. You've demostrated your lack of knowledge about their work load already so we won't debate that. Do I believe they should be on equal financial footing as doctors? Not even close. However, it would help if teachers with masters degrees earned at least as much as their private sector counter parts with the same level of education. For their work and training they're worth 50-75K a year depending on where they live for cost of living adjustments. ^^^This
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Post by tuff on Aug 22, 2012 12:27:56 GMT -8
Your defensive post implies I said doctors do not earn their salaries. Why is that? All I've been stating is teachers are underpaid. You've demostrated your lack of knowledge about their work load already so we won't debate that. Do I believe they should be on equal financial footing as doctors? Not even close. However, it would help if teachers with masters degrees earned at least as much as their private sector counter parts with the same level of education. For their work and training they're worth 50-75K a year depending on where they live for cost of living adjustments. ^^^This Judging from the results of American students these days, they are overpaid. But this thread was about doctors and someone brought in teachers into the equation. We are going to have a severe doctor shortage in this country if current things go unchecked.
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 22, 2012 12:37:47 GMT -8
Judging from the results of American students these days, they are overpaid. But this thread was about doctors and someone brought in teachers into the equation. We are going to have a severe doctor shortage in this country if current things go unchecked. lmao Try allowing teachers to teach rather than feed them watered-down information to pass standardized tests. I bet you do not realize how teachers have very little power over what gets taught in their classes. Try allowing teachers to teach to the middle of the class like the old days rather than teaching to the bottom because of NCLB. Try allowing teacher to fail students, instead of needing parental permission up until 9th grade. Or you can learn nothing about the education system and just blame the teachers.
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Post by aztecwin on Aug 22, 2012 12:46:37 GMT -8
Judging from the results of American students these days, they are overpaid. But this thread was about doctors and someone brought in teachers into the equation. We are going to have a severe doctor shortage in this country if current things go unchecked. lmao Try allowing teachers to teach rather than feed them watered-down information to pass standardized tests. I bet you do not realize how teachers have very little power over what gets taught in their classes. Try allowing teachers to teach to the middle of the class like the old days rather than teaching to the bottom because of NCLB. Try allowing teacher to fail students, instead of needing parental permission up until 9th grade. Or you can learn nothing about the education system and just blame the teachers. Almost with you on this. You pick out NCLB, when it is only one of many problems. It is not teachers who are at fault!
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Post by tuff on Aug 22, 2012 12:48:20 GMT -8
Judging from the results of American students these days, they are overpaid. But this thread was about doctors and someone brought in teachers into the equation. We are going to have a severe doctor shortage in this country if current things go unchecked. lmao Try allowing teachers to teach rather than feed them watered-down information to pass standardized tests. I bet you do not realize how teachers have very little power over what gets taught in their classes. Try allowing teachers to teach to the middle of the class like the old days rather than teaching to the bottom because of NCLB. Try allowing teacher to fail students, instead of needing parental permission up until 9th grade. Or you can learn nothing about the education system and just blame the teachers. Teachers unions have ruined the teaching profession in public schools. That's why private schools are flourishing. And, private school teachers are paid less. What you desribed above I whole heartedly agree with, Stoner. I also think kids need discipline. Public schools won't do it, private schools do. Until unions are taken out of the public school system and some sort of merit pay is approved, it will be the same old stuff. P>S> I have 3 neices who are grade school teachers. We get into battles.
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Post by AlwaysAnAztec on Aug 22, 2012 13:01:53 GMT -8
lmao Try allowing teachers to teach rather than feed them watered-down information to pass standardized tests. I bet you do not realize how teachers have very little power over what gets taught in their classes. Try allowing teachers to teach to the middle of the class like the old days rather than teaching to the bottom because of NCLB. Try allowing teacher to fail students, instead of needing parental permission up until 9th grade. Or you can learn nothing about the education system and just blame the teachers. Teachers unions have ruined the teaching profession in public schools. That's why private schools are flourishing. And, private school teachers are paid less. What you described above I whole heartedly agree with, Stoner. I also think kids need discipline. Public schools won't do it, private schools do. Until unions are taken out of the public school system and some sort of merit pay is approved, it will be the same old stuff. P>S> I have 3 neices who are grade school teachers. We get into battles. You are completely mistaken if you think that the unions are the ones keeping teachers from disciplining the students. They are the ones that are protecting the teachers from being fired when they raise their voice to little Tommy in class after he has run amok, turned over desks, etc. The primary fault with students not learning lies with the parent and the student themselves. That's not to say that there are not bad teachers because there are. There are also teachers that are completely burned out and should take a break from the classroom for a semester or two. Colleges have sabbaticals why not regular schools.
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Post by sdsustoner on Aug 22, 2012 13:32:47 GMT -8
lmao Try allowing teachers to teach rather than feed them watered-down information to pass standardized tests. I bet you do not realize how teachers have very little power over what gets taught in their classes. Try allowing teachers to teach to the middle of the class like the old days rather than teaching to the bottom because of NCLB. Try allowing teacher to fail students, instead of needing parental permission up until 9th grade. Or you can learn nothing about the education system and just blame the teachers. Teachers unions have ruined the teaching profession in public schools. That's why private schools are flourishing. And, private school teachers are paid less. What you desribed above I whole heartedly agree with, Stoner. I also think kids need discipline. Public schools won't do it, private schools do. Until unions are taken out of the public school system and some sort of merit pay is approved, it will be the same old stuff. P>S> I have 3 neices who are grade school teachers. We get into battles. Unions are not to fault. To a point. They keep and protect teachers who no longer want to be there over younger ones who want to due to tenure. Tenure also makes it hard to fire a teacher who sucks. Beyond that unions like AlwaysAnAztec stated are very useful. The reason why public school teachers cannot discipline is because admin will not let them. Public schools depend on per-pupil funding. So any administrative action leads to points, which may lead to expulsion, which leads to less money for the school. The worst thing is the kids know and abuse this. Also, I'm all for merit pay.
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