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Post by aztecron on Mar 19, 2012 9:10:28 GMT -8
I still think it takes scouting and development to find and produce players from within other organizations minor league systems. So they count in my opinion as they still need to be developed. I guess you could, but he didnt spend any time in our minor league system. When he got here, he was plugged into a starting role. So why would you count that? I'm not looking for shortcuts, I am looking for guys that are drafted and developed into solid MLB regulars...because we have been missing that consistently for years. If the Padres are to contend for the long haul, that's what they have to do. Trading for reclamation projects, and trading stars for prospects, can only get you so far. No argument from me on the past behavior of the Padres. I don't think Maybin was a reclamation project, because the Padres stuck with him and worked with him everyday to improve his play. That didn't happen in Florida. Do you think the Marlins would like him back, now? Hell yeah they would. There CF position is a cavern and had been filled with mere journeymen. Now, finally, they have a converted infielder playing CF this spring in Bonifacio. I'm just saying it takes development of players whether internally or externally. The Tigers and Marlins failed to get this production out of Maybin while Hoyer's scouts saw the potential in Maybin. Then brought him in and helped develop him into the player we see today. That has to count for something, I think. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2012 12:00:24 GMT -8
I guess you could, but he didnt spend any time in our minor league system. When he got here, he was plugged into a starting role. So why would you count that? I'm not looking for shortcuts, I am looking for guys that are drafted and developed into solid MLB regulars...because we have been missing that consistently for years. If the Padres are to contend for the long haul, that's what they have to do. Trading for reclamation projects, and trading stars for prospects, can only get you so far. No argument from me on the past behavior of the Padres. I don't think Maybin was a reclamation project, because the Padres stuck with him and worked with him everyday to improve his play. That didn't happen in Florida. Do you think the Marlins would like him back, now? Hell yeah they would. There CF position is a cavern and had been filled with mere journeymen. Now, finally, they have a converted infielder playing CF this spring in Bonifacio. I'm just saying it takes development of players whether internally or externally. The Tigers and Marlins failed to get this production out of Maybin while Hoyer's scouts saw the potential in Maybin. Then brought him in and helped develop him into the player we see today. That has to count for something, I think. Yes, and I liked the trade even at the time (for Mujica? Hell yes). My point was only that he wasnt drafted & developed by the Padres, and we need to have success in this department. |
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Post by AztecBill on Mar 20, 2012 15:19:08 GMT -8
If the Pads aren't going to have any 30 HR guys they need a couple .300 type guys (and that shouldn't be hard to do at Petco). They don't seem to have either, making for a rather lackluster offense, with a poor rotation (just called the worst in the majors by one preview). While the organization is showing some commitment there is still a ton of work to do. If they can develop guys who can hit 30 HRs (and it can be done, even with home games at Petco - their opponents hit plenty of HRs there) and a couple guys at or around .300 - AND they keep them long term then I'll get excited about the team again. Sandy Alderson really turned me off from Padres baseball. It wasn't about being smart (they're being a lot smarter now), it was about being cheap. I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. |
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Mar 20, 2012 20:27:46 GMT -8
If the Pads aren't going to have any 30 HR guys they need a couple .300 type guys (and that shouldn't be hard to do at Petco). They don't seem to have either, making for a rather lackluster offense, with a poor rotation (just called the worst in the majors by one preview). While the organization is showing some commitment there is still a ton of work to do. If they can develop guys who can hit 30 HRs (and it can be done, even with home games at Petco - their opponents hit plenty of HRs there) and a couple guys at or around .300 - AND they keep them long term then I'll get excited about the team again. Sandy Alderson really turned me off from Padres baseball. It wasn't about being smart (they're being a lot smarter now), it was about being cheap. I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. I was just passing on what I heard on the radio. It was mentioned that one baseball preview said the Padres had the worst rotation in the majors. The hosts didn't agree, but they did pass along that interesting tid-bit of information. I can't remember which preview they said it was (whether print or TV), but it was a legit preview. That doesn't make that assessment correct, but I can't imagine that the Padres staff will be in the upper half of the league. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2012 20:40:12 GMT -8
I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. Hold everything... With all due respect Bill, you always cite splits when rationalizing the Padres' s#!++y hitting. So tell us is our rotation really "one of the best," or is it only one of the best at Moorsad's house? Also, quick without thinking, name three worse rotations than the Padres. The rotation for 2011 was pretty solid both at home, and on the road. #3 at home for team ERA. #6 on the road #3 OVERALL espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/34/league/nl |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2012 20:41:32 GMT -8
I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. I was just passing on what I heard on the radio. It was mentioned that one baseball preview said the Padres had the worst rotation in the majors. The hosts didn't agree, but they did pass along that interesting tid-bit of information. I can't remember which preview they said it was (whether print or TV), but it was a legit preview. That doesn't make that assessment correct, but I can't imagine that the Padres staff will be in the upper half of the league. Things can change, but based on last season's stats, you would be wrong. Offense is by far a bigger concern. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2012 20:47:18 GMT -8
If the Pads aren't going to have any 30 HR guys they need a couple .300 type guys (and that shouldn't be hard to do at Petco). They don't seem to have either, making for a rather lackluster offense, with a poor rotation (just called the worst in the majors by one preview). While the organization is showing some commitment there is still a ton of work to do. If they can develop guys who can hit 30 HRs (and it can be done, even with home games at Petco - their opponents hit plenty of HRs there) and a couple guys at or around .300 - AND they keep them long term then I'll get excited about the team again. Sandy Alderson really turned me off from Padres baseball. It wasn't about being smart (they're being a lot smarter now), it was about being cheap. I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. I'd expect Volquez has a rotation spot also. |
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Post by AztecBill on Mar 21, 2012 9:51:05 GMT -8
Hold everything... With all due respect Bill, you always cite splits when rationalizing the Padres' s#!++y hitting. So tell us is our rotation really "one of the best," or is it only one of the best at Moorsad's house? Also, quick without thinking, name three worse rotations than the Padres. The rotation for 2011 was pretty solid both at home, and on the road. #3 at home for team ERA. #6 on the road #3 OVERALL espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/34/league/nlAnd that is without pitching against the Padres or at Petco Park  11% of the Dodgers, Giants, and Arizona road games are against the Padres at Petco Park. Since all 3 are only a few tenths of a run better than the Padres, that could be the difference. |
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Post by AztecBill on Mar 21, 2012 10:05:41 GMT -8
I throw the bull$#!+ flag. I can't believe any preview would call the Padres rotation the "worst" in baseball. With Dustin Moseley, Cory Luebke, Tim Stauffer, and Clayton Richard we have 4 starters with 2011 ERA's that average 3.50 and all four's ERA was below the NL average for starting pitching ERA - 3.95. The Padres also have many good options for the other starter and enough others to possibly knock one of the 4 mentioned out of their spot. The Padres are far far from the worst rotation in baseball. Their rotation will probably be among the best. I'd expect Volquez has a rotation spot also. It will be interesting to see what he does this year. The Padres seem convinced he will come back from TJS and pitch close to where he would project a few years ago. At 25 years old pitching for Cinn he threw 196 innings with a 3.21 ERA. He also had a very good 206 Ks in 10 less innings. There were only 5 pitchers, in the NL last year, with more Ks than he had in 2008. And only one of them had 10+ more Ks than IP like Volquez did. If he comes back to form, he could be an ace. He is only 28 years old now. |
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Mar 22, 2012 5:49:43 GMT -8
Hold everything... With all due respect Bill, you always cite splits when rationalizing the Padres' s#!++y hitting. So tell us is our rotation really "one of the best," or is it only one of the best at Moorsad's house? Also, quick without thinking, name three worse rotations than the Padres. The rotation for 2011 was pretty solid both at home, and on the road. #3 at home for team ERA. #6 on the road #3 OVERALL espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/34/league/nlThat may be true, but this (2012) is a very different rotation, is it not? |
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Mar 22, 2012 5:51:38 GMT -8
I'd expect Volquez has a rotation spot also. It will be interesting to see what he does this year. The Padres seem convinced he will come back from TJS and pitch close to where he would project a few years ago. At 25 years old pitching for Cinn he threw 196 innings with a 3.21 ERA. He also had a very good 206 Ks in 10 less innings. There were only 5 pitchers, in the NL last year, with more Ks than he had in 2008. And only one of them had 10+ more Ks than IP like Volquez did. If he comes back to form, he could be an ace. He is only 28 years old now. But the guy hasn't shown yet that he's come back from that injury. Some guys never make it back. Some injuries permanently affect the player. I hope this isn't the case with Volquez, but has there been any indication that he will even be 80% of what he was in 2008? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2012 6:14:04 GMT -8
That may be true, but this (2012) is a very different rotation, is it not? No. Not entirely. |
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Post by aztecron on Mar 22, 2012 8:24:58 GMT -8
That may be true, but this (2012) is a very different rotation, is it not? 3/5 of our rotation is back from last year. All three of them had good years. Volquez is in the year after TJ surgery where it all comes together. Not to mention Luebke is on everyone's list to absolutely blow up this year. I like where we're going at this point. |
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