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Post by sdcoug on Sept 18, 2020 11:54:11 GMT -8
I am still interested to hear why it is so important to kick SJSU out of the MWC. I can think of two good reasons why they should be retained; both deal with location. First, flying to San Jose is easy and does not involve an added bus trip. Second, that city is at our altitude. Anybody need clarification on that point? I think the Spartans have been making progress. I believe they won 5 games in FB last year, including winning at Arkansas. Their basketball team has likewise been a bit better. I understand that they lost a lot of good players who, if they had stayed with the program, would have helped them win a few more games in 2019/2020. With good recruiting, they should be able to retain players. Anyway, if we are going to kick anyone out of the conference, let's consider dumping Wyoming and Air Force.Wyoming should be an obvious target. They have not done much lately, and have not moved their campus one foot closer to sea level. As for Air Force, I wonder how many fans are aware that they benefit from having a prep school that gives HS grads an extra year to get ready for the Academy and the Academy's sports team. And, don't forget, Colorado Springs is not exactly a low altitude location. AzWm If we were to boot anyone IMO it would be Hawaii. Doubt we'd want to cut any schools who play all sports, and AF is usually among the top 2 or 3 in the MWC in the final Directors Cup standings (overall competition across all sports).
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Post by zurac315 on Sept 18, 2020 14:12:32 GMT -8
I find it kind of funny that some Aztec fans are criticizing San Jose State. How long were we terrible in football? In basketball? Sure, San Jose State faces some long odds. I do remember the days when they beat Stanford fairly regularly. I also remember the days, which could return, when people were probably wondering what the Aztecs brought to the WAC other than victories for BYU.
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Post by FULL_MONTY on Sept 18, 2020 14:21:18 GMT -8
Yes, SJSU sucks at both hoops and football right now. However, if they were to get some better funding, hire some decent coaches and give them a few years, I bet the programs could be turned around simply due to location. They could get a lot of local talent that can't get into Cal or Stanford or that simply goes under the radar of other G5 schools. I agree. They're already getting the funding, and they're significantly improving their football stadium with the remodel & addition of the Athletics Center. Those could be game changers for them. They were much improved last year, and although they lost their QB they're trending in the right direction. They were a bowl team just 5 years ago, and if UNR doesn't beat them with a last second FG or if they don't throw a goal line INT in the final minute vs. UNLV last year they would have been bowl eligible yet again, and not far away from being 4-4 in conference. They also took Hawaii to the wire losing by 2. They're not the worst FB program in the conference. Not even close. Had they not had to can Wojcik their basketball team may already have turned around with Clarke, Brown & even Wellage more likely to stick around. They had a pretty decent team in 2017. That sent them on a spiral. SJSU also brings access into the largest market as well, which is good for TV & recruiting purposes. Having another Cali state school isn't a bad thing either. They bring down the SOS for football and basketball, but every league had bottom feeders. It seems to be their lot. What concerns me, is that they did have a few seasons in football of note, and the community did not respond. As for the market, I doubt any of the networks think SJSU provides any eye balls in that MSA. I would have to think that what plagues their attendance plagues their tv viewership. They may be the 9th and maybe 11th option in the market. I don't know how the SJ Quakes and SMC Gael's basketball lines up in the Bay Area. GS Warriors SF 49ers Raiders (whether there or not) SF Giants Oakland A's Stanford Cal SJ Sharks I just don't think there is enough oxygen for SJSU sports, even if they were decent or excellent.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 15:25:39 GMT -8
I am still interested to hear why it is so important to kick SJSU out of the MWC. I can think of two good reasons why they should be retained; both deal with location. First, flying to San Jose is easy and does not involve an added bus trip. Second, that city is at our altitude. Anybody need clarification on that point? I think the Spartans have been making progress. I believe they won 5 games in FB last year, including winning at Arkansas. Their basketball team has likewise been a bit better. I understand that they lost a lot of good players who, if they had stayed with the program, would have helped them win a few more games in 2019/2020. With good recruiting, they should be able to retain players. Anyway, if we are going to kick anyone out of the conference, let's consider dumping Wyoming and Air Force. Wyoming should be an obvious target. They have not done much lately, and have not moved their campus one foot closer to sea level. As for Air Force, I wonder how many fans are aware that they benefit from having a prep school that gives HS grads an extra year to get ready for the Academy and the Academy's sports team. And, don't forget, Colorado Springs is not exactly a low altitude location. AzWm So what should the limit be for altitude in this conference? 5300 feet? (New Mexico) 5000 feet? (CSU) 4500 feet? (USU and Nevada) That leaves 6 schools, all under 3,000 feet.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 15:28:13 GMT -8
I agree. They're already getting the funding, and they're significantly improving their football stadium with the remodel & addition of the Athletics Center. Those could be game changers for them. They were much improved last year, and although they lost their QB they're trending in the right direction. They were a bowl team just 5 years ago, and if UNR doesn't beat them with a last second FG or if they don't throw a goal line INT in the final minute vs. UNLV last year they would have been bowl eligible yet again, and not far away from being 4-4 in conference. They also took Hawaii to the wire losing by 2. They're not the worst FB program in the conference. Not even close. Had they not had to can Wojcik their basketball team may already have turned around with Clarke, Brown & even Wellage more likely to stick around. They had a pretty decent team in 2017. That sent them on a spiral. SJSU also brings access into the largest market as well, which is good for TV & recruiting purposes. Having another Cali state school isn't a bad thing either. They bring down the SOS for football and basketball, but every league had bottom feeders. It seems to be their lot. What concerns me, is that they did have a few seasons in football of note, and the community did not respond. As for the market, I doubt any of the networks think SJSU provides any eye balls in that MSA. I would have to think that what plagues their attendance plagues their tv viewership. They may be the 9th and maybe 11th option in the market. I don't know how the SJ Quakes and SMC Gael's basketball lines up in the Bay Area. GS Warriors SF 49ers Raiders (whether there or not) SF Giants Oakland A's Stanford Cal SJ Sharks I just don't think there is enough oxygen for SJSU sports, even if they were decent or excellent. Sounds similar to a certain NFL team who played here for 56 years that moved to LA.
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Post by obboy13 on Sept 18, 2020 16:01:11 GMT -8
Can you explain why you believe SJSU sports programs are not more in line with Big West/Big Sky programs? And can you explain what SJSU brings to the MWC? I thought about dropping a smiley face after that post, but decided against it. Didn't think I needed to. I guess I did. It was funny. Not sure how that gets missed in a one sentence post, but there it is.
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Post by FULL_MONTY on Sept 18, 2020 16:28:06 GMT -8
They bring down the SOS for football and basketball, but every league had bottom feeders. It seems to be their lot. What concerns me, is that they did have a few seasons in football of note, and the community did not respond. As for the market, I doubt any of the networks think SJSU provides any eye balls in that MSA. I would have to think that what plagues their attendance plagues their tv viewership. They may be the 9th and maybe 11th option in the market. I don't know how the SJ Quakes and SMC Gael's basketball lines up in the Bay Area. GS Warriors SF 49ers Raiders (whether there or not) SF Giants Oakland A's Stanford Cal SJ Sharks I just don't think there is enough oxygen for SJSU sports, even if they were decent or excellent. Sounds similar to a certain NFL team who played here for 56 years that moved to LA. If you thought it was tough in city with a MLB team and NFL team, imagine being in a market with 2 NFL Teams (1 going forward) 2 MLB Teams 1 NBA Team 1 NHL Team 1 MLS Team and then add in other DI schools Stanford Cal SMC USF Santa Clara I wish them the best, but If you had to pick a market to have an NCAA program, the Bay Area would be the last place.
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Post by AztecWilliam on Sept 18, 2020 16:33:58 GMT -8
I am still interested to hear why it is so important to kick SJSU out of the MWC. I can think of two good reasons why they should be retained; both deal with location. First, flying to San Jose is easy and does not involve an added bus trip. Second, that city is at our altitude. Anybody need clarification on that point? I think the Spartans have been making progress. I believe they won 5 games in FB last year, including winning at Arkansas. Their basketball team has likewise been a bit better. I understand that they lost a lot of good players who, if they had stayed with the program, would have helped them win a few more games in 2019/2020. With good recruiting, they should be able to retain players. Anyway, if we are going to kick anyone out of the conference, let's consider dumping Wyoming and Air Force. Wyoming should be an obvious target. They have not done much lately, and have not moved their campus one foot closer to sea level. As for Air Force, I wonder how many fans are aware that they benefit from having a prep school that gives HS grads an extra year to get ready for the Academy and the Academy's sports team. And, don't forget, Colorado Springs is not exactly a low altitude location. AzWm So what should the limit be for altitude in this conference? 5300 feet? (New Mexico) 5000 feet? (CSU) 4500 feet? (USU and Nevada) That leaves 6 schools, all under 3,000 feet. Three thousand feet sounds about right. Seriously, though, altitude is just one factor. I would love to see a conference without all high altitude schools. That will probably not happen unless we are invited to join a different conference. AzWm
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Post by sdcoug on Sept 18, 2020 17:02:11 GMT -8
I agree. They're already getting the funding, and they're significantly improving their football stadium with the remodel & addition of the Athletics Center. Those could be game changers for them. They were much improved last year, and although they lost their QB they're trending in the right direction. They were a bowl team just 5 years ago, and if UNR doesn't beat them with a last second FG or if they don't throw a goal line INT in the final minute vs. UNLV last year they would have been bowl eligible yet again, and not far away from being 4-4 in conference. They also took Hawaii to the wire losing by 2. They're not the worst FB program in the conference. Not even close. Had they not had to can Wojcik their basketball team may already have turned around with Clarke, Brown & even Wellage more likely to stick around. They had a pretty decent team in 2017. That sent them on a spiral. SJSU also brings access into the largest market as well, which is good for TV & recruiting purposes. Having another Cali state school isn't a bad thing either. They bring down the SOS for football and basketball, but every league had bottom feeders. It seems to be their lot. What concerns me, is that they did have a few seasons in football of note, and the community did not respond. As for the market, I doubt any of the networks think SJSU provides any eye balls in that MSA. I would have to think that what plagues their attendance plagues their tv viewership. They may be the 9th and maybe 11th option in the market. I don't know how the SJ Quakes and SMC Gael's basketball lines up in the Bay Area. GS Warriors SF 49ers Raiders (whether there or not) SF Giants Oakland A's Stanford Cal SJ Sharks I just don't think there is enough oxygen for SJSU sports, even if they were decent or excellent. Again, they are upgrading their football program SIGNIFICANTLY with the stadium & athletic center. They've had success recently, including just a few years ago. Massey had them 101 overall last year, which is AHEAD of CSU, UNLV & New Mexico. THEY weren't the ones dragging us down. Hoops is a bigger challenge right now, but like I mentioned Wojcik had the trending up before he "resigned" (but really was forced to leave). They were better than both AF & UNLV in 2017. Once they finish with the football stadium remodels hopefully they can address basketball. But they're located in a very good recruiting market. As for the market, their ratings are less of an issue than the fact the MWC has access to that market. Not too long ago SDSU & SJSU were the 2 teams which CBS picked 1st more often because of their market sizes. Back when they used to pay out bonuses for being on ESPN both would get among the lowest bonus payouts because CBSSN had already picked them. Its the main reason they changed to a format to where they now split the bonus pool (after Boise gets their stupid cut). And again, playing in the Bay Area allows you to piggyback recruiting visits, attending Friday night games & to bring recruits to the game, something you can't do if you're not playing in the Bay Area every other year. The bottom line, the upside of having SJSU be competitive is much higher than many of the other programs in the conference. It wasn't that long ago that SDSU was a "sleeping giant". Not saying SJSU will get there, but they have a lot more money from donors & if Prioleau can build any momentum & if the football continues to trend up that's only very good for the conference because the potential to invest further in those programs only gets higher.
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Post by AzTex on Sept 18, 2020 17:21:30 GMT -8
I am still interested to hear why it is so important to kick SJSU out of the MWC. I can think of two good reasons why they should be retained; both deal with location. First, flying to San Jose is easy and does not involve an added bus trip. Second, that city is at our altitude. Anybody need clarification on that point? I think the Spartans have been making progress. I believe they won 5 games in FB last year, including winning at Arkansas. Their basketball team has likewise been a bit better. I understand that they lost a lot of good players who, if they had stayed with the program, would have helped them win a few more games in 2019/2020. With good recruiting, they should be able to retain players. Anyway, if we are going to kick anyone out of the conference, let's consider dumping Wyoming and Air Force. Wyoming should be an obvious target. They have not done much lately, and have not moved their campus one foot closer to sea level. As for Air Force, I wonder how many fans are aware that they benefit from having a prep school that gives HS grads an extra year to get ready for the Academy and the Academy's sports team. And, don't forget, Colorado Springs is not exactly a low altitude location. AzWm SJSU has been good in the past, even if it's not the near past. No reason they can't be good again. After all, we were pretty terrible for many years before Fisher and Hoke/Long.
Add my vote to getting rid of Wyoming. Their location alone should be reason enough to get them out of the league. If the altitude wasn't enough, the problems getting there should cinch it. Remember the horrible plane trip that took 2 planes and an overnight stay. Ask anyone who's been on the bus from Colorado over the mountains in the snow to get to Laramie.
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Post by AzTex on Sept 18, 2020 17:25:38 GMT -8
I am still interested to hear why it is so important to kick SJSU out of the MWC. I can think of two good reasons why they should be retained; both deal with location. First, flying to San Jose is easy and does not involve an added bus trip. Second, that city is at our altitude. Anybody need clarification on that point? I think the Spartans have been making progress. I believe they won 5 games in FB last year, including winning at Arkansas. Their basketball team has likewise been a bit better. I understand that they lost a lot of good players who, if they had stayed with the program, would have helped them win a few more games in 2019/2020. With good recruiting, they should be able to retain players. Anyway, if we are going to kick anyone out of the conference, let's consider dumping Wyoming and Air Force. Wyoming should be an obvious target. They have not done much lately, and have not moved their campus one foot closer to sea level. As for Air Force, I wonder how many fans are aware that they benefit from having a prep school that gives HS grads an extra year to get ready for the Academy and the Academy's sports team. And, don't forget, Colorado Springs is not exactly a low altitude location. AzWm So what should the limit be for altitude in this conference? 5300 feet? (New Mexico) 5000 feet? (CSU) 4500 feet? (USU and Nevada) That leaves 6 schools, all under 3,000 feet. Sounds good to me, especially if you include reasonable access from San Diego.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 17:35:58 GMT -8
So what should the limit be for altitude in this conference? 5300 feet? (New Mexico) 5000 feet? (CSU) 4500 feet? (USU and Nevada) That leaves 6 schools, all under 3,000 feet. Sounds good to me, especially if you include reasonable access from San Diego. That makes the conference a bit small. What schools would you add?
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Post by AzTex on Sept 18, 2020 17:55:14 GMT -8
Sounds good to me, especially if you include reasonable access from San Diego. That makes the conference a bit small. What schools would you add? Actually the other schools you mentioned aren't all that bad. I been to games and the altitude didn't really bother me, and I haven't heard any real complaints. USU is the only one that's a little bit of a pain to get to. Long bus ride from Salt Lake City.
But 7,200 feet is just too much when you're coming from sea level.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 18:02:37 GMT -8
That makes the conference a bit small. What schools would you add? Actually the other schools you mentioned aren't all that bad. I been to games and the altitude didn't really bother me, and I haven't heard any real complaints. USU is the only one that's a little bit of a pain to get to. Long bus ride from Salt Lake City. But 7,200 feet is just too much when you're coming from sea level.
Since 2010, we are 3-1 at Laramie, and avenged the game we lost in 2016 by winning the conference championship game in Laramie 2 weeks later. We might b*tch about it, but we still win.
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Post by missiontrails on Sept 18, 2020 19:47:35 GMT -8
I don't think the MWC should get rid of any of those schools - SJSU, Wyoming, Air Force. They all belong here. However WE should get rid of the MWC. Some day, the P5 will recognize what we bring to the table. SDSU West can only help.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 19:54:39 GMT -8
I don't think the MWC should get rid of any of those schools - SJSU, Wyoming, Air Force. They all belong here. However WE should get rid of the MWC. Some day, the G5 will recognize what we bring to the table. SDSU West can only help. I would think you meant P5 and not G5.
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Post by missiontrails on Sept 18, 2020 20:04:36 GMT -8
I don't think the MWC should get rid of any of those schools - SJSU, Wyoming, Air Force. They all belong here. However WE should get rid of the MWC. Some day, the G5 will recognize what we bring to the table. SDSU West can only help. I would think you meant P5 and not G5. Yes I did - stupid Arrogant Bastard Ale! I will fix - thanks.
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Post by aardvark on Sept 18, 2020 20:19:35 GMT -8
I would think you meant P5 and not G5. Yes I did - stupid Arrogant Bastard Ale! I will fix - thanks.
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Post by AzTex on Sept 18, 2020 22:00:26 GMT -8
Actually the other schools you mentioned aren't all that bad. I been to games and the altitude didn't really bother me, and I haven't heard any real complaints. USU is the only one that's a little bit of a pain to get to. Long bus ride from Salt Lake City. But 7,200 feet is just too much when you're coming from sea level.
Since 2010, we are 3-1 at Laramie, and avenged the game we lost in 2016 by winning the conference championship game in Laramie 2 weeks later. We might b*tch about it, but we still win. All true, but I still don't like having to play in Wyoming, football or basketball. I was there the first time we played them in the WAC. Didn't feel well for months afterward. Wasn't a bug, probably more likely altitude sickness. Tough travel to get there, as I've mentioned. Props to the football team to be able of overcome the altitude and weather like they have in recent years.
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