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Post by ptsdthor on Jun 1, 2020 5:56:53 GMT -8
Everyone agrees with the peaceful protests of the crime by the Minneapolis policemen against Mr. Floyd but the protests are being hijacked by professional leftists. When violence, looting and destruction occurs at the hands of the stoked protesters, the outrage of the one crime is diluted by the reality of the new crimes. The extremists are purposefully provoking a response hoping to make this an election issue and the Democrat true believers are being played like a cheap fiddle. Mr. Floyd is nearly forgotten and national politics becomes the primary concern. So predictable. Like when the kook shot Congresswoman Giffords, the MSM narrative became all about Sarah Palin's political advocacy. Just wait to see where this ends up. Bizarro world, I'm sure. Being right here gives me no satisfaction. The extremists have struck and now comes the blaming of the innocent to suit their narrative. The leap from the crime in Minnesota to "Trump caused all this" was pre-ordained by the political ideologues and it is devoid of reason. Similar to the claim that American Imperialism was the cause of the 9/11 attack. It was true for some twisted minds but not true for anyone with any intellectual honesty. False moral equivalencies will abound now. Example - Susan Rice said it was Trump's failt for his treatment of Kaepernick as the cause of the violence. That is as relevant to the looting and violence now as was 9/11 to Bin Laden saying that since US Army infidels trod their boots on the Saudi Arabian Holy Land, they must pay a price for the outrage. If it is a "real" reason, it is as idiotic as it comes. Almost juvenile in the reasoning but you will soon see similar claims wall to wall because, of course, the acceptable "intellectual" premise is that those actually responsible for looting and violence are those who are the least guilty.
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 7:41:26 GMT -8
The most powerful image during all of this, perhaps. No. The image of lawlessness and the reality that the state may not be able to protect you from a violent mob is what most will take from this: (I'm trying to insert an image, but not able to right now!) Politically, the loser in this one is the party that is seen as being closest alined with the rioters. I mean, I guess, but the general image of violence is the same across multiple cities. A dark White House (which NEVER happens) is a lot more enduring, for me, anyway. And I've seen Long Beach, Oakland, Atlanta, Minneapolis, San Diego, New York and D.C.
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 7:48:19 GMT -8
Everyone agrees with the peaceful protests of the crime by the Minneapolis policemen against Mr. Floyd but the protests are being hijacked by professional leftists. When violence, looting and destruction occurs at the hands of the stoked protesters, the outrage of the one crime is diluted by the reality of the new crimes. The extremists are purposefully provoking a response hoping to make this an election issue and the Democrat true believers are being played like a cheap fiddle. Mr. Floyd is nearly forgotten and national politics becomes the primary concern. So predictable. Like when the kook shot Congresswoman Giffords, the MSM narrative became all about Sarah Palin's political advocacy. Just wait to see where this ends up. Bizarro world, I'm sure. Being right here gives me no satisfaction. The extremists have struck and now comes the blaming of the innocent to suit their narrative. The leap from the crime in Minnesota to "Trump caused all this" was pre-ordained by the political ideologues and it is devoid of reason. Similar to the claim that American Imperialism was the cause of the 9/11 attack. It was true for some twisted minds but not true for anyone with any intellectual honesty. False moral equivalencies will abound now. Example - Susan Rice said it was Trump's failt for his treatment of Kaepernick as the cause of the violence. That is as relevant to the looting and violence now as was 9/11 to Bin Laden saying that since US Army infidels trod their boots on the Saudi Arabian Holy Land, they must pay a price for the outrage. If it is a "real" reason, it is as idiotic as it comes. Almost juvenile in the reasoning but you will soon see similar claims wall to wall because, of course, the acceptable "intellectual" premise is that those actually responsible for looting and violence are those who are the least guilty. I'm sorry to burst the bubble here, but the fact that social division has been pushed by the president through the denial of peaceful protests is absolutely a part of this. Kaepernick, Eric Reid and athletes across sports were vilified for using their platform under the guise of "disrespecting the military, the flag, the anthem" and everything else unassociated with the root cause. The looting and the "leftists" have zero to do with the systemic racism in America; they are simply opportunists cashing in on a moment when the attention is divided. Cowards who flee when the law shows up.
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Post by ptsdthor on Jun 1, 2020 8:28:24 GMT -8
Being right here gives me no satisfaction. The extremists have struck and now comes the blaming of the innocent to suit their narrative. The leap from the crime in Minnesota to "Trump caused all this" was pre-ordained by the political ideologues and it is devoid of reason. Similar to the claim that American Imperialism was the cause of the 9/11 attack. It was true for some twisted minds but not true for anyone with any intellectual honesty. False moral equivalencies will abound now. Example - Susan Rice said it was Trump's failt for his treatment of Kaepernick as the cause of the violence. That is as relevant to the looting and violence now as was 9/11 to Bin Laden saying that since US Army infidels trod their boots on the Saudi Arabian Holy Land, they must pay a price for the outrage. If it is a "real" reason, it is as idiotic as it comes. Almost juvenile in the reasoning but you will soon see similar claims wall to wall because, of course, the acceptable "intellectual" premise is that those actually responsible for looting and violence are those who are the least guilty. I'm sorry to burst the bubble here, but the fact that social division has been pushed by the president through the denial of peaceful protests is absolutely a part of this. Kaepernick, Eric Reid and athletes across sports were vilified for using their platform under the guise of "disrespecting the military, the flag, the anthem" and everything else unassociated with the root cause. The looting and the "leftists" have zero to do with the systemic racism in America; they are simply opportunists cashing in on a moment when the attention is divided. Cowards who flee when the law shows up. Yes, those who wanted to address systemic racism in it various forms had the entire country in the palm of their hands initially. Now it has devolved into a partisan divide of the left blaming Trump and the rest watching in disgust and all are in no mood to take blame but happy to point it out. If one calls out the criminals and demand appropriate force, the political opportunist cries foul, racism, etc. You can see it coming a mile away. If fact, with the seemingly pervasive and constant claim of "Racist" and "Racism" that the left uses so well against their opponents and the fear of being labeled a racist has caused the police and politicians nationwide to turtle and that severly exacerbates the problem. Trump in the Whitehouse or Trump out of town would have resulted in the same critique. What else comes from the left for Trump but phoney outrage? It is proven, like the Russia Hoax, that they constantly falsely accuse but not one apology. Just more spin.
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Post by ptsdthor on Jun 1, 2020 9:06:42 GMT -8
And regarding Trump being protected by the Secret Service, perhaps Susan Rice and Hillary Clinton warned them about the power of a mere video?
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 9:06:43 GMT -8
I'm sorry to burst the bubble here, but the fact that social division has been pushed by the president through the denial of peaceful protests is absolutely a part of this. Kaepernick, Eric Reid and athletes across sports were vilified for using their platform under the guise of "disrespecting the military, the flag, the anthem" and everything else unassociated with the root cause. The looting and the "leftists" have zero to do with the systemic racism in America; they are simply opportunists cashing in on a moment when the attention is divided. Cowards who flee when the law shows up. Yes, those who wanted to address systemic racism in it various forms had the entire country in the palm of their hands initially. Now it has devolved into a partisan divide of the left blaming Trump and the rest watching in disgust and all are in no mood to take blame but happy to point it out. If one calls out the criminals and demand appropriate force, the political opportunist cries foul, racism, etc. You can see it coming a mile away. If fact, with the seemingly pervasive and constant claim of "Racist" and "Racism" that the left uses so well against their opponents and the fear of being labeled a racist has caused the police and politicians nationwide to turtle and that severly exacerbates the problem. Trump in the Whitehouse or Trump out of town would have resulted in the same critique. What else comes from the left for Trump but phoney outrage? It is proven, like the Russia Hoax, that they constantly falsely accuse but not one apology. Just more spin. Because a lot of it is his fault, he's the president after all, right? He has no idea how to unify the country. His advisors are terrified to let him even speak to the country. He plants seeds of division with racist rhetoric and pushes civil unrest. He called this in 2014, in an interview with Fox News. Almost to a tee, really. This was HIS vision of anarchy and chaos, to make America "great again." But there's more here than meets the eye. This isn't just "Antifa"....there are white nationalist groups causing havoc as well, Minneapolis authorities confirmed this in arrest records. But more than that, to get back to some kind of social justice : You have complicit police departments who have failed the black community by putting officers on the street who should not be carrying a badge and a gun. The examples are everywhere. Tamir Rice, Alton Sterling, George Floyd, Laquan McDonald and the list goes on.
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Post by ptsdthor on Jun 1, 2020 9:28:08 GMT -8
Yes, those who wanted to address systemic racism in it various forms had the entire country in the palm of their hands initially. Now it has devolved into a partisan divide of the left blaming Trump and the rest watching in disgust and all are in no mood to take blame but happy to point it out. If one calls out the criminals and demand appropriate force, the political opportunist cries foul, racism, etc. You can see it coming a mile away. If fact, with the seemingly pervasive and constant claim of "Racist" and "Racism" that the left uses so well against their opponents and the fear of being labeled a racist has caused the police and politicians nationwide to turtle and that severly exacerbates the problem. Trump in the Whitehouse or Trump out of town would have resulted in the same critique. What else comes from the left for Trump but phoney outrage? It is proven, like the Russia Hoax, that they constantly falsely accuse but not one apology. Just more spin. Because a lot of it is his fault, he's the president after all, right? He has no idea how to unify the country. His advisors are terrified to let him even speak to the country. He plants seeds of division with racist rhetoric and pushes civil unrest. He called this in 2014, in an interview with Fox News. Almost to a tee, really. This was HIS vision of anarchy and chaos, to make America "great again." But there's more here than meets the eye. This isn't just "Antifa"....there are white nationalist groups causing havoc as well, Minneapolis authorities confirmed this in arrest records. But more than that, to get back to some kind of social justice : You have complicit police departments who have failed the black community by putting officers on the street who should not be carrying a badge and a gun. The examples are everywhere. Tamir Rice, Alton Sterling, George Floyd, Laquan McDonald and the list goes on. See! Trump's fault and I'm sticking to it. The predictable and ludicrous false moral equivalencies are shameless. Interactions with the police when you are caught in or suspected of criminal activity is inherently dangerous. As racism in police forces is being addressed, more and more policemen are minorities themselves and police brutality by them against blacks (any everyone by the way) still occurs and that is a seeming non-issue. It is all Trump's fault The two Atlanta Police Officers, who were minorities, were fired for tasing two people who were minorities last Saturday. It probably was a case of mistaken identity or false information, or adrenaline, or a recent bad experience by the officers, etc. Not sure but one thing is for sure, Trump had absolutely nothing to do with it.
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 9:43:29 GMT -8
Because a lot of it is his fault, he's the president after all, right? He has no idea how to unify the country. His advisors are terrified to let him even speak to the country. He plants seeds of division with racist rhetoric and pushes civil unrest. He called this in 2014, in an interview with Fox News. Almost to a tee, really. This was HIS vision of anarchy and chaos, to make America "great again." But there's more here than meets the eye. This isn't just "Antifa"....there are white nationalist groups causing havoc as well, Minneapolis authorities confirmed this in arrest records. But more than that, to get back to some kind of social justice : You have complicit police departments who have failed the black community by putting officers on the street who should not be carrying a badge and a gun. The examples are everywhere. Tamir Rice, Alton Sterling, George Floyd, Laquan McDonald and the list goes on. See! Trumps fault and I'm sticking to it. The predictable and ludicrous false moral equivalencies are shameless. Interactions with the police when you are caught in or suspected of criminal activity is inherently dangerous. As racism in police forces is being addressed, more and more policemen are minorities themselves and police brutality by them against blacks (any everyone by the way) still occurs and that is a seeming non-issue. It is all Trump fault The two Atlanta Police Officers, who were minorities, were fired for tasing two people who were minorities last Saturday. It probably was a case of mistaken identity or false information, or adrenaline, or a recent bad experience by the officers, etc. Not sure but one thing is for sure, Trump had absolutely nothing to do with it. It's not a false equivalency, but taking one incident out of dozens IS. I'm not saying this lays entirely at his feet, the root cause is a systemic issue that predates Trump. But at a time when LEADERS lead, a time when UNITY is needed to help the country heal, to get some kind of reassurance, what do we get? "Governors are weak." Other attacking, divisive tweets that inflame, incite and direct violence. Hell, the president was retweeting QAnon yesterday! Is that stable behavior or leadership? Even if you don't directly cause a problem, how you respond to it matters, right? This is what you get with the president. Pettiness. Childish behavior. Division, division, division. THAT is on him, the same it would be on the captain of the Santa Monica FD, if he were to be engaging in the same behavior.
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 9:51:44 GMT -8
Here's an interesting case study : Huntington Beach. You know, the same place I correctly referred to as a long-running epicenter of white nationalism, dating back a LONG time. Here's a tweet side by side : Note the difference?
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Post by 84aztec96 on Jun 1, 2020 10:31:17 GMT -8
Yeah, all those riots that occurred protesting the beach closing were really something. People are still getting the sand out of their shoes....
When you look for something hard enough you just might see it everywhere.....
This is why people get frustrated....
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 10:43:39 GMT -8
Yeah, all those riots that occurred protesting the beach closing were really something. People are still getting the sand out of their shoes.... When you look for something hard enough you just might see it everywhere..... This is why people get frustrated.... I'm able to separate the protests and the privilege.
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Post by DeeMoney on Jun 1, 2020 11:27:23 GMT -8
Here's an interesting case study : Huntington Beach. You know, the same place I correctly referred to as a long-running epicenter of white nationalism, dating back a LONG time. Here's a tweet side by side : Note the difference? Interesting, I wonder if we are not quite isolating all the variables. I don't remember any looting, rioting, or burning of buildings nationwide attached to the Covid-19 protests; so the preemptive use of a police force wouldnt seem to be as necessary. Do you feel that possibly could be somewhat of a justification?
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Post by DeeMoney on Jun 1, 2020 11:36:20 GMT -8
Yes, those who wanted to address systemic racism in it various forms had the entire country in the palm of their hands initially. Now it has devolved into a partisan divide of the left blaming Trump and the rest watching in disgust and all are in no mood to take blame but happy to point it out. If one calls out the criminals and demand appropriate force, the political opportunist cries foul, racism, etc. You can see it coming a mile away. If fact, with the seemingly pervasive and constant claim of "Racist" and "Racism" that the left uses so well against their opponents and the fear of being labeled a racist has caused the police and politicians nationwide to turtle and that severly exacerbates the problem. Trump in the Whitehouse or Trump out of town would have resulted in the same critique. What else comes from the left for Trump but phoney outrage? It is proven, like the Russia Hoax, that they constantly falsely accuse but not one apology. Just more spin. Because a lot of it is his fault, he's the president after all, right? He has no idea how to unify the country. His advisors are terrified to let him even speak to the country. He plants seeds of division with racist rhetoric and pushes civil unrest. He called this in 2014, in an interview with Fox News. Almost to a tee, really. This was HIS vision of anarchy and chaos, to make America "great again." But there's more here than meets the eye. This isn't just "Antifa"....there are white nationalist groups causing havoc as well, Minneapolis authorities confirmed this in arrest records. But more than that, to get back to some kind of social justice : You have complicit police departments who have failed the black community by putting officers on the street who should not be carrying a badge and a gun. The examples are everywhere. Tamir Rice, Alton Sterling, George Floyd, Laquan McDonald and the list goes on. Its funny you write that, there are a number of people, me included, who don't believe its the presidents job to unify or unite. The LA Times had a good piece about this several months back which I will link below. In short, this isnt the job of the president. The best line from it reads as follows: "What are presidents supposed to do amid all the bickering? The answer lies in the job title: They’re supposed to preside over it. The president doesn’t get his or her way; the president gets to either sign off on or veto whatever comes to his desk. After that, the job is to faithfully execute the law." I think the problem is so many people view the president as their leader (see ruler or dictator).Part of that is the media's fault- its easier to sell the narrative lets be angry at one person for all our problems then it is to get people to pay attention to a more nuanced truth. Part of it is presidential power is growing, though nowhere near the level where so many believe it is. But the truth is, the president is there to do a job, and nowhere in the description does it read: unite or unify. www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2019-11-26/presidential-candidates-say-they-will-unite-the-country-but-they-cant
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Post by ptsdthor on Jun 1, 2020 11:41:17 GMT -8
And, of course, those now looting and committing violence will somehow be completely trustworthy with the integrity of the ballot when 112% more ballots than voters (in LA, for example) get mailed out in the fall. . The hope was that Obama was going to help heal past racial tensions yet he only served to make it worse. And the left's willingness to make false cause and effect claims, as seen in the case of the Benghazi raid and the blaming of the video, we see a Trump tweet as somehow now being all powerful and forces otherwise peaceful people into being criminals. How moronic!
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 11:49:39 GMT -8
Brace yourselves.
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Post by DeeMoney on Jun 1, 2020 11:51:09 GMT -8
Uggghhh. As awful as that is, it should hopefully lead to more of a simple criminal trial when it comes
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 11:53:25 GMT -8
Here's an interesting case study : Huntington Beach. You know, the same place I correctly referred to as a long-running epicenter of white nationalism, dating back a LONG time. Here's a tweet side by side : Note the difference? Interesting, I wonder if we are not quite isolating all the variables. I don't remember any looting, rioting, or burning of buildings nationwide attached to the Covid-19 protests; so the preemptive use of a police force wouldnt seem to be as necessary. Do you feel that possibly could be somewhat of a justification? Preemptive? There have been multiple examples of the police firing on peaceful protestors, without real provocation. I would say any time you have elements of division and racial fuel in the fire, you're going to have situations that are extremely volatile by default. Racial bias and white privilege absolutely plays a role here.
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 11:54:30 GMT -8
Uggghhh. As awful as that is, it should hopefully lead to more of a simple criminal trial when it comes The fact that the Hennapin County medical examiner came to the exact opposite conclusion is....troublesome?
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Post by aztecryan on Jun 1, 2020 11:58:04 GMT -8
Because a lot of it is his fault, he's the president after all, right? He has no idea how to unify the country. His advisors are terrified to let him even speak to the country. He plants seeds of division with racist rhetoric and pushes civil unrest. He called this in 2014, in an interview with Fox News. Almost to a tee, really. This was HIS vision of anarchy and chaos, to make America "great again." But there's more here than meets the eye. This isn't just "Antifa"....there are white nationalist groups causing havoc as well, Minneapolis authorities confirmed this in arrest records. But more than that, to get back to some kind of social justice : You have complicit police departments who have failed the black community by putting officers on the street who should not be carrying a badge and a gun. The examples are everywhere. Tamir Rice, Alton Sterling, George Floyd, Laquan McDonald and the list goes on. Its funny you write that, there are a number of people, me included, who don't believe its the presidents job to unify or unite. The LA Times had a good piece about this several months back which I will link below. In short, this isnt the job of the president. The best line from it reads as follows: "What are presidents supposed to do amid all the bickering? The answer lies in the job title: They’re supposed to preside over it. The president doesn’t get his or her way; the president gets to either sign off on or veto whatever comes to his desk. After that, the job is to faithfully execute the law." I think the problem is so many people view the president as their leader (see ruler or dictator).Part of that is the media's fault- its easier to sell the narrative lets be angry at one person for all our problems then it is to get people to pay attention to a more nuanced truth. Part of it is presidential power is growing, though nowhere near the level where so many believe it is. But the truth is, the president is there to do a job, and nowhere in the description does it read: unite or unify. www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2019-11-26/presidential-candidates-say-they-will-unite-the-country-but-they-cantI couldn't disagree more from this position, unfortunately. Yes, there are nuances and layers to this issue that run deeply in our culture. If it isn't the president's job to lead, then at a minimum it has to be the integrity of the office to not inflame matters further.
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Post by DeeMoney on Jun 1, 2020 12:05:18 GMT -8
Its funny you write that, there are a number of people, me included, who don't believe its the presidents job to unify or unite. The LA Times had a good piece about this several months back which I will link below. In short, this isnt the job of the president. The best line from it reads as follows: "What are presidents supposed to do amid all the bickering? The answer lies in the job title: They’re supposed to preside over it. The president doesn’t get his or her way; the president gets to either sign off on or veto whatever comes to his desk. After that, the job is to faithfully execute the law." I think the problem is so many people view the president as their leader (see ruler or dictator).Part of that is the media's fault- its easier to sell the narrative lets be angry at one person for all our problems then it is to get people to pay attention to a more nuanced truth. Part of it is presidential power is growing, though nowhere near the level where so many believe it is. But the truth is, the president is there to do a job, and nowhere in the description does it read: unite or unify. www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2019-11-26/presidential-candidates-say-they-will-unite-the-country-but-they-cantI couldn't disagree more from this position, unfortunately. Yes, there are nuances and layers to this issue that run deeply in our culture. If it isn't the president's job to lead, then at a minimum it has to be the integrity of the office to not inflame matters further. I agree that the president shouldn't inflame matters. But the job of the president isnt to bring everyone together, to unite or unify us. Thats a scary proposition if you ask me. I mean case in point is our discussion here. We are not united in our opinion.....good. I doubt we will ever be unified in our opinion, thats okay; we don't need to be unified we just need to respect each other's rights to our opinions. Now, please note I am writing that as a general opinion, and not specifically related to this instance (for which you could argue the cops did not respect people's rights).
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