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Post by bolt1963 on Dec 31, 2016 9:13:51 GMT -8
I understand you are repeating what he told you. I am not a developer either. I am just going off what Colorado State's stadium cost and asking if you think it reasonable one in San Diego would cost half that. Not putting you on the spot - just asking for what you really think. As for sharing a NFL stadium. Let me make it clear - I agree SDSU would be better off with your own digs - especially if you can find the money. But I believe when it comes down to $$, it would be much more cost effective to share a stadium. I disagree SDSU would get screwed with concessions, parking, advertising, etc. SDSU would have major skin in the game - they are negotiating for a position of strength. This would be nothing like sharing the Q. Not from a financial perspective and not from an atmosphere. This would be a football only venue with modern day technology. Everything is LED now and can be changed with a flip of a switch. Stadium cost projections for 30-35K expandable stadium are about $275-300 mil. SDSU would be better off partnering with MLS over NFL. NFL stadium is WAY to big for SDSU. A 30-35K stadium (expandable to 45-50K in the future) with MLS would be a better option. If by some chance a miracle occurs and we get a P5 invite we could buy out the MLS from their portion and expand the stadium to 45-50K. I don't believe SDSU wants or needs to partner with the NFL unless it was their only option which I know it is not. Go SDSU WEST! Go AZTECS! Fictional MLS franchise fighting with multiple cities for one potential spot years down the road vs. the NFL. Then you're going to buy them out and make them leave with a power 5 invite? Man, I get the want for the beat case scenario. Really do. But one is a sure thing where the other needs so many many things to break SDSU way and even if they do, we're looking too far in the future. Qualcomm needs to be razed long before that can all play out.
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Post by SD Johnny on Dec 31, 2016 9:43:15 GMT -8
Partnering with the NFL is a sure thing? Let's first see if we are still having this conversation in January 16.
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Post by bolt1963 on Dec 31, 2016 10:16:54 GMT -8
Partnering with the NFL is a sure thing? Let's first see if we are still having this conversation in January 16. Sometimes I feel like I am speaking a second language here. Yes, if the Chargers, Aztecs and City agreed to build a stadium - that is a sure thing vs. a fictional MLS franchise and acquiring the MV land in the first place.
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Post by AztecWilliam on Dec 31, 2016 10:17:26 GMT -8
This makes sense to me. Sure, we would like to have a 45,000 seat stadium from the start, but it's not impossible that 32K to 35K could be done with the understanding that expansion possibilities must be part of the basic design. I don't have the expertise to judge what is and is not possible, but my guess (perhaps I should say wild guess) is that if we can afford a 32K stadium, we probably can figure a way to afford a 40K stadium. The question is. how big a stadium will Aztec football ultimately need? I think 50,000 is a good figure. A second, and not insignificant question is this: How many seats do the bowl people require to keep the two local bowls going? My (equally wild) guess is that 50,000 might work for them, but only barely, and with the understanding that expansion would be forthcoming in a couple of years. And there is the rub; our practical maximum seating, say 50K, is really too small for the bowls, and therefore SDSU and the bowl committee would be at loggerheads. It would be nice to see the two parties work together, but I'm not sure that can be done. The needs of the two parties are rather different. AzWm SDSU doesn't need a 50K stadium; that is WAY too big; 35K-45K is a much better number. 40K with ability to expand is the sweet spot IMO. Poinsettia could be held in that and possibly even the Holiday if 10K temporary seating could be brought in. SDSU certainly is not ready for a 50K or NFL size stadium and probably never will unless a miracle occurs and we get into the PAC 12. Go SDSU WEST! Go AZTECS! We could do, perhaps for a couple of years, with 32K, but that is really a bit on the small side. Better to start with 40K or close to that number. As for 50K, I see that as a possible maximum number if, repeat IF, the program continues to improve and attendance of 40,000 plus becomes routine. I would hate to see an undefeated Aztec team host a decent P5 school and have to turn away thousands of fans because we are playing in a 35k seat stadium. In that scenario, crowds of 45K to 50K could well happen. But, as I said, that is a best case scenario perhaps 5 to 10 years from now. As for the bowls, even the Poinsettia Bowl would want seating for at least 40K. The Holiday Bowl? Fifty-thousand would seem to be a bare, bare minimum. That's why I say that the bowl organization's needs and our needs are somewhat at odds with each other. As for sharing a stadium with the NFL? Forget it!!!!! AzWm
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Post by AzTex on Dec 31, 2016 10:56:25 GMT -8
SDSU doesn't need a 50K stadium; that is WAY too big; 35K-45K is a much better number. 40K with ability to expand is the sweet spot IMO. Poinsettia could be held in that and possibly even the Holiday if 10K temporary seating could be brought in. SDSU certainly is not ready for a 50K or NFL size stadium and probably never will unless a miracle occurs and we get into the PAC 12. Go SDSU WEST! Go AZTECS! We could do, perhaps for a couple of years, with 32K, but that is really a bit on the small side. Better to start with 40K or close to that number. As for 50K, I see that as a possible maximum number if, repeat IF, the program continues to improve and attendance of 40,000 plus becomes routine. I would hate to see an undefeated Aztec team host a decent P5 school and have to turn away thousands of fans because we are playing in a 35k seat stadium. In that scenario, crowds of 45K to 50K could well happen. But, as I said, that is a best case scenario perhaps 5 to 10 years from now. As for the bowls, even the Poinsettia Bowl would want seating for at least 40K. The Holiday Bowl? Fifty-thousand would seem to be a bare, bare minimum. That's why I say that the bowl organization's needs and our needs are somewhat at odds with each other. As for sharing a stadium with the NFL? Forget it!!!!! AzWm If the Chargers leave town and and Aztecs build a 30,000 - 40,000 seat stadium, both bowl games will have only two choices. Downsize and use the Aztec stadium or go out of business. They can't move out of town. We can't build an over-sized stadium for one bowl game per year. There are too many bowl games as it is, so we won't hurt our chances of going to a bowl game somewhere.
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Post by aardvark on Dec 31, 2016 10:58:30 GMT -8
SDSU doesn't need a 50K stadium; that is WAY too big; 35K-45K is a much better number. 40K with ability to expand is the sweet spot IMO. Poinsettia could be held in that and possibly even the Holiday if 10K temporary seating could be brought in. SDSU certainly is not ready for a 50K or NFL size stadium and probably never will unless a miracle occurs and we get into the PAC 12. Go SDSU WEST! Go AZTECS! We could do, perhaps for a couple of years, with 32K, but that is really a bit on the small side. Better to start with 40K or close to that number. As for 50K, I see that as a possible maximum number if, repeat IF, the program continues to improve and attendance of 40,000 plus becomes routine. I would hate to see an undefeated Aztec team host a decent P5 school and have to turn away thousands of fans because we are playing in a 35k seat stadium. In that scenario, crowds of 45K to 50K could well happen. But, as I said, that is a best case scenario perhaps 5 to 10 years from now. As for the bowls, even the Poinsettia Bowl would want seating for at least 40K. The Holiday Bowl? Fifty-thousand would seem to be a bare, bare minimum. That's why I say that the bowl organization's needs and our needs are somewhat at odds with each other. As for sharing a stadium with the NFL? Forget it!!!!! AzWm The P-Bowl has had one crowd over 40k--that being the first time SDSU played in he game. And the last two H-Bowls had crowds under 50k. I don't think a 40k minimum stadium with plans for expansion are that much at odds with the bowl organizers.
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Post by sleepy on Dec 31, 2016 12:43:19 GMT -8
Which is why, of course, you'll note the use of the term "de facto"... The NFL doesn't, "De facto," run the Q, either, any more than SDSU does. It's fun to put your head in the sand, but every once in a while you gotta come up to face reality and breathe.
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Post by FULL_MONTY on Dec 31, 2016 13:34:18 GMT -8
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Post by AccessBowlTime on Dec 31, 2016 14:22:08 GMT -8
Partnering with the NFL is a sure thing? Let's first see if we are still having this conversation in January 16. Sometimes I feel like I am speaking a second language here. You are. It's Chargerese.
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Post by bolt1963 on Dec 31, 2016 16:11:16 GMT -8
You are. It's Chargerese. Said it so many times. If you guys could guarantee SDSU West, a new modern stadium and retaining the bowls - I'd be happy about that. Would prefer remaining a major league City - but I've resigned myself to the Chargers leaving. I think that sucks for San Diego - many of you guys disagree. But think I am fairly rational in my approach to this cluster ****.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Dec 31, 2016 16:26:21 GMT -8
You are. It's Chargerese. Said it so many times. If you guys could guarantee SDSU West, a new modern stadium and retaining the bowls - I'd be happy about that. Would prefer remaining a major league City - but I've resigned myself to the Chargers leaving. I think that sucks for San Diego - many of you guys disagree. But think I am fairly rational in my approach to this cluster ****. Right now there is no guarantee that SDSU West and a new Aztec Warrior Stadium will ever happen. We could lose the Chargers AND, eventually, Aztec football if we're not careful. (And by, "We," I mean SDSU and its supporters.)
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Post by retiredaztec on Dec 31, 2016 16:44:27 GMT -8
Said it so many times. If you guys could guarantee SDSU West, a new modern stadium and retaining the bowls - I'd be happy about that. Would prefer remaining a major league City - but I've resigned myself to the Chargers leaving. I think that sucks for San Diego - many of you guys disagree. But think I am fairly rational in my approach to this cluster ****. Right now there is no guarantee that SDSU West and a new Aztec Warrior Stadium will ever happen. We could lose the Chargers AND, eventually, Aztec football if we're not careful. (And by, "We," I mean SDSU and its supporters.) FINALLY I'll step into this crapfest.... YA THINK!?!?........
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Dec 31, 2016 17:01:09 GMT -8
Right now there is no guarantee that SDSU West and a new Aztec Warrior Stadium will ever happen. We could lose the Chargers AND, eventually, Aztec football if we're not careful. (And by, "We," I mean SDSU and its supporters.) FINALLY I'll step into this crapfest.... YA THINK!?!?........ I've only been saying that for the last 13 years. I'm a huge Chargers fan (have been ever since they hired Don Coryell) and I'd hate to see them leave town (for many reasons), but to then lose them AND Aztec football? Let's just say that to be a football fan in San Diego at that point would be to live with constant disappointment and annual depression. It's going to take a lot of money, probably thousands of collective hours on the part of lawyers and administrators and assistants, and the cooperation of the city to make a new Aztec stadium happen - and then to try and add in SDSU West? It will take a Herculean effort, and more than a little luck, to get it done.
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Post by AZK619 on Jan 1, 2017 0:50:32 GMT -8
Right now there is no guarantee that SDSU West and a new Aztec Warrior Stadium will ever happen. We could lose the Chargers AND, eventually, Aztec football if we're not careful. (And by, "We," I mean SDSU and its supporters.) FINALLY I'll step into this crapfest.... YA THINK!?!?........ Aww, its that guy who doesn't even live in SD complaining about SDSU possibly taking over the Qualcomm site. Should have taken over the Aztec Bowl, blah blah blah..
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Post by AztecWilliam on Jan 1, 2017 11:31:21 GMT -8
We could do, perhaps for a couple of years, with 32K, but that is really a bit on the small side. Better to start with 40K or close to that number. As for 50K, I see that as a possible maximum number if, repeat IF, the program continues to improve and attendance of 40,000 plus becomes routine. I would hate to see an undefeated Aztec team host a decent P5 school and have to turn away thousands of fans because we are playing in a 35k seat stadium. In that scenario, crowds of 45K to 50K could well happen. But, as I said, that is a best case scenario perhaps 5 to 10 years from now. As for the bowls, even the Poinsettia Bowl would want seating for at least 40K. The Holiday Bowl? Fifty-thousand would seem to be a bare, bare minimum. That's why I say that the bowl organization's needs and our needs are somewhat at odds with each other. As for sharing a stadium with the NFL? Forget it!!!!! AzWm The P-Bowl has had one crowd over 40k--that being the first time SDSU played in he game. And the last two H-Bowls had crowds under 50k. I don't think a 40k minimum stadium with plans for expansion are that much at odds with the bowl organizers. The bowl people, as is the case with Aztec fans, are hoping and planning for a brighter future. I doubt very much that they are okay with accepting 40,000-45,000 as the new normal attendance for the Holiday Bowl (the P=Bowl is another matter). In any case, we need to hear from them. I suppose that if it came down to making do with a 45K to 50K venue or folding their tent, they might swallow hard and agree to the former. If would be nice if somehow we could enlist the partnership of the bowl organization. If that means getting them to agree to use a 40K-45K stadium with plans for expansion in a few years, I would be in favor. As I said, we need to hear what the bowl people think. It is absolutely certain that they have given the matter a lot of thought. AzWm
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Post by AztecWilliam on Jan 1, 2017 11:35:35 GMT -8
You are. It's Chargerese. Said it so many times. If you guys could guarantee SDSU West, a new modern stadium and retaining the bowls - I'd be happy about that. Would prefer remaining a major league City - but I've resigned myself to the Chargers leaving. I think that sucks for San Diego - many of you guys disagree. But think I am fairly rational in my approach to this cluster ****. Ask citizens of Norman, Lincoln, Ann Arbor, Tuscaloosa, Eugene, Tallahassee, Clemson, College Station, etc., whether they consider their cities second rate because they lack NFL franchises. AzWm
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Post by bolt1963 on Jan 1, 2017 11:40:09 GMT -8
Ask citizens of Norman, Lincoln, Ann Arbor, Tuscaloosa, Eugene, Tallahassee, Clemson, College Station, etc., whether they consider their cities second rate because they lack NFL franchises. AzWm May as well throw Austin in there, I mean they don't have a NFL team either. Did you really just throw out a bunch of college towns and compare them to San Diego? The Countries 8th largest City? And sorry man, I can't stop laughing at College Station. You ever been? Freakn aggies.
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Post by Spud on Jan 1, 2017 11:48:37 GMT -8
NFL football teams do not make a city a major league City...just ask Buffalo, Cleveland, Jacksonville, Detroit, etc...San Diego will not go into some deep economic or personal identity crisis because a subpar nfl franchise leaves. If you get your civic pride from a team like the Chargers, I suggest that you need to examine your life very carefully...
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Post by myownwords on Jan 1, 2017 11:53:03 GMT -8
Ask citizens of Norman, Lincoln, Ann Arbor, Tuscaloosa, Eugene, Tallahassee, Clemson, College Station, etc., whether they consider their cities second rate because they lack NFL franchises. AzWm May as well throw Austin in there, I mean they don't have a NFL team either. Did you really just throw out a bunch of college towns and compare them to San Diego? The Countries 8th largest City? And sorry man, I can't stop laughing at College Station. You ever been? Freakn aggies. Well, sort of. College Station is not as isolated as one would think. It's within 50 miles--flat straight roads--of two major population centers (Austin and Houston) and 100 miles from San Antonio. It's out in "nowhere", about like San Clemente.
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Post by bolt1963 on Jan 1, 2017 12:03:56 GMT -8
NFL football teams do not make a city a major league City...just ask Buffalo, Cleveland, Jacksonville, Detroit, etc...San Diego will not go into some deep economic or personal identity crisis because a subpar nfl franchise leaves. If you get your civic pride from a team like the Chargers, I suggest that you need to examine your life very carefully... Good grief - where did I say any of that? Major League Cities provide entertainment options you wouldn't get in smaller cities. We're already teetering the line sans NHL and NBA. Do I derive my personal identity from the Padres and Chargers? No. But I was born and raised having that entertainment option - attending countless games for both. Hell - I even went to the SDSU vs. Miami game in 1990 Maybe if SDSU was in the PAC when I was growing up, I'd feel differently. But as it is, San Diego is efforting to become Portland. While Portland is a nice little city - it's just that - a little city. myownwords - College Station is an absolute **** hole and the aggy cult is from another planet. That place is frightening.
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