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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 24, 2014 14:59:50 GMT -8
Ban hammer on Steve. Nice post but everyone should have learned their lesson on you by now. If you are allowed to stay it will end very badly. I've seen your dark side too many times over the years. Mod's Note - Yeah, Steve knows better. He's been banned a few dozen times (he's come back that often under different aliases using proxy servers to get around the ban). This is just the latest of many bans for Steve. It's a shame that he's got that dark side because he is a great Aztec fan - he just can't get along with people who disagree with him. At all. This Mod's note was unnecessary and both these statements turned a decent and respectful thread very ugly very quickly. The note could have been done via PM and seems spiteful in nature, Uncool. Similarly, the post could have been done by PM and was also spiteful. Bad form on both of you. I understand where you're coming from, and I considered all my options and decided to go with a, "Mod's Note," to address the elephant in the room. What is bad form is returning to a message board where you have been part of dozens and dozens of heated, ugly, personal flame wars, culminating with your permanent banning. Steve has done just that - used aliases dozens of times only to get banned each time (Fembone and I have verified that it was, indeed, Steve each time). He shows no respect for the rules of this forum, and has shown no contrition for his actions that got him banned in the first place. Having said that I can understand why Steve wanted to post something about his friend's premature passing. It was a tragic event, and I'm sure it bothers Steve to this day and probably will for the rest of his life. However, Steve's timing is more than curious. JYP passed away months ago. Tony Gwynn passed away a couple of months ago. Why violate the rules and create a new account under false pretenses to post your tributes now? Why not then? More importanly, if you're really a good citizen and all you want to do is post those well thought out, heartfelt tributes, why not simply ask if you can have a pass to create an account for those two posts and then go back to posting on the other boards that you're a part of? The timing was more than curious, as Steve had just blasted me, my dad, and Fembone on one of the other boards he posts on just a week earlier. An extensive tirade filled with personal attacks and unpleastant venom. I didn't play that game, I didn't respond. I decided to take the high road and just let it go rather than start up a pointless flame war on that board. Then Steve created another account (a total forum rules violation as he had to use a proxy server to do it, so he knowingly created an account under false pretenses), he posted his tributes - but didn't leave it at that. He clearly intended to continue as a forum member despite his lifetime banning. Again, a total rules violation. He knew he would get banned, and then what does he do? He uses his banning as fuel for another tirade and more personal attacks. Bottom line? Steve has shown ZERO contrition, has taken ZERO responsibility for his actions on this board, and has continued his VERY personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. He has no business creating an account here. Ever. Not with his history of bad behavior over the last five years. And, apparently, it isn't just here. He's been banned from multiple boards, including the MWC board. It's not just us. And even with all of that, if Steve had sent me a message when JYP and Tony Gwynn passed asking to post those tributes I would have let him. Just for the one post each, but I would have let him as those were definitely special circumstances. It meant a lot to Steve, so I would have agreed that he should be allowed to make those comments.But he didn't ask. He didn't even post those messages when those two standouts passed away. He waited for months, and only after he posted yet another tirade personally attacking me, my dad, and Fembone did he create this new account in violation of forum rules. I didn't want to go into all of that on the JYP thread. I just wanted to address the obvious since it had inevitably been brought up - Steve wasn't supposed to be on this board. He has too much negative history to be allowed to post here, and I wanted to make clear that we were going to follow through with the forum rules just like we have in the past. I don't want anyone to get the impression that we would just allow banned members back on this board just because they're clever enough to get around the system ban. I will clear up the JYP thread and remove some of the Steve talk, as that is most definitely off topic. It's just unfortunate that I have to do so. Like I said before, had Steve merely sent me a message asking for permission to post those two tributes I would have let him do it. He didn't ask. And he didn't just post those two tributes. And he has continued his personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. And that's really, really disappointing. As I said in my Mod's Note - Steve is a great Aztec fan. When not provoked by someone critical of his opinions Steve can be one of the greatest contributors on any Aztec message board at any time. That SteveAztec I would love to have on this board. The one who engages in namecalling and personal attacks? Not so much.
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Post by rockshow on Sept 24, 2014 15:10:20 GMT -8
I think it's high time we all come to the realization that WE are all the crazy ones and Steve is the only normal, sane, rational person left in this God-forsaken world.
We all think it's Steve who is batshit crazy and has a litany of social disorders, but no. It's all of us who have been drinking the crazy koolaid.
Don't worry Steve, I have your back. We were all just too crazy to realize that all your craziness over the years has made perfect sense.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 24, 2014 15:11:29 GMT -8
This Mod's note was unnecessary and both these statements turned a decent and respectful thread very ugly very quickly. The note could have been done via PM and seems spiteful in nature, Uncool. Similarly, the post could have been done by PM and was also spiteful. Bad form on both of you. I understand where you're coming from, and I considered all my options and decided to go with a, "Mod's Note," to address the elephant in the room. What is bad form is returning to a message board where you have been part of dozens and dozens of heated, ugly, personal flame wars, culminating with your permanent banning. Steve has done just that - used aliases dozens of times only to get banned each time (Fembone and I have verified that it was, indeed, Steve each time). He shows no respect for the rules of this forum, and has shown no contrition for his actions that got him banned in the first place. Having said that I can understand why Steve wanted to post something about his friend's premature passing. It was a tragic event, and I'm sure it bothers Steve to this day and probably will for the rest of his life. However, Steve's timing is more than curious. JYP passed away months ago. Tony Gwynn passed away a couple of months ago. Why violate the rules and create a new account under false pretenses to post your tributes now? Why not then? More importanly, if you're really a good citizen and all you want to do is post those well thought out, heartfelt tributes, why not simply ask if you can have a pass to create an account for those two posts and then go back to posting on the other boards that you're a part of? The timing was more than curious, as Steve had just blasted me, my dad, and Fembone on one of the other boards he posts on just a week earlier. An extensive tirade filled with personal attacks and unpleastant venom. I didn't play that game, I didn't respond. I decided to take the high road and just let it go rather than start up a pointless flame war on that board. Then Steve created another account (a total forum rules violation as he had to use a proxy server to do it, so he knowingly created an account under false pretenses), he posted his tributes - but didn't leave it at that. He clearly intended to continue as a forum member despite his lifetime banning. Again, a total rules violation. He knew he would get banned, and then what does he do? He uses his banning as fuel for another tirade and more personal attacks. Bottom line? Steve has shown ZERO contrition, has taken ZERO responsibility for his actions on this board, and has continued his VERY personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. He has no business creating an account here. Ever. Not with his history of bad behavior over the last five years. And, apparently, it isn't just here. He's been banned from multiple boards, including the MWC board. It's not just us. And even with all of that, if Steve had sent me a message when JYP and Tony Gwynn passed asking to post those tributes I would have let him. Just for the one post each, but I would have let him as those were definitely special circumstances. It meant a lot to Steve, so I would have agreed that he should be allowed to make those comments.But he didn't ask. He didn't even post those messages when those two standouts passed away. He waited for months, and only after he posted yet another tirade personally attacking me, my dad, and Fembone did he create this new account in violation of forum rules. I didn't want to go into all of that on the JYP thread. I just wanted to address the obvious since it had inevitably been brought up - Steve wasn't supposed to be on this board. He has too much negative history to be allowed to post here, and I wanted to make clear that we were going to follow through with the forum rules just like we have in the past. I don't want anyone to get the impression that we would just allow banned members back on this board just because they're clever enough to get around the system ban. I will clear up the JYP thread and remove some of the Steve talk, as that is most definitely off topic. It's just unfortunate that I have to do so. Like I said before, had Steve merely sent me a message asking for permission to post those two tributes I would have let him do it. He didn't ask. And he didn't just post those two tributes. And he has continued his personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. And that's really, really disappointing. As I said in my Mod's Note - Steve is a great Aztec fan. When not provoked by someone critical of his opinions Steve can be one of the greatest contributors on any Aztec message board at any time. That SteveAztec I would love to have on this board. The one who engages in namecalling and personal attacks? Not so much. I am happy that you took the time to clean up that thread. For that I thank you. I watched this board long before I joined and am not stranger to the goings on. I don't pick sides, I am just suggesting that it could have been handled better.
I honestly don't care who is banned or what activity lead to that ban. I also don't care that someone circumvented that ban to post a tribute such as it was. The Mod's (in this case you?) could have taken the high road and just re-banned him without any fanfare or verbose rationale. It came across as that funeral where someone (who was not invited) said some really great things -- then someone made a big commotion in front of everyone for the express purpose of making sure everyone knew he wasn't invited ... that could have taken place behind closed doors or in another room. I am a really fair guy and I call it like I see it. That is how it came across.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 24, 2014 15:21:07 GMT -8
I should edit my comments to say TRIED to clean up that thread ... it is still a verbose mixture of excuse making and off-topic with random post-deletions that make the thread even more off-topic
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2014 15:39:55 GMT -8
AztecStalk. Perfect title.
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Post by Spud on Sept 24, 2014 20:24:15 GMT -8
I understand where you're coming from, and I considered all my options and decided to go with a, "Mod's Note," to address the elephant in the room. What is bad form is returning to a message board where you have been part of dozens and dozens of heated, ugly, personal flame wars, culminating with your permanent banning. Steve has done just that - used aliases dozens of times only to get banned each time (Fembone and I have verified that it was, indeed, Steve each time). He shows no respect for the rules of this forum, and has shown no contrition for his actions that got him banned in the first place. Having said that I can understand why Steve wanted to post something about his friend's premature passing. It was a tragic event, and I'm sure it bothers Steve to this day and probably will for the rest of his life. However, Steve's timing is more than curious. JYP passed away months ago. Tony Gwynn passed away a couple of months ago. Why violate the rules and create a new account under false pretenses to post your tributes now? Why not then? More importanly, if you're really a good citizen and all you want to do is post those well thought out, heartfelt tributes, why not simply ask if you can have a pass to create an account for those two posts and then go back to posting on the other boards that you're a part of? The timing was more than curious, as Steve had just blasted me, my dad, and Fembone on one of the other boards he posts on just a week earlier. An extensive tirade filled with personal attacks and unpleastant venom. I didn't play that game, I didn't respond. I decided to take the high road and just let it go rather than start up a pointless flame war on that board. Then Steve created another account (a total forum rules violation as he had to use a proxy server to do it, so he knowingly created an account under false pretenses), he posted his tributes - but didn't leave it at that. He clearly intended to continue as a forum member despite his lifetime banning. Again, a total rules violation. He knew he would get banned, and then what does he do? He uses his banning as fuel for another tirade and more personal attacks. Bottom line? Steve has shown ZERO contrition, has taken ZERO responsibility for his actions on this board, and has continued his VERY personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. He has no business creating an account here. Ever. Not with his history of bad behavior over the last five years. And, apparently, it isn't just here. He's been banned from multiple boards, including the MWC board. It's not just us. And even with all of that, if Steve had sent me a message when JYP and Tony Gwynn passed asking to post those tributes I would have let him. Just for the one post each, but I would have let him as those were definitely special circumstances. It meant a lot to Steve, so I would have agreed that he should be allowed to make those comments.But he didn't ask. He didn't even post those messages when those two standouts passed away. He waited for months, and only after he posted yet another tirade personally attacking me, my dad, and Fembone did he create this new account in violation of forum rules. I didn't want to go into all of that on the JYP thread. I just wanted to address the obvious since it had inevitably been brought up - Steve wasn't supposed to be on this board. He has too much negative history to be allowed to post here, and I wanted to make clear that we were going to follow through with the forum rules just like we have in the past. I don't want anyone to get the impression that we would just allow banned members back on this board just because they're clever enough to get around the system ban. I will clear up the JYP thread and remove some of the Steve talk, as that is most definitely off topic. It's just unfortunate that I have to do so. Like I said before, had Steve merely sent me a message asking for permission to post those two tributes I would have let him do it. He didn't ask. And he didn't just post those two tributes. And he has continued his personal attacks against the Mod staff here on other boards. And that's really, really disappointing. As I said in my Mod's Note - Steve is a great Aztec fan. When not provoked by someone critical of his opinions Steve can be one of the greatest contributors on any Aztec message board at any time. That SteveAztec I would love to have on this board. The one who engages in namecalling and personal attacks? Not so much. I am happy that you took the time to clean up that thread. For that I thank you. I watched this board long before I joined and am not stranger to the goings on. I don't pick sides, I am just suggesting that it could have been handled better.
I honestly don't care who is banned or what activity lead to that ban. I also don't care that someone circumvented that ban to post a tribute such as it was. The Mod's (in this case you?) could have taken the high road and just re-banned him without any fanfare or verbose rationale. It came across as that funeral where someone (who was not invited) said some really great things -- then someone made a big commotion in front of everyone for the express purpose of making sure everyone knew he wasn't invited ... that could have taken place behind closed doors or in another room. I am a really fair guy and I call it like I see it. That is how it came across. Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 24, 2014 21:29:18 GMT -8
I am happy that you took the time to clean up that thread. For that I thank you. I watched this board long before I joined and am not stranger to the goings on. I don't pick sides, I am just suggesting that it could have been handled better.
I honestly don't care who is banned or what activity lead to that ban. I also don't care that someone circumvented that ban to post a tribute such as it was. The Mod's (in this case you?) could have taken the high road and just re-banned him without any fanfare or verbose rationale. It came across as that funeral where someone (who was not invited) said some really great things -- then someone made a big commotion in front of everyone for the express purpose of making sure everyone knew he wasn't invited ... that could have taken place behind closed doors or in another room. I am a really fair guy and I call it like I see it. That is how it came across. Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose. This is the problem as I see it ... decorum. You don't seem to understand how to diffuse an issue without first blowing it up bigger. It whatever Steve is, whatever you want others to know about him did not need to be aired in that particular thread and could have, nay should have been handled quickly and quietly without much ado; without verbose and unneeded comments. By doing it the way it was done, and then protesting when being called out about it ... just make the issue worse. You are a good example of this. Instead of letting an issue fall by the wayside, you insist on egging it on for some personal view that you have that you absolutely must express for all to see -- even though I have already declared that I don't care. That is fine, and that is your right -- but if you had any sense of decency or decorum, you'd know that the JYP Passed thread, or any open thread is not the place to do that. Now, you seek to compound the original failure of decorum by continuing to press the what has got to be by now; a closed case. I supposed you are emboldened by the fact that this is a separate thread ... another failure of judgement. Again, I have picked no sides in this and don't care one way or the other ... it's just sad to see that people like you just don't seem to recognize that there is an appropriate place to air your opinion about others. There is this thing called a private message. You should try to learn to use it.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 24, 2014 23:39:56 GMT -8
Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose. This is the problem as I see it ... decorum. You don't seem to understand how to diffuse an issue without first blowing it up bigger. It whatever Steve is, whatever you want others to know about him did not need to be aired in that particular thread and could have, nay should have been handled quickly and quietly without much ado; without verbose and unneeded comments. By doing it the way it was done, and then protesting when being called out about it ... just make the issue worse. You are a good example of this. Instead of letting an issue fall by the wayside, you insist on egging it on for some personal view that you have that you absolutely must express for all to see -- even though I have already declared that I don't care. That is fine, and that is your right -- but if you had any sense of decency or decorum, you'd know that the JYP Passed thread, or any open thread is not the place to do that. Now, you seek to compound the original failure of decorum by continuing to press the what has got to be by now; a closed case. I supposed you are emboldened by the fact that this is a separate thread ... another failure of judgement. Again, I have picked no sides in this and don't care one way or the other ... it's just sad to see that people like you just don't seem to recognize that there is an appropriate place to air your opinion about others. There is this thing called a private message. You should try to learn to use it. Appropriate to you. You are trying to impose your views and opinions on everyone else, which I don't believe is appropriate unless it is your board that we're talking about. When you start a board, set up your own rules, moderate said board for free, spend hundreds of hours over several years (again, for free) keeping it as civil as possible, only then will you have the right to impose your views and opinions on others. Until then it is probably inappropriate to publicly question the moderation of any board, using your own standards, no less. You should have just let the issue fall by the wayside instead of egging it on for some personal view that you absolutely must express for all to see rather than using this thing called, "Private Message." (Which you didn't do - hypocricy is so hypocritical that way.) For someone who says that he doesn't care you sure seem to care an awful lot about this. Interesting.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 25, 2014 8:49:07 GMT -8
This is the problem as I see it ... decorum. You don't seem to understand how to diffuse an issue without first blowing it up bigger. It whatever Steve is, whatever you want others to know about him did not need to be aired in that particular thread and could have, nay should have been handled quickly and quietly without much ado; without verbose and unneeded comments. By doing it the way it was done, and then protesting when being called out about it ... just make the issue worse. You are a good example of this. Instead of letting an issue fall by the wayside, you insist on egging it on for some personal view that you have that you absolutely must express for all to see -- even though I have already declared that I don't care. That is fine, and that is your right -- but if you had any sense of decency or decorum, you'd know that the JYP Passed thread, or any open thread is not the place to do that. Now, you seek to compound the original failure of decorum by continuing to press the what has got to be by now; a closed case. I supposed you are emboldened by the fact that this is a separate thread ... another failure of judgement. Again, I have picked no sides in this and don't care one way or the other ... it's just sad to see that people like you just don't seem to recognize that there is an appropriate place to air your opinion about others. There is this thing called a private message. You should try to learn to use it. Appropriate to you. You are trying to impose your views and opinions on everyone else, which I don't believe is appropriate unless it is your board that we're talking about. When you start a board, set up your own rules, moderate said board for free, spend hundreds of hours over several years (again, for free) keeping it as civil as possible, only then will you have the right to impose your views and opinions on others. Until then it is probably inappropriate to publicly question the moderation of any board, using your own standards, no less. You should have just let the issue fall by the wayside instead of egging it on for some personal view that you absolutely must express for all to see rather than using this thing called, "Private Message." ( Which you didn't do - hypocricy is so hypocritical that way.) For someone who says that he doesn't care you sure seem to care an awful lot about this. Interesting. I find it quite comical that you can not see what is right in front of you. You should be able to read through a thread, see where it goes off-topic and then how it never recovers. The more you debate and try to explain your actions, the worse it gets. If you you are trying to say that you are the "decider" of what is "appropriate" on "your board" then that is true. If you are trying to say that you decide whose opinions are valid and are worthy of a vigorous and verbose defense ... as you say this is your board and that is your call. Twice on this subject I have waded into hypocrisy (on-purpose) for the expressed intent of appearing as such. I called myself on it in the first such post and did so again to drive a point home -- because sometimes the best way to show how not to do something is to show them by doing it incorrectly so they can see what it looks like. Not caring about if someone is banned or why is a separate issue as to caring to respond to someone as to the best practices known for diffusing conflict ... I hope that you can discern the difference and possibly apply that knowledge when acting as this boards' "moderator". What you do as a user is entirely up to you.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 25, 2014 17:20:28 GMT -8
I find it quite comical that you can not see what is right in front of you. You should be able to read through a thread, see where it goes off-topic and then how it never recovers. The more you debate and try to explain your actions, the worse it gets. If you you are trying to say that you are the "decider" of what is "appropriate" on "your board" then that is true. If you are trying to say that you decide whose opinions are valid and are worthy of a vigorous and verbose defense ... as you say this is your board and that is your call. Twice on this subject I have waded into hypocrisy (on-purpose) for the expressed intent of appearing as such. I called myself on it in the first such post and did so again to drive a point home -- because sometimes the best way to show how not to do something is to show them by doing it incorrectly so they can see what it looks like. Not caring about if someone is banned or why is a separate issue as to caring to respond to someone as to the best practices known for diffusing conflict ... I hope that you can discern the difference and possibly apply that knowledge when acting as this boards' "moderator". What you do as a user is entirely up to you. And sometimes you just have to accept that your opinion is in the minority and deal with it. I had a very valid reason to keep some of those posts up. Whether or not you would agree with that reason is irrelevant. But another area where we strongly disagree is banned members and the reasons for their bannings. If you don't care about that kind of thing then I don't think we're ever going to see eye to eye. I strongly believe that when someone has created a huge amount of ill will on a board and he then breaks forum rules to return after being banned subsequently addressing that occurrence is required to let the other board members know that the Mod team is aware of the situation and handling it.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 25, 2014 19:06:09 GMT -8
I find it quite comical that you can not see what is right in front of you. You should be able to read through a thread, see where it goes off-topic and then how it never recovers. The more you debate and try to explain your actions, the worse it gets. If you you are trying to say that you are the "decider" of what is "appropriate" on "your board" then that is true. If you are trying to say that you decide whose opinions are valid and are worthy of a vigorous and verbose defense ... as you say this is your board and that is your call. Twice on this subject I have waded into hypocrisy (on-purpose) for the expressed intent of appearing as such. I called myself on it in the first such post and did so again to drive a point home -- because sometimes the best way to show how not to do something is to show them by doing it incorrectly so they can see what it looks like. Not caring about if someone is banned or why is a separate issue as to caring to respond to someone as to the best practices known for diffusing conflict ... I hope that you can discern the difference and possibly apply that knowledge when acting as this boards' "moderator". What you do as a user is entirely up to you. And sometimes you just have to accept that your opinion is in the minority and deal with it. I had a very valid reason to keep some of those posts up. Whether or not you would agree with that reason is irrelevant. But another area where we strongly disagree is banned members and the reasons for their bannings. If you don't care about that kind of thing then I don't think we're ever going to see eye to eye. I strongly believe that when someone has created a huge amount of ill will on a board and he then breaks forum rules to return after being banned subsequently addressing that occurrence is required to let the other board members know that the Mod team is aware of the situation and handling it. You seem to be very sensitive on this subject. Opinions are what this board is about. Whether or not someone is banned once or multiple times is immaterial to the subject of best practices regarding the behavior or decorum of someone who is charged with the "moderation" of a forum. The fact is there was an opportunity to handle a situation quietly and without drawing attention to the alter issue, thus preserving the integrity of the thread. You chose to do it overtly and added some extra comments that further complicated the issue. I will assume based on the vociferous defense of your handling of the situation that you do not take well to criticism (constructive or otherwise). regarding: " ... is required to let the other board members know that the Mod team is aware of the situation and handling it."this could have been done in a PM to the member that alerted you or in a reply to the banned member using words to the effect of "although X is banned from the board, we will let this post stand, but member X is once again banned"
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Post by San Diego Football Fan on Sept 25, 2014 20:19:46 GMT -8
I am happy that you took the time to clean up that thread. For that I thank you. I watched this board long before I joined and am not stranger to the goings on. I don't pick sides, I am just suggesting that it could have been handled better.
I honestly don't care who is banned or what activity lead to that ban. I also don't care that someone circumvented that ban to post a tribute such as it was. The Mod's (in this case you?) could have taken the high road and just re-banned him without any fanfare or verbose rationale. It came across as that funeral where someone (who was not invited) said some really great things -- then someone made a big commotion in front of everyone for the express purpose of making sure everyone knew he wasn't invited ... that could have taken place behind closed doors or in another room. I am a really fair guy and I call it like I see it. That is how it came across. Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose. Way to take the high road: aztecmesa.proboards.com/post/712241If Steve is such a thorn on your side, how about keeping his name out of your posts? The people bitching about him the most are the ones provoking the nonsense. Can't have it both ways.
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Post by Spud on Sept 25, 2014 20:55:53 GMT -8
Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose. This is the problem as I see it ... decorum. You don't seem to understand how to diffuse an issue without first blowing it up bigger. It whatever Steve is, whatever you want others to know about him did not need to be aired in that particular thread and could have, nay should have been handled quickly and quietly without much ado; without verbose and unneeded comments. By doing it the way it was done, and then protesting when being called out about it ... just make the issue worse. You are a good example of this. Instead of letting an issue fall by the wayside, you insist on egging it on for some personal view that you have that you absolutely must express for all to see -- even though I have already declared that I don't care. That is fine, and that is your right -- but if you had any sense of decency or decorum, you'd know that the JYP Passed thread, or any open thread is not the place to do that. Now, you seek to compound the original failure of decorum by continuing to press the what has got to be by now; a closed case. I supposed you are emboldened by the fact that this is a separate thread ... another failure of judgement. Again, I have picked no sides in this and don't care one way or the other ... it's just sad to see that people like you just don't seem to recognize that there is an appropriate place to air your opinion about others. There is this thing called a private message. You should try to learn to use it.Funny....did you even read what you just wrote? You chastise me in an open forum for...hold on now...chastising someone else in an open forum.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 25, 2014 21:05:20 GMT -8
Yeah, except Steve has a long standing record of blowing his top DESPITE people taking the high road and moving things to PM. What probably should have happened is lock down the thread, ban Steve YET AGAIN, and be done with it. The mods aren't the bad people here...and for the record, I thought the mod response was fair given Steve's track record. Two different perspectives I suppose. Way to take the high road: aztecmesa.proboards.com/post/712241If Steve is such a thorn on your side, how about keeping his name out of your posts? The people bitching about him the most are the ones provoking the nonsense. Can't have it both ways. Steve's behavior on the other board regarding Aztec Mesa and the mod staff has been utterly reprehensible (and that's as much as I'm going to say about that), but I am not going to engage in that kind of behavior, nor will anyone else on this mod staff. He came on this board in violation of the forum rules, showing utter contempt for the Mod staff, and people expect that to go unmentioned? The board members need to know that we're on it, that we will not tolerate that kind of behavior, and the only way to let everyone know that is to post a brief comment like I originally did. It was a Mod's Note addressing the elephant in the room. Nothing more, nothing less. And, for the record, I wasn't the one who brought Steve up. Other people were already commenting on his reappearance in a negative way. I just addressed the issue that had already been brought up.
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Post by rockshow on Sept 25, 2014 22:54:49 GMT -8
I didn't read any of these comments because they are all so damn long, but if it's anything other than "Steve is crazy and bad for aztecmesa" then it's a waste of time.
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Post by San Diego Football Fan on Sept 25, 2014 23:02:46 GMT -8
Way to take the high road: aztecmesa.proboards.com/post/712241If Steve is such a thorn on your side, how about keeping his name out of your posts? The people bitching about him the most are the ones provoking the nonsense. Can't have it both ways. Steve's behavior on the other board regarding Aztec Mesa and the mod staff has been utterly reprehensible (and that's as much as I'm going to say about that), but I am not going to engage in that kind of behavior, nor will anyone else on this mod staff. He came on this board in violation of the forum rules, showing utter contempt for the Mod staff, and people expect that to go unmentioned? The board members need to know that we're on it, that we will not tolerate that kind of behavior, and the only way to let everyone know that is to post a brief comment like I originally did. It was a Mod's Note addressing the elephant in the room. Nothing more, nothing less. And, for the record, I wasn't the one who brought Steve up. Other people were already commenting on his reappearance in a negative way. I just addressed the issue that had already been brought up. All Steve did was pay tribute to a fallen friend, he wasn't causing any trouble. I'm not saying you shouldn't have banned him, I just think the situation could have been handled without md's unnecessary post and you creating an outlet for people to continue dragging his name in the mud. If someone has a lifetime ban from this board, don't you think it's fair that unprovoked negative remarks towards that member should be banned also? At least you're able to go to "the other board" and defend whatever's said about you.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 26, 2014 4:26:59 GMT -8
Steve's behavior on the other board regarding Aztec Mesa and the mod staff has been utterly reprehensible (and that's as much as I'm going to say about that), but I am not going to engage in that kind of behavior, nor will anyone else on this mod staff. He came on this board in violation of the forum rules, showing utter contempt for the Mod staff, and people expect that to go unmentioned? The board members need to know that we're on it, that we will not tolerate that kind of behavior, and the only way to let everyone know that is to post a brief comment like I originally did. It was a Mod's Note addressing the elephant in the room. Nothing more, nothing less. And, for the record, I wasn't the one who brought Steve up. Other people were already commenting on his reappearance in a negative way. I just addressed the issue that had already been brought up. All Steve did was pay tribute to a fallen friend, he wasn't causing any trouble. I'm not saying you shouldn't have banned him, I just think the situation could have been handled without md's unnecessary post and you creating an outlet for people to continue dragging his name in the mud. If someone has a lifetime ban from this board, don't you think it's fair that unprovoked negative remarks towards that member should be banned also? At least you're able to go to "the other board" and defend whatever's said about you. Not really. Sure, I could go over there and debate Steve and point out where he's lying, but as that board is made up of Steve, his friends and supporters, and those who couldn't follow the rules here and got themselves banned it typically doesn't work out when I do defend myself against Steve's constant personal attacks over there. All it does is add fuel to the fire. It's just not worth it. Steve once said that he would stop posting attacks against the Aztec Mesa mod staff if I stopped posting over there, so I did. His personal attacks didn't stop. And I didn't attack Steve the way he attacks the Mesa mod staff and most of our members. I even noted that he's a great Aztec fan. I just made it clear that his continued violations will not be tolerated. And you've got to remember, Steve went beyond just paying tributes to a fallend friend and an Aztec legend. He kept posting on any subject that interested him. He made it clear that he intended to continue posting and commenting, regardless of his lifetime ban here. As I noted before, had Steve asked for permission to post those two tributes (JYP & Tony Gwynn) and been willing to leave it at that I would have granted that permission. But instead he yet again created a new account under false pretenses. And instead of just posting those tributes, he kept posting other comments as well. And then there's the curious thing as to why he waited for months to do this. Why not shortly after they passed? (Just like he did on the other board.) And why only a week after posting yet another scathing personal attack against the Mesa mod staff on that board? The timing of the whole thing was odd, to say the least. So I responded to the comments/questions brought up by several board members - I addressed the issue of the elephant in the room. I didn't create a new post to do it, and I kept it short. And I acknowledged that he is a great Aztec fan. I just also addressed why he was banned, and why his return under false pretenses (thus breaking forum rules, again) resulted in yet another banning. There were several people who posted comments that showed a concern and an irritation as to the prospect of having to deal with Steve yet again, so I made it clear that the Mod staff was on the case. That's all.
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 26, 2014 10:34:04 GMT -8
This is the problem as I see it ... decorum. You don't seem to understand how to diffuse an issue without first blowing it up bigger. It whatever Steve is, whatever you want others to know about him did not need to be aired in that particular thread and could have, nay should have been handled quickly and quietly without much ado; without verbose and unneeded comments. By doing it the way it was done, and then protesting when being called out about it ... just make the issue worse. You are a good example of this. Instead of letting an issue fall by the wayside, you insist on egging it on for some personal view that you have that you absolutely must express for all to see -- even though I have already declared that I don't care. That is fine, and that is your right -- but if you had any sense of decency or decorum, you'd know that the JYP Passed thread, or any open thread is not the place to do that. Now, you seek to compound the original failure of decorum by continuing to press the what has got to be by now; a closed case. I supposed you are emboldened by the fact that this is a separate thread ... another failure of judgement.Again, I have picked no sides in this and don't care one way or the other ... it's just sad to see that people like you just don't seem to recognize that there is an appropriate place to air your opinion about others. There is this thing called a private message. You should try to learn to use it. Funny....did you even read what you just wrote? You chastise me in an open forum for...hold on now...chastising someone else in an open forum. See Above ... and look for a private message from me regarding the rest of my opinion.
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Post by The Aztec Panther on Sept 27, 2014 7:27:41 GMT -8
High 'N' Tight - you're pushing it. You yourself have shown little decorum in your very public criticism of the mod staff here. You have not sent your concerns by PM, instead you have rather publicly, and now hypocritically, questioned the judgment of the mod staff. If you meant what you said you would have refrained from your public criticism and taken these issues to PM. You didn't.
As I explained, there are an awful lot of people here who do not want Steve on the board, and they need to know that we're on the case. They need to know that we aren't throwing in the towel, and Steve won't get away with futher rules violations. A public comment is the ONLY way to get that message across to everyone who has concerns about Steve showing up yet again. I wasn't concerned as much about, "Diffiusing the sitiation," as I was addressing the elephant in the room and getting out a public message that absolutely needed to be sent.
You clearly don't get that, or you just don't care, in which case you're part of the problem, not the solution.
Your own posts with public criticisms fanned the flames and kept this discussion going, which certainly seems to have been your intent (your bolding of that last message would indicate that). So, again, if you've got any further concerns or even criticism please feel free to PM me.
Just because someone handles something in a different way than you would doesn't make that handling incorrect. There may be different goals or philosophies at work (actually, there definitely are, something that you are either unwilling to accept or unable to understand).
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Post by HighNTight on Sept 30, 2014 15:24:12 GMT -8
High 'N' Tight - you're pushing it. You yourself have shown little decorum in your very public criticism of the mod staff here. You have not sent your concerns by PM, instead you have rather publicly, and now hypocritically, questioned the judgment of the mod staff. If you meant what you said you would have refrained from your public criticism and taken these issues to PM. You didn't. As I explained, there are an awful lot of people here who do not want Steve on the board, and they need to know that we're on the case. They need to know that we aren't throwing in the towel, and Steve won't get away with futher rules violations. A public comment is the ONLY way to get that message across to everyone who has concerns about Steve showing up yet again. I wasn't concerned as much about, "Diffiusing the sitiation," as I was addressing the elephant in the room and getting out a public message that absolutely needed to be sent. You clearly don't get that, or you just don't care, in which case you're part of the problem, not the solution. Your own posts with public criticisms fanned the flames and kept this discussion going, which certainly seems to have been your intent (your bolding of that last message would indicate that). So, again, if you've got any further concerns or even criticism please feel free to PM me. Just because someone handles something in a different way than you would doesn't make that handling incorrect. There may be different goals or philosophies at work (actually, there definitely are, something that you are either unwilling to accept or unable to understand). I honestly don't care about Steve ... he is not the issue. Ban him, delete all references or posts of his, don't delete his posts -- delete some but not others it doesn't matter. I criticized your "mod's note" as being unnecessary and in poor taste. Everything since then is you defending your actions as absolutely necessary and required by rule. This is your board and you can run it anyway you wish to. As a U.S. Marine and an analyst I hold myself out to be fair and as impartial as possible. It appears that the moderators here have no issues conflating their personal views with their official functions. I guess I was under the mistaken impression that moderators are held to a higher standard -- and when they don't want to be held to that standard, they post as a regular user with a non-moderator account. This board is not moderated quite to the level that I had grown accustomed to in other forums.If you seek to ban me because I have defended my criticism of the moderator / your handling of a situation then do so. Based on my observations on this board, such an action would only re-enforce the notion that you do not take any critique well, even when constructive. If you want to cite my hypocrisy, then I invite you to see your own ... As you have chosen to do so here in a open forum, instead of a private message as you declare is the procedure. As the end-user, I can only assume you want to have this conversation in the open because you created this thread "Why the JYP Thread was handled the way it was." in order to do so.
Fanning the flames, as you put it, has been done so openly because you -- as moderator have chosen to do so in an open forum. As the end-user, I am merely following your example, on your board, where you decide what is appropriate and have been discussing this issue with you as you have responded here instead of a PM.
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