|
|
Post by FULL_MONTY on Aug 14, 2010 11:45:29 GMT -8
|
|
|
|
Post by AztecWilliam on Aug 14, 2010 12:05:47 GMT -8
Did he not have a contract? Will he still be paid for this season?
AzWm
|
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 12:21:54 GMT -8
Did he not have a contract? Will he still be paid for this season? AzWm NFL contracts are not guaranteed unless specifically written into the contract, and even some of the 'guaranteed money' you hear about is not really guaranteed - contracts have to be guaranteed for injury, performance and salary cap. Someone like L-Train, I'm sure had at most a workout or camp bonus that is the only real guaranteed money; often after an injury they will settle a payout for camp. As example, the 2nd round pick for the cardinals from TCU (and in a lot better position in the NFL heirarchy has a deal of the following: 2010 Signing bonus: $1.675 million Salary: $320,000 2011 Salary: $405,000 (guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, which means Cardinals will pay if they cut him). 2012 Salary: $490,000 ($100,000 guaranteed) 2013 Salary: $575,000 (no guarantees). So only his first two years are guaranteed and he basically has a 100k option for his 3rd year. Ltrain likely got the league minimum each year (with maybe a slight raise year by year) and say 50k or 100k workout or reporting bonus a year. IN the NFL being injured means SOL www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/92694 |
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 12:25:57 GMT -8
Here's the bonuses for the other Cardinals draft picks (I use them because I follow them and know where their info is, but it should be similiar for most teams and I think train was an UFA so he'll get compensated like a late round draft pick at best): Meanwhile, salary figures are trickling in on rookie deals. I have the details on five of the team's seven picks. Daryl Washington's deal hasn't made it through the NFLPA, but that should happen soon. All the players signed four year deals at minimum salaries: $320,000, $405,000, $490,000 and $575,000. Here are the signing bonuses they received. 3rd round -- WR Andre Roberts , $724,000 4th round -- OLB O'Brien Schofield, $429,000 5th round -- QB John Skelton, $182,000 6th round -- CB Jorrick Calvin, $88,000 7th round -- TE Jim Dray, $49,000 So that is all the money these guys are assured of. www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/91673 |
|
|
|
Post by AztecWilliam on Aug 14, 2010 14:28:48 GMT -8
Do you think that a player such as Hamilton (or the others mentioned) might take out an insurance policy against serious injury? Something along the order of a $500,000 policy that would pay off if (A) the player was on the squad pre-season and suffered a season ending injury before the regular season or (B) was on the active squad and was injured during the regular season?
Such a policy might cost a lot ($10,000 ?) but would be a bargain if a serious injury occurred. If the player stayed healthy, the ten grand would be far less than his salary. If he were seriously injured he would at least get something for his effort.
AzWm
|
|
|
|
Post by Old School on Aug 14, 2010 15:03:12 GMT -8
Best of luck to L-Train.  Oldie Out |
|
|
|
Post by Pssst13 on Aug 14, 2010 15:19:28 GMT -8
Karma to them Saints
|
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 16:57:23 GMT -8
Do you think that a player such as Hamilton (or the others mentioned) might take out an insurance policy against serious injury? Something along the order of a $500,000 policy that would pay off if (A) the player was on the squad pre-season and suffered a season ending injury before the regular season or (B) was on the active squad and was injured during the regular season? Such a policy might cost a lot ($10,000 ?) but would be a bargain if a serious injury occurred. If the player stayed healthy, the ten grand would be far less than his salary. If he were seriously injured he would at least get something for his effort. AzWm I wonder how much it would really be, and it would open the policy holder up to litigation over whether release was injury or performance. Baseball used to do a lot of these because the contracts are guaranteed so the team would take out a policy, but I seem to remember reading that after a bunch of big names went down like Belle and Brown and some others that the premiums went up and the carriers were more resistive to it. THis is the problem with football that the union should be concerned with: reigning in these absurd top 15 in the draft guarantees and getting at least partial guarantees for the guys like L-train (and my team the cards just cut two guys in similar positions). The NCAA bankrolls coverage for guys that stay in school, the NFLPA should likewise be doing this instead of letting all the money go to 10 or 15 players, creating problems when guys like Boldin who are drafted in the 2nd round on immediately outperform their deal or guys like L-Train and so many others go down with injury. |
|
|
|
Post by TruAztec on Aug 14, 2010 17:00:54 GMT -8
|
|
|
|
Post by johneaztec on Aug 14, 2010 17:16:48 GMT -8
Did he not have a contract? Will he still be paid for this season? AzWm NFL contracts are not guaranteed unless specifically written into the contract, and even some of the 'guaranteed money' you hear about is not really guaranteed - contracts have to be guaranteed for injury, performance and salary cap. Someone like L-Train, I'm sure had at most a workout or camp bonus that is the only real guaranteed money; often after an injury they will settle a payout for camp. As example, the 2nd round pick for the cardinals from TCU (and in a lot better position in the NFL heirarchy has a deal of the following: 2010 Signing bonus: $1.675 million Salary: $320,000 2011 Salary: $405,000 (guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, which means Cardinals will pay if they cut him). 2012 Salary: $490,000 ($100,000 guaranteed) 2013 Salary: $575,000 (no guarantees). So only his first two years are guaranteed and he basically has a 100k option for his 3rd year. Ltrain likely got the league minimum each year (with maybe a slight raise year by year) and say 50k or 100k workout or reporting bonus a year. IN the NFL being injured means SOL www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/92694I'm guessing you're wrong on your ASSUMPTION. I think they took take care of L'Train. I'm ASSUMING they they guaranteed him more than you think. I'm a butt hair away of saying I known this for a fact. Let the responses roll. |
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 17:21:13 GMT -8
It's a good column, but maybe it's the populist/marxist/marcusian in me that I see the problem as not the high end, not the Drysdales and lindros' and holdouts and such, but that the NFL still basically works under a reserve clause in the non-guaranteed contract and it continues to let its players get shuffled in and out, cut when the money starts to kick in etc. all so the Payton's and Smith's can get big deals not to mention the Leaf's and JaMarcus' can get their guaranteed deals before they fall off the face of the earth. And, there will be a lockout not because the Players Association is going to fight against this, but because the players and owners are going to squabble over a few percentage points that just go to unproven rookies, overpaid stars and quarterbacks. |
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 17:22:37 GMT -8
NFL contracts are not guaranteed unless specifically written into the contract, and even some of the 'guaranteed money' you hear about is not really guaranteed - contracts have to be guaranteed for injury, performance and salary cap. Someone like L-Train, I'm sure had at most a workout or camp bonus that is the only real guaranteed money; often after an injury they will settle a payout for camp. As example, the 2nd round pick for the cardinals from TCU (and in a lot better position in the NFL heirarchy has a deal of the following: 2010 Signing bonus: $1.675 million Salary: $320,000 2011 Salary: $405,000 (guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, which means Cardinals will pay if they cut him). 2012 Salary: $490,000 ($100,000 guaranteed) 2013 Salary: $575,000 (no guarantees). So only his first two years are guaranteed and he basically has a 100k option for his 3rd year. Ltrain likely got the league minimum each year (with maybe a slight raise year by year) and say 50k or 100k workout or reporting bonus a year. IN the NFL being injured means SOL www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/92694I'm guessing you're wrong on your ASSUMPTION. I think they took take care of L'Train. I'm ASSUMING they they guaranteed him more than you think. I'm a butt hair away of saying I known this for a fact. Let the responses roll. Well, then tell me how you know, because the NFL does this to scores of players every year, signs them to non-guaranteed deals, gives them a signing or workout bonus and once they get hurt cuts them. |
|
|
|
Post by joshjones1 on Aug 14, 2010 17:23:36 GMT -8
NFL contracts are not guaranteed unless specifically written into the contract, and even some of the 'guaranteed money' you hear about is not really guaranteed - contracts have to be guaranteed for injury, performance and salary cap. Someone like L-Train, I'm sure had at most a workout or camp bonus that is the only real guaranteed money; often after an injury they will settle a payout for camp. As example, the 2nd round pick for the cardinals from TCU (and in a lot better position in the NFL heirarchy has a deal of the following: 2010 Signing bonus: $1.675 million Salary: $320,000 2011 Salary: $405,000 (guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, which means Cardinals will pay if they cut him). 2012 Salary: $490,000 ($100,000 guaranteed) 2013 Salary: $575,000 (no guarantees). So only his first two years are guaranteed and he basically has a 100k option for his 3rd year. Ltrain likely got the league minimum each year (with maybe a slight raise year by year) and say 50k or 100k workout or reporting bonus a year. IN the NFL being injured means SOL www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/92694I'm guessing you're wrong on your ASSUMPTION. I think they took take care of L'Train. I'm ASSUMING they they guaranteed him more than you think. I'm a butt hair away of saying I known this for a fact. Let the responses roll. NFL contracts have little guaranteed money, and then typically in bigger free agent/high draftee deals. I am certain his contract was not guaranteed (at all) for the 2010 season. I feel confident he will get a look elsewhere, based off his performance in New Orleans. |
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 17:26:22 GMT -8
NFL contracts are not guaranteed unless specifically written into the contract, and even some of the 'guaranteed money' you hear about is not really guaranteed - contracts have to be guaranteed for injury, performance and salary cap. Someone like L-Train, I'm sure had at most a workout or camp bonus that is the only real guaranteed money; often after an injury they will settle a payout for camp. As example, the 2nd round pick for the cardinals from TCU (and in a lot better position in the NFL heirarchy has a deal of the following: 2010 Signing bonus: $1.675 million Salary: $320,000 2011 Salary: $405,000 (guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, which means Cardinals will pay if they cut him). 2012 Salary: $490,000 ($100,000 guaranteed) 2013 Salary: $575,000 (no guarantees). So only his first two years are guaranteed and he basically has a 100k option for his 3rd year. Ltrain likely got the league minimum each year (with maybe a slight raise year by year) and say 50k or 100k workout or reporting bonus a year. IN the NFL being injured means SOL www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/KentSomers/92694I'm guessing you're wrong on your ASSUMPTION. I think they took take care of L'Train. I'm ASSUMING they they guaranteed him more than you think. I'm a butt hair away of saying I known this for a fact. Let the responses roll. A quick google puts his 2010 salary at 395k which is the league minimum: www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=nfl&id=5098So that is almost assuredly not guaranteed (no one guarantees minimum salaries). The only thing he'd get is a signing or a workout bonus, which, for a player like him would be under 100k. |
|
|
|
Post by goaztecs on Aug 14, 2010 17:28:13 GMT -8
He probably only got like 10K. Hopefully he can rehab and get another shot somewhere next year. I was wondering what happens to guys trying to get a spot on a roster who get hurt in preseason. Now I know. Released by by good luck to you.
|
|
|
|
Post by joshjones1 on Aug 14, 2010 17:28:40 GMT -8
|
|
|
|
Post by monty on Aug 14, 2010 17:40:17 GMT -8
The way I understand it is IR means full compensation of the contract and that person is unable to play that season, but does not take up a roster spot (and I think in the salary cap days did not count against the cap) vs. PUP which is part of the 80 man roster (and maybe even cut-down roster) and once a certain time starts they aren't eligible for the first 4 games, or something like that. He would be a restricted free agent after this year (either with the uncapped or cap rules), so if they want to control his rights they will keep him, but, I find it hard to believe they are going to pay him 400k when he has a history of injuries; maybe they really like him and will keep him . Going through waivers might be a formality just to see if they can get something for him - all NFL signs point to an out-right release and they'll pay him close to what he would have made had he stayed throughout camp. |
|
|
|
Post by johneaztec on Aug 14, 2010 20:15:09 GMT -8
The way I understand it is IR means full compensation of the contract and that person is unable to play that season, but does not take up a roster spot (and I think in the salary cap days did not count against the cap) vs. PUP which is part of the 80 man roster (and maybe even cut-down roster) and once a certain time starts they aren't eligible for the first 4 games, or something like that. He would be a restricted free agent after this year (either with the uncapped or cap rules), so if they want to control his rights they will keep him, but, I find it hard to believe they are going to pay him 400k when he has a history of injuries; maybe they really like him and will keep him . Going through waivers might be a formality just to see if they can get something for him - all NFL signs point to an out-right release and they'll pay him close to what he would have made had he stayed throughout camp. "Maybe they really like him." That's what I've heard. I could be wrong though. |
|
|
|
Post by joshjones1 on Aug 14, 2010 22:51:42 GMT -8
He probably only got like 10K. Hopefully he can rehab and get another shot somewhere next year. I was wondering what happens to guys trying to get a spot on a roster who get hurt in preseason. Now I know. Released by by good luck to you. It's a business. It's not high school football. |
|
|
|
Post by joshjones1 on Aug 14, 2010 22:53:28 GMT -8
The way I understand it is IR means full compensation of the contract and that person is unable to play that season, but does not take up a roster spot (and I think in the salary cap days did not count against the cap) vs. PUP which is part of the 80 man roster (and maybe even cut-down roster) and once a certain time starts they aren't eligible for the first 4 games, or something like that. He would be a restricted free agent after this year (either with the uncapped or cap rules), so if they want to control his rights they will keep him, but, I find it hard to believe they are going to pay him 400k when he has a history of injuries; maybe they really like him and will keep him . Going through waivers might be a formality just to see if they can get something for him - all NFL signs point to an out-right release and they'll pay him close to what he would have made had he stayed throughout camp. "Maybe they really like him." That's what I've heard. I could be wrong though. Could be. But to address your original statement......he is playing for the NFL minimum and none of it is guaranteed. They could release him and he would get nothing. If he heads on IR, seems like he gets a paycheck. |
|
