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Post by aztec70 on Jun 9, 2011 14:52:48 GMT -8
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Post by Bob Forsythe on Jun 10, 2011 18:39:41 GMT -8
The Republicants have a problem - they offer nothing other than more tax cuts for the rich, something that 80 percent of the voters agree should not happen. It's the litmus test - jobs will come if federal spending is cut. That is simplistic and incredibly stupid but then again, the right wing relies upon the uneducated to support them. After all, the evangelical right believes the world was "created" 6,000 years ago and demands we believe in their bull$#!+ religious ideology instead of thinking on their own. And unfortunately Pooh's grand children will grow up believing in Christian creation myths instead of understanding that they should live their lives as JC taught instead of worrying about getting into Heaven. Sorry Pooh; you are old and trying to get into Heaven. I'm not as old as you are and being raised in Methodism, I think your religious beliefs are bull$#!+. Please feel free to defend them and tell me I'm wrong. =Bob
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Post by Yoda on Jun 10, 2011 20:38:33 GMT -8
The Republicants have a problem - they offer nothing other than more tax cuts for the rich, something that 80 percent of the voters agree should not happen. It's the litmus test - jobs will come if federal spending is cut. That is simplistic and incredibly stupid but then again, the right wing relies upon the uneducated to support them. After all, the evangelical right believes the world was "created" 6,000 years ago and demands we believe in their bull$#!+ religious ideology instead of thinking on their own. And unfortunately Pooh's grand children will grow up believing in Christian creation myths instead of understanding that they should live their lives as JC taught instead of worrying about getting into Heaven. Sorry Pooh; you are old and trying to get into Heaven. I'm not as old as you are and being raised in Methodism, I think your religious beliefs are bull$#!+. Please feel free to defend them and tell me I'm wrong. =Bob Geeze Bob, my head is spinning after that one. I don't agree with much of anything that the far right espouses but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy. In my view, there is a battle for the soul of the Republican Party right now -- the business-based Republicans vs. the Tea Party ideologues vs. the religious ideologues. You've kind of mushed them altogether like they are one but they are very different and very much in conflict. And it is a very difficult alliance to hold together. Yoda out... .
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2011 20:54:41 GMT -8
Explain what? He was never a viable candidate. The two leading candidates as of now are Pawlenty and Romney, two former Republican governors of blue states. I guess that shoots both Mr "Moderate" and the Silly Old Hippie's nonsensical political analyses right out of the water.
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Post by Yoda on Jun 10, 2011 21:06:11 GMT -8
Explain what? He was never a viable candidate. The two leading candidates as of now are Pawlenty and Romney, two former Republican governors of blue states. I guess that shoots both Mr "Moderate" and the Silly Old Hippie's nonsensical political analyses right out of the water. Huh? How do your anointed early leaders shoot down anybody's analysis of anything? That's just silly. Yoda out... .
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Post by aztecwin on Jun 11, 2011 5:58:10 GMT -8
Explain what? He was never a viable candidate. The two leading candidates as of now are Pawlenty and Romney, two former Republican governors of blue states. I guess that shoots both Mr "Moderate" and the Silly Old Hippie's nonsensical political analyses right out of the water. Huh? How do your anointed early leaders shoot down anybody's analysis of anything? That's just silly. Yoda out... . I took it that he was referring to =Bob's non-sensible rant. It is sort of sad that Newt, the smartest guy in any room, has got to the point that he is just a joke. I would love to hear him debate most anyone, but he has lost it as far as organization is concerned and his message is getting a little cloudy. Stick a fork in Newt!
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Post by aztec70 on Jun 11, 2011 7:57:25 GMT -8
Explain what? He was never a viable candidate. The two leading candidates as of now are Pawlenty and Romney, two former Republican governors of blue states. I guess that shoots both Mr "Moderate" and the Silly Old Hippie's nonsensical political analyses right out of the water. Why was he never a viable candidate?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2011 9:17:44 GMT -8
Explain what? He was never a viable candidate. The two leading candidates as of now are Pawlenty and Romney, two former Republican governors of blue states. I guess that shoots both Mr "Moderate" and the Silly Old Hippie's nonsensical political analyses right out of the water. Why was he never a viable candidate? He doesn't have the support of the base and hasn't since he resigned the Speakership. His personal life and some of the crap he's said since he's been out of office has soured many of his former supporters. When he attacked Ryan's budget, he drove the final nail in his coffin.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2011 9:19:53 GMT -8
Why was he never a viable candidate? He might well have been a viable candidate nationally, but since he uses (or even knows) some polysyllabic words, his primary campaign is and even with flawless organization would have been a nonstarter. Right, because all Republicans are morons. Jackass...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2011 9:44:29 GMT -8
The Republicants have a problem - they offer nothing other than more tax cuts for the rich, something that 80 percent of the voters agree should not happen. It's the litmus test - jobs will come if federal spending is cut. That is simplistic and incredibly stupid but then again, the right wing relies upon the uneducated to support them. After all, the evangelical right believes the world was "created" 6,000 years ago and demands we believe in their bull$#!+ religious ideology instead of thinking on their own. And unfortunately Pooh's grand children will grow up believing in Christian creation myths instead of understanding that they should live their lives as JC taught instead of worrying about getting into Heaven. Sorry Pooh; you are old and trying to get into Heaven. I'm not as old as you are and being raised in Methodism, I think your religious beliefs are bull$#!+. Please feel free to defend them and tell me I'm wrong. =Bob Geeze Bob, my head is spinning after that one. I don't agree with much of anything that the far right espouses but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy. In my view, there is a battle for the soul of the Republican Party right now -- the business-based Republicans vs. the Tea Party ideologues vs. the religious ideologues. You've kind of mushed them altogether like they are one but they are very different and very much in conflict. And it is a very difficult alliance to hold together. Yoda out... . Ohhhh! It's a three-way steel cage death match! Winner gets the soul of the party! The tea party is nothing more than working class, for the most part moderate/conservative and largely until the last few years, non-political Republicans and Reagan Democrats. Their primary concern is the survival of the country which they see (rightly IMO) as being threatened by the radical leftists now in control of the government. They will crawl over broken glass to vote for whoever the party nominates. Their vote in the primary will go to the most electable small government, pro-business conservative. Pro-business conservatives will also vote for the most electable small government, pro-business conservative. Social issues have long since taken a back seat to security and economics within the Republican party at the National level. If by some miracle a liberal Republican such as Olympia Snowe or Scott Brown somehow found their way to the top of the ticket, you may see "social" conservatives (the purebred strain of which there are very few) sit out an election. But that's not going to happen and therefore social conservatives will also vote for the most electable small government, pro-business conservative. See a pattern here? I do too. The race in the primary will be won by the candidate that best articulates message all Republicans and the majority of the country wants to hear and that's how he or she plans to fix the utter disaster the radical left-wing of the Democratic party has created with their insane march towards national socialism.
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Post by uwaztec on Jun 11, 2011 9:57:32 GMT -8
He might well have been a viable candidate nationally, but since he uses (or even knows) some polysyllabic words, his primary campaign is and even with flawless organization would have been a nonstarter. Right, because all Republicans are morons. Jackass... Well...... at least one is.
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Post by 78aztec82 on Jun 11, 2011 10:22:36 GMT -8
Huh? How do your anointed early leaders shoot down anybody's analysis of anything? That's just silly. Yoda out... . I took it that he was referring to =Bob's non-sensible rant. It is sort of sad that Newt, the smartest guy in any room, has got to the point that he is just a joke. I would love to hear him debate most anyone, but he has lost it as far as organization is concerned and his message is getting a little cloudy. Stick a fork in Newt! He is a hell of a political scientist but a lousy politician. Two Newts...
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Post by inevitec on Jun 11, 2011 10:53:04 GMT -8
The Republicants have a problem - they offer nothing other than more tax cuts for the rich, something that 80 percent of the voters agree should not happen. It's the litmus test - jobs will come if federal spending is cut. That is simplistic and incredibly stupid but then again, the right wing relies upon the uneducated to support them. After all, the evangelical right believes the world was "created" 6,000 years ago and demands we believe in their bull$#!+ religious ideology instead of thinking on their own. And unfortunately Pooh's grand children will grow up believing in Christian creation myths instead of understanding that they should live their lives as JC taught instead of worrying about getting into Heaven. Sorry Pooh; you are old and trying to get into Heaven. I'm not as old as you are and being raised in Methodism, I think your religious beliefs are bull$#!+. Please feel free to defend them and tell me I'm wrong. =Bob Geeze Bob, my head is spinning after that one. I don't agree with much of anything that the far right espouses but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy. In my view, there is a battle for the soul of the Republican Party right now -- the business-based Republicans vs. the Tea Party ideologues vs. the religious ideologues. You've kind of mushed them altogether like they are one but they are very different and very much in conflict. And it is a very difficult alliance to hold together. Yoda out... . ". . .but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy." Oh yeah? What?
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Post by Yoda on Jun 11, 2011 11:28:01 GMT -8
Geeze Bob, my head is spinning after that one. I don't agree with much of anything that the far right espouses but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy. In my view, there is a battle for the soul of the Republican Party right now -- the business-based Republicans vs. the Tea Party ideologues vs. the religious ideologues. You've kind of mushed them altogether like they are one but they are very different and very much in conflict. And it is a very difficult alliance to hold together. Yoda out... . ". . .but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy." Oh yeah? What? They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. I'm not saying that I agree with what they offer. To the contrary, in my view: ~ the tax cuts are directed at the wealthy (and should be directed at the middle class), ~ the spending cuts are principally directed at the non-wealthy (many should be means tested), ~ the moral certitude is more about imposing their religious principals on others than it is about morality, ~ the sense of patriotism is overblown and arrogant in that they do not grant patriotism to their political opponents -- I believe that they are called libtards on this board -- and ~ the cuts in regulation go too far. But my point was that Bob was mistaken to state that all they offer are tax cuts for the wealthy. Whether you agree with them or not, they offer a full platform -- not merely a platform with a single plank. Yoda out... .
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Post by inevitec on Jun 11, 2011 12:49:24 GMT -8
". . .but they do offer more than just tax cuts for the wealthy." Oh yeah? What? They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. I'm not saying that I agree with what they offer. To the contrary, in my view: ~ the tax cuts are directed at the wealthy (and should be directed at the middle class), ~ the spending cuts are principally directed at the non-wealthy (many should be means tested), ~ the moral certitude is more about imposing their religious principals on others than it is about morality, ~ the sense of patriotism is overblown and arrogant in that they do not grant patriotism to their political opponents -- I believe that they are called libtards on this board -- and ~ the cuts in regulation go too far. But my point was that Bob was mistaken to state that all they offer are tax cuts for the wealthy. Whether you agree with them or not, they offer a full platform -- not merely a platform with a single plank. Yoda out... . "They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. . ." They offer spending cuts to reduce demand demand during a recession where lack of demand is the problem. They offer moral certitude? Moral certitude means I am right and you are wrong. That is all. Moral certitude. That is funny, funny, funny. Less regulation. Yes, and we know how well that has worked during the various financial crises we have endured periodically since Twenty Mule Team. Patriotism. Yes, in their own mind they offer patriotism. But so many of them have avoided service, one really must wonder why people believe what they say and not what they do. I guess you are right. Conservatives offer more than tax cuts. They offer a big sloppy dollop of bull sh^% as well. Yes, that is more than tax cuts. But since I can think, I think they offer only tax cuts.
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Post by aztecwin on Jun 11, 2011 16:15:05 GMT -8
They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. I'm not saying that I agree with what they offer. To the contrary, in my view: ~ the tax cuts are directed at the wealthy (and should be directed at the middle class), ~ the spending cuts are principally directed at the non-wealthy (many should be means tested), ~ the moral certitude is more about imposing their religious principals on others than it is about morality, ~ the sense of patriotism is overblown and arrogant in that they do not grant patriotism to their political opponents -- I believe that they are called libtards on this board -- and ~ the cuts in regulation go too far. But my point was that Bob was mistaken to state that all they offer are tax cuts for the wealthy. Whether you agree with them or not, they offer a full platform -- not merely a platform with a single plank. Yoda out... . "They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. . ." They offer spending cuts to reduce demand demand during a recession where lack of demand is the problem. They offer moral certitude? Moral certitude means I am right and you are wrong. That is all. Moral certitude. That is funny, funny, funny. Less regulation. Yes, and we know how well that has worked during the various financial crises we have endured periodically since Twenty Mule Team. Patriotism. Yes, in their own mind they offer patriotism. But so many of them have avoided service, one really must wonder why people believe what they say and not what they do. I guess you are right. Conservatives offer more than tax cuts. They offer a big sloppy dollop of bull sh^% as well. Yes, that is more than tax cuts. But since I can think, I think they offer only tax cuts. Funny! You lose all credibility when you talk about our financial crises and Twenty Mule Team when the major problems were Fannie, Freddie, Barney Frank and Dodd. Of course there are many facets to the financial problem, but you point to a minor element in comparison to foisting home ownership on unqualified buyers and unsustainable lending on the financial industry. Throw in unidentifiable investment derivatives and you have a stew made for disaster.
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Post by 78aztec82 on Jun 11, 2011 18:47:47 GMT -8
I've learned so much about republicans from the above exchange! Thanks guys for the help, so enlightening. I had also heard they wanted to kill all the children, enslave our working people, and generally be mean too.
Someone once told me they wanted to gut international AIDS programs and our committment to removing land mines and excess weapons from the developing world too.
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Post by inevitec on Jun 12, 2011 5:56:18 GMT -8
I've learned so much about republicans from the above exchange! Thanks guys for the help, so enlightening. I had also heard they wanted to kill all the children, enslave our working people, and generally be mean too. Someone once told me they wanted to gut international AIDS programs and our commitment to removing land mines and excess weapons from the developing world too. Republicans believe that business is in the best position to regulate itself. Republicans believe that tax cuts only to the most successful of us create jobs. Republicans believe that people must be forced to be responsible. Republicans believe that the government is the enemy. Republicans believe that economically unsuccessful people must be made to fend for themselves. It is the affect of these beliefs, '78, that make Republicans appear cruel. I cannot find evidence to support the fact that these beliefs have actually improved our condition. Since 1980, I have seen our nation decline economically as Republicans have become more shrill. This nation has seen a huge transfer of risk and responsibility from large entities, i.e. government and employers, to individuals over the last thirty years. This has occurred to a point that we are almost back to the 1880s. We are, individually more responsible for our Health care (and yet our care is more expensive than places where government runs the system). We are more responsible for our pensions, with 401ks (see stock market closing Friday). We are more responsible for our careers as corporations and employers sever relationships at an ever increasing rate, creating individual "free agents" with no bargaining power. We are individually more responsible for negotiating for our employment rights as unions have declined. The majority of the economic disruptions we have faced since 1980, savings and loans, the Enrons, the home mortgages were caused by the excesses of those entities that Republicans insist are overly regulated. Our corporations move jobs out of the country or to "right to work states" without control or compunction. The distribution of wealth in this country has become characterized by an almost Argentina style bifurcation. Our real wages are less than they were in 1980, our health care system, despite its expense, is rated no better than thirty fourth. Our poverty leads the industrialized world, our unemployment rate does not even begin to calculate the real damage at nine percent. Our children die more often than in other industrialized countries and our children are less effectively educated. Republicans vilify the only two currently available vehicles for evening the playing field, the government (which ostensibly represents the people, but with "Citizens United" type decisions its hard to tell), and unions which, despite their problems, serve to give individuals some power in negotiations with their employers. We are less free as a sense of unreasoned paranoia has overtaken us -to the point where our privacy is almost completely gone. The book 1984 is a joke compared to now. Now, being an observant person, I cannot help but connect these things to the rise of the Republican party and the persistence of their message since 1980. I know that other factors come into play, but you cannot dispute the Republican contribution to this decline. The problem is that Republicans do not see these changes as decline. And that '78, makes them appear cruel.
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Post by inevitec on Jun 12, 2011 6:02:36 GMT -8
"They offer spending cuts, moral certitude, a sense of patriotism, less government regulation and more. . ." They offer spending cuts to reduce demand demand during a recession where lack of demand is the problem. They offer moral certitude? Moral certitude means I am right and you are wrong. That is all. Moral certitude. That is funny, funny, funny. Less regulation. Yes, and we know how well that has worked during the various financial crises we have endured periodically since Twenty Mule Team. Patriotism. Yes, in their own mind they offer patriotism. But so many of them have avoided service, one really must wonder why people believe what they say and not what they do. I guess you are right. Conservatives offer more than tax cuts. They offer a big sloppy dollop of bull sh^% as well. Yes, that is more than tax cuts. But since I can think, I think they offer only tax cuts. Funny! You lose all credibility when you talk about our financial crises and Twenty Mule Team when the major problems were Fannie, Freddie, Barney Frank and Dodd. Of course there are many facets to the financial problem, but you point to a minor element in comparison to foisting home ownership on unqualified buyers and unsustainable lending on the financial industry. Throw in unidentifiable investment derivatives and you have a stew made for disaster. Our economic situation speaks for itself, Win. I am sorry about my reference to Reagan, whom I absolutely detested. I cleaned it up for our discussion. My real nickname for him is gratuitous and cruel.
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Post by aztecwin on Jun 12, 2011 6:58:02 GMT -8
I've learned so much about republicans from the above exchange! Thanks guys for the help, so enlightening. I had also heard they wanted to kill all the children, enslave our working people, and generally be mean too. Someone once told me they wanted to gut international AIDS programs and our commitment to removing land mines and excess weapons from the developing world too. Republicans believe that business is in the best position to regulate itself. Republicans believe that tax cuts only to the most successful of us create jobs. Republicans believe that people must be forced to be responsible. Republicans believe that the government is the enemy. Republicans believe that economically unsuccessful people must be made to fend for themselves. It is the affect of these beliefs, '78, that make Republicans appear cruel. I cannot find evidence to support the fact that these beliefs have actually improved our condition. Since 1980, I have seen our nation decline economically as Republicans have become more shrill. This nation has seen a huge transfer of risk and responsibility from large entities, i.e. government and employers, to individuals over the last thirty years. This has occurred to a point that we are almost back to the 1880s. We are, individually more responsible for our Health care (and yet our care is more expensive than places where government runs the system). We are more responsible for our pensions, with 401ks (see stock market closing Friday). We are more responsible for our careers as corporations and employers sever relationships at an ever increasing rate, creating individual "free agents" with no bargaining power. We are individually more responsible for negotiating for our employment rights as unions have declined. The majority of the economic disruptions we have faced since 1980, savings and loans, the Enrons, the home mortgages were caused by the excesses of those entities that Republicans insist are overly regulated. Our corporations move jobs out of the country or to "right to work states" without control or compunction. The distribution of wealth in this country has become characterized by an almost Argentina style bifurcation. Our real wages are less than they were in 1980, our health care system, despite its expense, is rated no better than thirty fourth. Our poverty leads the industrialized world, our unemployment rate does not even begin to calculate the real damage at nine percent. Our children die more often than in other industrialized countries and our children are less effectively educated. Republicans vilify the only two currently available vehicles for evening the playing field, the government (which ostensibly represents the people, but with "Citizens United" type decisions its hard to tell), and unions which, despite their problems, serve to give individuals some power in negotiations with their employers. We are less free as a sense of unreasoned paranoia has overtaken us -to the point where our privacy is almost completely gone. The book 1984 is a joke compared to now. Now, being an observant person, I cannot help but connect these things to the rise of the Republican party and the persistence of their message since 1980. I know that other factors come into play, but you cannot dispute the Republican contribution to this decline. The problem is that Republicans do not see these changes as decline. And that '78, makes them appear cruel. It must be horrible to live in a world that you see like that. Millions of immigrants both legal and illegal see it completely differently. Opportunity and innovation vary inversely with onerous regulation and taxes. Do you have pity parties with =Bob and Aztec70 to whine and cry about your miserable lives or are you one of us who thanks God every day for the wonderful country where we were born or chose to migrate to?
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