Pee Yu

[sdcoug]

Aug 1, 2023 16:03:50 GMT -8 docmm said:

Aug 1, 2023 13:56:57 GMT -8 sdcoug said:

How did Soto not give full effort? You have to hold up on a line drive & he ran hard. He was out by 15 feet. Tatis wouldn't have scored on that. It's solely on Williams, not Soto.

The ball was IN Mannys mitt! Being wet isn't a factor if the ball is held in the webbing. That's definitely on Manny.

Can't see how anyone would blame Soto and give Manny a pass when blame is clearly the opposite.

Bogaerts is 8th in OPS among all SS's this year, and 4th best over the past 30 days. He hasn't lived up to his salary, but neither have any of the FA SS's. He has the 5th best WAR on our team, and top 70 in the league. I have no issue with his signing and think he'll have a better year next season.

The failure has been Cronenworth not delivering all season until this past week. He's a much bigger problem than Bogaerts.

Soto completely stopped halfway up the line. If he had finished the run or made the catcher chase him, Bogaerts might have reached 2B instead of stopping at 1B.

Sorry but a wet ball in a wet glove IS more difficult. I didn't say it wasn't his fault but we lost the game in the top of the 10th not the bottom.

What's Bogaerts RISP numbers, do you know?

Soto held up until he knew the line drive was falling, which is baseball 101 and what he should have done. Jakes not getting to second in that scenario no matter what Soto does.

Wet balls don't slip out of closed gloves. Manny relaxed his grip, plain & simple. He screwed up. I'm sure hed tell you the same. And considering it would have been 1 out, man on first, had the next batters played out as they did NOBODY SCORES! Yes, the screw up cost us the game. Or at least an opportunity to go to the 11th otherwise.

Bogaerts has a .703 OPS with RISP, which is better than Cronenworth (.669), who was the problem up until recently. They're on a team that only has 4 guys at. 800+, and has been a bad RISP hitting team in general. Bogaerts has underperformed his salary in year 1, but he's not the main issue. Plus, FWIW, he's been better than other FA SS's like Correa & Turner, as well as other SS's like Pena, Abrams, Anderson, Franco & Hernandez. But to answer your question, yes, I know. I've been paying attention. I've watched our entire team struggle in that situation, especially Cronenworth. You?

[aztecryan]

Aug 2, 2023 7:44:55 GMT -8 sdcoug said:

Aug 1, 2023 16:03:50 GMT -8 docmm said:

Soto completely stopped halfway up the line. If he had finished the run or made the catcher chase him, Bogaerts might have reached 2B instead of stopping at 1B.

Sorry but a wet ball in a wet glove IS more difficult. I didn't say it wasn't his fault but we lost the game in the top of the 10th not the bottom.

What's Bogaerts RISP numbers, do you know?

Soto held up until he knew the line drive was falling, which is baseball 101 and what he should have done. Jakes not getting to second in that scenario no matter what Soto does.

Wet balls don't slip out of closed gloves. Manny relaxed his grip, plain & simple. He screwed up. I'm sure hed tell you the same. And considering it would have been 1 out, man on first, had the next batters played out as they did NOBODY SCORES! Yes, the screw up cost us the game. Or at least an opportunity to go to the 11th otherwise.

Bogaerts has a .703 OPS with RISP, which is better than Cronenworth (.669), who was the problem up until recently. They're on a team that only has 4 guys at. 800+, and has been a bad RISP hitting team in general. Bogaerts has underperformed his salary in year 1, but he's not the main issue. Plus, FWIW, he's been better than other FA SS's like Correa & Turner, as well as other SS's like Pena, Abrams, Anderson, Franco & Hernandez. But to answer your question, yes, I know. I've been paying attention. I've watched our entire team struggle in that situation, especially Cronenworth. You?

Fully expect a Bogaerts bounceback in year two.

[sdcoug]

Aug 2, 2023 7:47:29 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 2, 2023 7:44:55 GMT -8 sdcoug said:

Soto held up until he knew the line drive was falling, which is baseball 101 and what he should have done. Jakes not getting to second in that scenario no matter what Soto does.

Wet balls don't slip out of closed gloves. Manny relaxed his grip, plain & simple. He screwed up. I'm sure hed tell you the same. And considering it would have been 1 out, man on first, had the next batters played out as they did NOBODY SCORES! Yes, the screw up cost us the game. Or at least an opportunity to go to the 11th otherwise.

Bogaerts has a .703 OPS with RISP, which is better than Cronenworth (.669), who was the problem up until recently. They're on a team that only has 4 guys at. 800+, and has been a bad RISP hitting team in general. Bogaerts has underperformed his salary in year 1, but he's not the main issue. Plus, FWIW, he's been better than other FA SS's like Correa & Turner, as well as other SS's like Pena, Abrams, Anderson, Franco & Hernandez. But to answer your question, yes, I know. I've been paying attention. I've watched our entire team struggle in that situation, especially Cronenworth. You?

Fully expect a Bogaerts bounceback in year two.

Yep, same. I look at Lindor in year 2 after struggling bigtime in year 1 after signing a big contract. Plus, hopefully his wrist heals. His resume & and references are too strong not to.

[docmm]

Aug 2, 2023 7:44:55 GMT -8 sdcoug said:

Aug 1, 2023 16:03:50 GMT -8 docmm said:

Soto completely stopped halfway up the line. If he had finished the run or made the catcher chase him, Bogaerts might have reached 2B instead of stopping at 1B.

Sorry but a wet ball in a wet glove IS more difficult. I didn't say it wasn't his fault but we lost the game in the top of the 10th not the bottom.

What's Bogaerts RISP numbers, do you know?

Soto held up until he knew the line drive was falling, which is baseball 101 and what he should have done. Jakes not getting to second in that scenario no matter what Soto does.

Wet balls don't slip out of closed gloves. Manny relaxed his grip, plain & simple. He screwed up. I'm sure hed tell you the same. And considering it would have been 1 out, man on first, had the next batters played out as they did NOBODY SCORES! Yes, the screw up cost us the game. Or at least an opportunity to go to the 11th otherwise.

Bogaerts has a .703 OPS with RISP, which is better than Cronenworth (.669), who was the problem up until recently. They're on a team that only has 4 guys at. 800+, and has been a bad RISP hitting team in general. Bogaerts has underperformed his salary in year 1, but he's not the main issue. Plus, FWIW, he's been better than other FA SS's like Correa & Turner, as well as other SS's like Pena, Abrams, Anderson, Franco & Hernandez. But to answer your question, yes, I know. I've been paying attention. I've watched our entire team struggle in that situation, especially Cronenworth. You?

Let me preface this by saying I generally appreciate the information and insights you post on multiple threads. I asked you a simple question to honestly find out where the RISP numbers can be found. Your direct responses almost always have a kind of pissy, combative tone to them. Not sure why you feel the need to do that.

[aardvark]

Aug 2, 2023 13:35:55 GMT -8 docmm said:

Aug 2, 2023 7:44:55 GMT -8 sdcoug said:

Soto held up until he knew the line drive was falling, which is baseball 101 and what he should have done. Jakes not getting to second in that scenario no matter what Soto does.

Wet balls don't slip out of closed gloves. Manny relaxed his grip, plain & simple. He screwed up. I'm sure hed tell you the same. And considering it would have been 1 out, man on first, had the next batters played out as they did NOBODY SCORES! Yes, the screw up cost us the game. Or at least an opportunity to go to the 11th otherwise.

Bogaerts has a .703 OPS with RISP, which is better than Cronenworth (.669), who was the problem up until recently. They're on a team that only has 4 guys at. 800+, and has been a bad RISP hitting team in general. Bogaerts has underperformed his salary in year 1, but he's not the main issue. Plus, FWIW, he's been better than other FA SS's like Correa & Turner, as well as other SS's like Pena, Abrams, Anderson, Franco & Hernandez. But to answer your question, yes, I know. I've been paying attention. I've watched our entire team struggle in that situation, especially Cronenworth. You?

Let me preface this by saying I generally appreciate the information and insights you post on multiple threads. I asked you a simple question to honestly find out where the RISP numbers can be found. Your direct responses almost always have a kind of pissy, combative tone to them. Not sure why you feel the need to do that.

His average with RISP is .198.

[junior]

Boegarts' OPS+ was 139 four years ago and 135 the year before that. It's held pretty steady at 129 since 2020. Then he came to San Diego… it's edging closer and closer to 100. Still, OPS+ should account for Petco and playing in the NL this year, even though interleague play has been happening for awhile now. His OPS+ right now is 106

And the downward trajectory has to be a concern. Now maybe it's part and parcel of his wrist issues, but that was not a secret when he was traded. Pretty sure this version of Boegarts is not the one the Padres thought they were getting… maybe today's 3-5 day will get him off the pot.

[docmm]

Aug 2, 2023 14:10:56 GMT -8 aardvark said:

Aug 2, 2023 13:35:55 GMT -8 docmm said:

Let me preface this by saying I generally appreciate the information and insights you post on multiple threads. I asked you a simple question to honestly find out where the RISP numbers can be found. Your direct responses almost always have a kind of pissy, combative tone to them. Not sure why you feel the need to do that.

His average with RISP is .198.

Thank you. Where do you find the RISP stats?

[aardvark]

Aug 2, 2023 15:59:47 GMT -8 docmm said:

Aug 2, 2023 14:10:56 GMT -8 aardvark said:

His average with RISP is .198.

Thank you. Where do you find the RISP stats?

I just Googled "Xander Bogaerts batting average with RISP 2023 season".

[docmm]

Padre DHs traded for at the deadline:

2022 SD Josh Bell 177-34-.192 with 3 HRs and 14 RBI
2023 Mia Josh Bell 31-10-.323 with 3 HRs and 7 RBI

2023 SD Cooper and Choi 14-1-.071 with 0 HRs and 0 RBI

Padre DHs traded for last offseason

2023 SD Carpenter and Cruz 312-63-.202 with 9 HRs and 50 RBI

Would have liked to see what this team would have looked like if they'd have spread Bogearts $25,000,000 around instead, put Kim or Tatis at SS and filled about 4-5 other roster spots with good, solid Major Leaguers.

[aztecryan]

Aug 9, 2023 11:57:14 GMT -8 docmm said:

Padre DHs traded for at the deadline:

2022 SD Josh Bell 177-34-.192 with 3 HRs and 14 RBI
2023 Mia Josh Bell 31-10-.323 with 3 HRs and 7 RBI

2023 SD Cooper and Choi 14-1-.071 with 0 HRs and 0 RBI

Padre DHs traded for last offseason

2023 SD Carpenter and Cruz 312-63-.202 with 9 HRs and 50 RBI

Would have liked to see what this team would have looked like if they'd have spread Bogearts $25,000,000 around instead, put Kim or Tatis at SS and filled about 4-5 other roster spots with good, solid Major Leaguers.

Worse.

[johneaztec]

Aug 9, 2023 11:57:14 GMT -8 docmm said:

Padre DHs traded for at the deadline:

2022 SD Josh Bell 177-34-.192 with 3 HRs and 14 RBI
2023 Mia Josh Bell 31-10-.323 with 3 HRs and 7 RBI

2023 SD Cooper and Choi 14-1-.071 with 0 HRs and 0 RBI

Padre DHs traded for last offseason

2023 SD Carpenter and Cruz 312-63-.202 with 9 HRs and 50 RBI

Would have liked to see what this team would have looked like if they'd have spread Bogearts $25,000,000 around instead, put Kim or Tatis at SS and filled about 4-5 other roster spots with good, solid Major Leaguers.

Interesting, but we'll never know.

[docmm]

Aug 9, 2023 12:06:19 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 9, 2023 11:57:14 GMT -8 docmm said:

Padre DHs traded for at the deadline:

2022 SD Josh Bell 177-34-.192 with 3 HRs and 14 RBI
2023 Mia Josh Bell 31-10-.323 with 3 HRs and 7 RBI

2023 SD Cooper and Choi 14-1-.071 with 0 HRs and 0 RBI

Padre DHs traded for last offseason

2023 SD Carpenter and Cruz 312-63-.202 with 9 HRs and 50 RBI

Would have liked to see what this team would have looked like if they'd have spread Bogearts $25,000,000 around instead, put Kim or Tatis at SS and filled about 4-5 other roster spots with good, solid Major Leaguers.

Worse.

You certainly deal in complete absolutes, don't you? You have no idea what a differently constructed team might have looked like given what that much extra money to spread around would have accomplished. And before you go telling me how great Bogaert's OPS is compared to others, talk about his robust .196 with RISP and the fact that 18% of his hits are infield hits. He's been batting clean-up for just about the entire season and he has 37 RBI to show for it. That's 7th on the team, even behind Grisham.

Is he an OK hitter/fielder, I guess yes. Is an older(31 on Oct 1st) infielder worth $280,000,000 over the next 11 years? I don't think so.

[aztecryan]

Aug 9, 2023 12:29:33 GMT -8 docmm said:

Aug 9, 2023 12:06:19 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Worse.

You certainly deal in complete absolutes, don't you? You have no idea what a differently constructed team might have looked like given what that much extra money to spread around would have accomplished. And before you go telling me how great Bogaert's OPS is compared to others, talk about his robust .196 with RISP and the fact that 18% of his hits are infield hits. He's been batting clean-up for just about the entire season and he has 37 RBI to show for it. That's 7th on the team, even behind Grisham.

Is he an OK hitter/fielder, I guess yes. Is an older(31 on Oct 1st) infielder worth $280,000,000 over the next 11 years? I don't think so.

Usually, no. But this has been discussed and debated forever and the results are pretty clear, so here, I do. The quality side almost always wins out over the bulk approach because superstars tend to be superstars and others just aren't. Give me one Mookie Betts over five league average players 24/7/365.

Couple more problems here: Tatis is not moving back to the infield. Not sure how many times that needs to be said, but it's just not happening. Second, the primary areas of need (first base and DH) tend to offer you the lowest ceiling because of their lack of defensive value and the glut of mediocrity attached. Third, they tried your approach in free agency. They went after Abreu (who has been horrendous for most of the season) and then they went after Rizzo, who has concussion issues now. So your thought was to spread $25M amongst four or five players that are basically limited to first base/DH? Nightmare.

And yeah, I kinda do know. Because you can't cover up roster flaws with bad organizational process. That isn't changing just because you added a few more bodies, unfortunately. Bad process is bad process, whether it's medical staff complications, analytics, roster balance, etc. It doesn't change the end result. It's directly why you see good organizations sustain excellence even after the names on the lineup change, while other teams flounder even after surrounding themselves with star-level talent.

Now YOU are the one talking in absolutes about Bogaerts. You might have some validity if you took into account virtually every player at the top of the market who switched teams this year has struggled mightily. Trea Turner? Disaster. Dansby Swanson had two brutal months before finding some power. Judge (I know, still a Yankee) has dealt with injuries that have significantly hurt his production.

Who else would you have signed, out of this last free agent class....and to play where? There were only a couple of positions to theoretically upgrade at. They tried, they got outbid, they pivoted. We aren't having this conversation if Bogaerts had two healthy wrists.

[johneaztec]

Aug 9, 2023 13:00:39 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 9, 2023 12:29:33 GMT -8 docmm said:

You certainly deal in complete absolutes, don't you? You have no idea what a differently constructed team might have looked like given what that much extra money to spread around would have accomplished. And before you go telling me how great Bogaert's OPS is compared to others, talk about his robust .196 with RISP and the fact that 18% of his hits are infield hits. He's been batting clean-up for just about the entire season and he has 37 RBI to show for it. That's 7th on the team, even behind Grisham.

Is he an OK hitter/fielder, I guess yes. Is an older(31 on Oct 1st) infielder worth $280,000,000 over the next 11 years? I don't think so.

Usually, no. But this has been discussed and debated forever and the results are pretty clear, so here, I do. The quality side almost always wins out over the bulk approach because superstars tend to be superstars and others just aren't. Give me one Mookie Betts over five league average players 24/7/365.

Couple more problems here: Tatis is not moving back to the infield. Not sure how many times that needs to be said, but it's just not happening. Second, the primary areas of need (first base and DH) tend to offer you the lowest ceiling because of their lack of defensive value and the glut of mediocrity attached. Third, they tried your approach in free agency. They went after Abreu (who has been horrendous for most of the season) and then they went after Rizzo, who has concussion issues now. So your thought was to spread $25M amongst four or five players that are basically limited to first base/DH? Nightmare.

And yeah, I kinda do know. Because you can't cover up roster flaws with bad organizational process. That isn't changing just because you added a few more bodies, unfortunately. Bad process is bad process, whether it's medical staff complications, analytics, roster balance, etc. It doesn't change the end result. It's directly why you see good organizations sustain excellence even after the names on the lineup change, while other teams flounder even after surrounding themselves with star-level talent.

Now YOU are the one talking in absolutes about Bogaerts. You might have some validity if you took into account virtually every player at the top of the market who switched teams this year has struggled mightily. Trea Turner? Disaster. Dansby Swanson had two brutal months before finding some power. Judge (I know, still a Yankee) has dealt with injuries that have significantly hurt his production.

Who else would you have signed, out of this last free agent class....and to play where? There were only a couple of positions to theoretically upgrade at. They tried, they got outbid, they pivoted. We aren't having this conversation if Bogaerts had two healthy wrists.

Tell that to all the lower half payroll teams that will definitely make the playoffs, and some that have a very good chance. It's been proven that it's not always a Mookie Betts over 5 average to above average players, theory.

[aztecryan]

Aug 9, 2023 15:41:36 GMT -8 johneaztec said:

Aug 9, 2023 13:00:39 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Usually, no. But this has been discussed and debated forever and the results are pretty clear, so here, I do. The quality side almost always wins out over the bulk approach because superstars tend to be superstars and others just aren't. Give me one Mookie Betts over five league average players 24/7/365.

Couple more problems here: Tatis is not moving back to the infield. Not sure how many times that needs to be said, but it's just not happening. Second, the primary areas of need (first base and DH) tend to offer you the lowest ceiling because of their lack of defensive value and the glut of mediocrity attached. Third, they tried your approach in free agency. They went after Abreu (who has been horrendous for most of the season) and then they went after Rizzo, who has concussion issues now. So your thought was to spread $25M amongst four or five players that are basically limited to first base/DH? Nightmare.

And yeah, I kinda do know. Because you can't cover up roster flaws with bad organizational process. That isn't changing just because you added a few more bodies, unfortunately. Bad process is bad process, whether it's medical staff complications, analytics, roster balance, etc. It doesn't change the end result. It's directly why you see good organizations sustain excellence even after the names on the lineup change, while other teams flounder even after surrounding themselves with star-level talent.

Now YOU are the one talking in absolutes about Bogaerts. You might have some validity if you took into account virtually every player at the top of the market who switched teams this year has struggled mightily. Trea Turner? Disaster. Dansby Swanson had two brutal months before finding some power. Judge (I know, still a Yankee) has dealt with injuries that have significantly hurt his production.

Who else would you have signed, out of this last free agent class....and to play where? There were only a couple of positions to theoretically upgrade at. They tried, they got outbid, they pivoted. We aren't having this conversation if Bogaerts had two healthy wrists.

Tell that to all the lower half payroll teams that will definitely make the playoffs, and some that have a very good chance. It's been proven that it's not always a Mookie Betts over 5 average to above average players, theory.

I'm specifically referring to free agency and trade acquisitions, in which case, yes it has been proven time and again that targeting superstars is better than targeting quantity packages of players. The star tends to outproduce the rest of the field. This isn't a strong counterargument, we aren't talking about the same thing.

But just to illustrate how wrong this is: If the season ended today, every team in an NL playoff spot is a top 12 payroll team, excluding Milwaukee, who just happens to be on top of a mediocre NL Central.

[johneaztec]

Aug 9, 2023 16:20:24 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 9, 2023 15:41:36 GMT -8 johneaztec said:

Tell that to all the lower half payroll teams that will definitely make the playoffs, and some that have a very good chance. It's been proven that it's not always a Mookie Betts over 5 average to above average players, theory.

I'm specifically referring to free agency and trade acquisitions, in which case, yes it has been proven time and again that targeting superstars is better than targeting quantity packages of players. The star tends to outproduce the rest of the field. This isn't a strong counterargument, we aren't talking about the same thing.

But just to illustrate how wrong this is: If the season ended today, every team in an NL playoff spot is a top 12 payroll team, excluding Milwaukee, who just happens to be on top of a mediocre NL Central.

For one, it doesn't make anything wrong until the season is over. Also, of course you'll cherry pick with "If the season were to end now" and of course you'll cherry pick by only using the NL. In the AL 3 teams that are currently in the playoffs if it ended today are in the bottom area of the payroll department.

There are SEVERAL lower payroll on the cusp of making the playoffs, as well. So, no, you're wrong to say it's wrong at this point. As a matter of fact, 2 of the 3 top teams in all of baseball currently are in the bottom area of payrolls. #27 out of 30, Tampa Bay, and #28 out of 30, Baltimore. So yeah, wrong again.

[aztecryan]

Aug 9, 2023 16:48:03 GMT -8 johneaztec said:

Aug 9, 2023 16:20:24 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

I'm specifically referring to free agency and trade acquisitions, in which case, yes it has been proven time and again that targeting superstars is better than targeting quantity packages of players. The star tends to outproduce the rest of the field. This isn't a strong counterargument, we aren't talking about the same thing.

But just to illustrate how wrong this is: If the season ended today, every team in an NL playoff spot is a top 12 payroll team, excluding Milwaukee, who just happens to be on top of a mediocre NL Central.

For one, it doesn't make anything wrong until the season is over. Also, of course you'll cherry pick with "If the season we're to end now" and of course you'll cherry pick by only using the NL. In the AL 3 teams that are currently in the playoffs if it ended today are in the bottom area of the payroll department.

There are SEVERAL lower payroll on the cusp of making the playoffs, as well. So, no, you're wrong to say it's wrong at this point. As a matter of fact, 2 of the 3 top teams in all of baseball currently are in the bottom area of payrolls. #27 out of 30 Tampa Bay, and #29 out of 30 Baltimore. So yeah, wrong again.

I didn't even bother to address Tampa Bay because they are a clear outlier (They do this every season because of one specific thing) and Baltimore is in year five of their five year rebuild. So, long story short, of the 12 teams currently in playoffs spots, almost 70% of them are high payroll teams.

40% of the league makes the playoffs. But that's not the point of discussion, free agency and trades are.

[sdsuball]

Aug 9, 2023 13:00:39 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 9, 2023 12:29:33 GMT -8 docmm said:

You certainly deal in complete absolutes, don't you? You have no idea what a differently constructed team might have looked like given what that much extra money to spread around would have accomplished. And before you go telling me how great Bogaert's OPS is compared to others, talk about his robust .196 with RISP and the fact that 18% of his hits are infield hits. He's been batting clean-up for just about the entire season and he has 37 RBI to show for it. That's 7th on the team, even behind Grisham.

Is he an OK hitter/fielder, I guess yes. Is an older(31 on Oct 1st) infielder worth $280,000,000 over the next 11 years? I don't think so.

Usually, no. But this has been discussed and debated forever and the results are pretty clear, so here, I do. The quality side almost always wins out over the bulk approach because superstars tend to be superstars and others just aren't. Give me one Mookie Betts over five league average players 24/7/365.

Couple more problems here: Tatis is not moving back to the infield. Not sure how many times that needs to be said, but it's just not happening. Second, the primary areas of need (first base and DH) tend to offer you the lowest ceiling because of their lack of defensive value and the glut of mediocrity attached. Third, they tried your approach in free agency. They went after Abreu (who has been horrendous for most of the season) and then they went after Rizzo, who has concussion issues now. So your thought was to spread $25M amongst four or five players that are basically limited to first base/DH? Nightmare.

And yeah, I kinda do know. Because you can't cover up roster flaws with bad organizational process. That isn't changing just because you added a few more bodies, unfortunately. Bad process is bad process, whether it's medical staff complications, analytics, roster balance, etc. It doesn't change the end result. It's directly why you see good organizations sustain excellence even after the names on the lineup change, while other teams flounder even after surrounding themselves with star-level talent.

Now YOU are the one talking in absolutes about Bogaerts. You might have some validity if you took into account virtually every player at the top of the market who switched teams this year has struggled mightily. Trea Turner? Disaster. Dansby Swanson had two brutal months before finding some power. Judge (I know, still a Yankee) has dealt with injuries that have significantly hurt his production.

Who else would you have signed, out of this last free agent class....and to play where? There were only a couple of positions to theoretically upgrade at. They tried, they got outbid, they pivoted. We aren't having this conversation if Bogaerts had two healthy wrists.

Maybe Bogaerts should have taken/should take more time off so that he could come back stronger.

[aztecryan]

Aug 9, 2023 17:24:48 GMT -8 sdsuball said:

Aug 9, 2023 13:00:39 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Usually, no. But this has been discussed and debated forever and the results are pretty clear, so here, I do. The quality side almost always wins out over the bulk approach because superstars tend to be superstars and others just aren't. Give me one Mookie Betts over five league average players 24/7/365.

Couple more problems here: Tatis is not moving back to the infield. Not sure how many times that needs to be said, but it's just not happening. Second, the primary areas of need (first base and DH) tend to offer you the lowest ceiling because of their lack of defensive value and the glut of mediocrity attached. Third, they tried your approach in free agency. They went after Abreu (who has been horrendous for most of the season) and then they went after Rizzo, who has concussion issues now. So your thought was to spread $25M amongst four or five players that are basically limited to first base/DH? Nightmare.

And yeah, I kinda do know. Because you can't cover up roster flaws with bad organizational process. That isn't changing just because you added a few more bodies, unfortunately. Bad process is bad process, whether it's medical staff complications, analytics, roster balance, etc. It doesn't change the end result. It's directly why you see good organizations sustain excellence even after the names on the lineup change, while other teams flounder even after surrounding themselves with star-level talent.

Now YOU are the one talking in absolutes about Bogaerts. You might have some validity if you took into account virtually every player at the top of the market who switched teams this year has struggled mightily. Trea Turner? Disaster. Dansby Swanson had two brutal months before finding some power. Judge (I know, still a Yankee) has dealt with injuries that have significantly hurt his production.

Who else would you have signed, out of this last free agent class....and to play where? There were only a couple of positions to theoretically upgrade at. They tried, they got outbid, they pivoted. We aren't having this conversation if Bogaerts had two healthy wrists.

Maybe Bogaerts should have taken/should take more time off so that he could come back stronger.

Not a thing that's just going to get better.

[sdsuball]

Aug 9, 2023 17:30:18 GMT -8 aztecryan said:

Aug 9, 2023 17:24:48 GMT -8 sdsuball said:

Maybe Bogaerts should have taken/should take more time off so that he could come back stronger.

Not a thing that's just going to get better.

Needs surgery?