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Post by aardvark on Nov 29, 2018 17:50:43 GMT -8
...to a 2-year/$15 million deal. And with his TJ surgery, he probably won't pitch an inning in 2019. Guess they are trying to make the Headley/Mitchell acquisition last year look good.
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Post by aztecmusician on Nov 30, 2018 0:45:36 GMT -8
He was pretty good, 4-5 years ago, however it is questionable if he can regain his previous success.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2018 6:41:30 GMT -8
This is interesting.
If he can return to his 2014 form and durability when he returns in 2020, it could be a real bargain in a year in which the Padres "should" be contending.
But its also a calculated risk given the major arm and knee injuries he had in the past.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2018 8:43:31 GMT -8
From what I have been reading, the 15 million is guaranteed. That's 5 million more than what most pitchers get in a 2 year deal after TJ surgery. Hope this works out for both parties. However, seems like a huge risk knowing that Richards has been plagued with several injuries in the past.
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Post by survalli on Nov 30, 2018 11:20:02 GMT -8
He was pretty good, 4-5 years ago, however it is questionable if he can regain his previous success. he was avg. (which is better than a padre pitcher). waste of money. its doubtful he will ever pitch again. typical Preller move. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2018 11:33:45 GMT -8
He was pretty good, 4-5 years ago, however it is questionable if he can regain his previous success. he was avg. (which is better than a padre pitcher). waste of money. its doubtful he will ever pitch again. typical Preller move. At his peak in 2014, he was definitely better than average. That isn't a matter of opinion, it's fact. 2014: Games started: 26 ERA: 2.61 Record: 13-4 Strikeouts: 164 WHIP: 1.038 WAR: 4.4He was in the Cy Young conversation until he blew out his knee in late August that year. Why would you say it's doubtful he would ever pitch again? A bit extreme, isnt it? 100 guys return from TJ surgery every year, do they not? Even his 2015 season was better than "average. www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/richaga01.shtml#all_leaderboard |
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Post by aztecryan on Nov 30, 2018 12:24:44 GMT -8
Typical knee-jerk reaction. If Richards put some solid mid-rotation numbers in 2020, it is a slam dunk win. This is a clear sign, once again, that they view 2020 as the window.
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Post by aardvark on Nov 30, 2018 15:08:44 GMT -8
he was avg. (which is better than a padre pitcher). waste of money. its doubtful he will ever pitch again. typical Preller move. At his peak in 2014, he was definitely better than average. That isn't a matter of opinion, it's fact. 2014: Games started: 26 ERA: 2.61 Record: 13-4 Strikeouts: 164 WHIP: 1.038 WAR: 4.4He was in the Cy Young conversation until he blew out his knee in late August that year. Why would you say it's doubtful he would ever pitch again? A bit extreme, isnt it? 100 guys return from TJ surgery every year, do they not? Even his 2015 season was better than "average. www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/richaga01.shtml#all_leaderboardThe main problem with the argument for Richards is when he did these "above average" things--2014 and 2015. By the time he pitches again in 2020, at least he will be well rested. |
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Post by aztecmusician on Dec 1, 2018 13:01:15 GMT -8
Typical knee-jerk reaction. If Richards put some solid mid-rotation numbers in 2020, it is a slam dunk win. This is a clear sign, once again, that they view 2020 as the window. Key word in your statement: If I hope he doesn’t become another Mark Prior. |
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Post by aztecryan on Dec 1, 2018 13:40:25 GMT -8
If he does, there's no risk in the deal. No harm done.
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Post by AztecBill on Dec 1, 2018 21:30:58 GMT -8
Great deal for the Padres. There is risk but the upside could be special much better than any pitcher available at that price. This is a 2020 move.
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Post by aardvark on Dec 1, 2018 22:41:03 GMT -8
Great deal for Richards. There is risk. This is a bad move. FIFY |
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Post by AztecBill on Dec 2, 2018 0:41:25 GMT -8
Great deal for Richards. There is risk. This is a bad move. FIFY Pitchers come back from Tommy John all the time and excel. He was very good before but made the bad decision to try other means of healing his elbow before finally getting the surgery. If it is a 50/50 chance of him coming back to his prior performance, it is a great deal. He was #1 in baseball in ball rotation on his slider. The swing and miss rate was 45%. I think there is a good chance of him being a #1 pitcher 2020. This is not the only move the Padres will make. It is just giving them another option in 2020. The Dodgers also tried to sign him. |
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Post by aardvark on Dec 2, 2018 8:40:09 GMT -8
Pitchers come back from Tommy John all the time and excel. He was very good before but made the bad decision to try other means of healing his elbow before finally getting the surgery. If it is a 50/50 chance of him coming back to his prior performance, it is a great deal. He was #1 in baseball in ball rotation on his slider. The swing and miss rate was 45%. I think there is a good chance of him being a #1 pitcher 2020. This is not the only move the Padres will make. It is just giving them another option in 2020. The Dodgers also tried to sign him. Yes, pitchers do come back from TJ surgery all the time. What isn't done is signing the pitcher to a multi-year deal, while the pitchers rehabs during the entire first year. I would also agree that the club isn't done making moves, but I can only hope they are done making any other deals like this. It's also great that the Dodgers tried to sign him. It's also great for them that they didn't. |
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Post by aztecryan on Dec 2, 2018 11:03:03 GMT -8
Pitchers come back from Tommy John all the time and excel. He was very good before but made the bad decision to try other means of healing his elbow before finally getting the surgery. If it is a 50/50 chance of him coming back to his prior performance, it is a great deal. He was #1 in baseball in ball rotation on his slider. The swing and miss rate was 45%. I think there is a good chance of him being a #1 pitcher 2020. This is not the only move the Padres will make. It is just giving them another option in 2020. The Dodgers also tried to sign him. Yes, pitchers do come back from TJ surgery all the time. What isn't done is signing the pitcher to a multi-year deal, while the pitchers rehabs during the entire first year. I would also agree that the club isn't done making moves, but I can only hope they are done making any other deals like this. It's also great that the Dodgers tried to sign him. It's also great for them that they didn't. This is false. This deal has happened multiple times before with guys like Pineda and Eovaldi. Happened with the Cubs and Drew Smyly as well. The money here is slightly higher than normal, but Richards is better than either of those guys previous to him. There was a LOT of interest in Richards. It wasn't just LA and San Diego. |
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Post by aardvark on Dec 2, 2018 17:56:57 GMT -8
Yes, pitchers do come back from TJ surgery all the time. What isn't done is signing the pitcher to a multi-year deal, while the pitchers rehabs during the entire first year. I would also agree that the club isn't done making moves, but I can only hope they are done making any other deals like this. It's also great that the Dodgers tried to sign him. It's also great for them that they didn't. This is false. This deal has happened multiple times before with guys like Pineda and Eovaldi. Happened with the Cubs and Drew Smyly as well. The money here is slightly higher than normal, but Richards is better than either of those guys previous to him. There was a LOT of interest in Richards. It wasn't just LA and San Diego. Pineda was already under contract with the Yankees when injuries forced him to miss the 2012 season. Eovaldi was signed to a $2 mil deal by the Rays in 2017, with a $2 mil option for 2018. He pitched 10 times in a year and a half for the Rays, before he was traded to Boston. Not much return on investment there (but much less than the Padres are paying Richards). The Cubs basically got nothing out of Smyly for a 2-year, $10 million contract. So yeah, it's been done, but at what benefit to the clubs that signed him? It's a bad deal. |
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Post by aztecryan on Dec 2, 2018 18:36:24 GMT -8
Wrong team. 2017, Minnesota Twins with Pineda. He was recovering and still signed, then missed 2018 with a knee issue. It's not a bad deal. It's exactly the type of deal the Padres need.
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Post by aardvark on Dec 2, 2018 20:58:22 GMT -8
Wrong team. 2017, Minnesota Twins with Pineda. He was recovering and still signed, then missed 2018 with a knee issue. It's not a bad deal. It's exactly the type of deal the Padres need. Actually, it was the correct team--just a different injury prevented him from pitching. I was going back about 6 years with Pineda. Didn't know of the Twins contract--thanks for the update. However, it still ISN'T the type of deal the Padres need. The only thing that will make this deal a good one for the Padres is if Richards lights it up for the club in 2020, but it is still a tough sell for the majority of Padres fans, knowing that a guy is signed to a 2-year deal that will give you absolutely nothing in the first year of the deal. |
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Post by ignoranus on Dec 3, 2018 7:40:17 GMT -8
IIRC the Padres started the 2018 season with a starting pitcher payroll of well under $7,000,000.00, total for the five guys. Most of that was devoured by the contract of Clayton Richards, with Ross also getting a million or so. Lamet, Perdomo and Mitchell were not highly compensated. Subsequently adding Lucchesi and Lauer was not expensive.
For the next two years it appears that the Padres will be paying an average of $7.5 million to one guy who will be able to pitch around half of these two upcoming seasons. Quite a change in their philosophy, I'd say.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2018 12:20:49 GMT -8
At his peak in 2014, he was definitely better than average. That isn't a matter of opinion, it's fact. 2014: Games started: 26 ERA: 2.61 Record: 13-4 Strikeouts: 164 WHIP: 1.038 WAR: 4.4He was in the Cy Young conversation until he blew out his knee in late August that year. Why would you say it's doubtful he would ever pitch again? A bit extreme, isnt it? 100 guys return from TJ surgery every year, do they not? Even his 2015 season was better than "average. www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/richaga01.shtml#all_leaderboardThe main problem with the argument for Richards is when he did these "above average" things--2014 and 2015. By the time he pitches again in 2020, at least he will be well rested. Fair enough, but that wasn't Survalli's take. That's a different matter altogether, and one I conceded already as a risk. My point was simply that he was better than average those seasons. It's true. |
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