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Post by The Honey Badger on Mar 30, 2015 12:19:13 GMT -8
Depends what version of the aztecs show up. The team that played St.Johns could of competed with any of the 4 teams left. The team that played Duke....well...they would lose like they did to Duke. We struggled with consistency all year, we need to get that fix if we want to win big next year. The talent is there, the coaching is there. Now it's time to just put it all together on a consistent bases. Our players are not in the same stratosphere as Okafor, Winslow, Kamisnky, Decker, Towns, Cauley Stein, etc. If we ever want to get to the Elite 8 or Final four we have to do much better than the zero star recruits like JJ'Obrien and Aqueel Quinn trying to lead our team. We're getting there with players like Pope, Z and Hemsley but is gonna take time to compete at the level that those teams are at.
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Post by Fishn'Aztec on Mar 30, 2015 12:28:49 GMT -8
I don't see the current line up as capable of competing with any of the SS teams - with maybe the exception of efUCLA. Having watched all 8 games, those teams were on a different level than SDSU. While the Aztecs might have been competitive - at least for a half - with most of those teams, talent would have eventually led the way. This is not to say the Aztecs don't have talent, they just don't have elite talent - yet. I'd go as far as saying they don't face elite talent or competition in the MWC, but neither does Gonzaga in their league. So what's the difference? I think it's elite talent. the 'zags showed they could compete with elite talent and win - because they had their own. But in the last 8, you could see differences - even in a level we call "elite". Will the Aztecs ever get there? Who knows. But it will take much more than the team they have today. It will take at least one truly elite player - and a strong team to support him. And then you still have to hope for the best: good seeding, no bad luck with health or injuries, stuff like that. This year was not a debacle by any means, it was a part of what's hopefully a natural progression. But that progression may take another 10 years to come to fruition. It ain't happening tomorrow - or even next year. In retrospect, I'd say SDSU's best chance was the Kawhi lead team that lost to the U-Cons the eventual NCAA champs. They were in that game all the way and got as close as a Technical Foul and foul trouble for Kawhi. I think it will take more than just a couple of 4* players to carry a team to the Final 4! JMO
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Post by standiego on Mar 30, 2015 12:37:02 GMT -8
Think it is important for the Aztecs coaches to take a thorough look at the very good recruiting classes they have put together . Devise an offense that really uses those talented players on offense . Get out into transition as often as possible , and attack the basket . Get all the guys up front involved in the offense . Starts with a PG that has great court vision and gets his team mates the ball , not just dribble , pass and a lot of movement . Use the guys athleticism not only for defense but also offense . Time to let them get out and run whenever possible. We have a strong bench use them at least 10 deep , Be open to playing a zone especially with SS in the middle . Also agree with the other posters WS could flourish in that system as would others , MP , ZC , SS , DA , AC , KZ , JH , TK, DW Our strength is using the guys in motion . Also as pointed out time to get the 5/C guys involved in the offense on a regular basis - would help the 2015-16 season and even recruiting 5/C going forward .
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Final Four
Mar 30, 2015 12:37:12 GMT -8
via mobile
Post by dtay2004 on Mar 30, 2015 12:37:12 GMT -8
Depends what version of the aztecs show up. The team that played St.Johns could of competed with any of the 4 teams left. The team that played Duke....well...they would lose like they did to Duke. We struggled with consistency all year, we need to get that fix if we want to win big next year. The talent is there, the coaching is there. Now it's time to just put it all together on a consistent bases. Our players are not in the same stratosphere as Okafor, Winslow, Kamisnky, Decker, Towns, Cauley Stein, etc. If we ever want to get to the Elite 8 or Final four we have to do much better than the zero star recruits like JJ'Obrien and Aqueel Quinn trying to lead our team. We're getting there with players like Pope, Z and Hemsley but is gonna take time to compete at the level that those teams are at. Im pretty sure JJ and AQ weren't zero star recruits
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Post by kjw88 on Mar 30, 2015 17:39:45 GMT -8
I am extremely into this years NCAA Tournament. Despite the fact that our beloved Mighty Aztecs were knocked out, there is certainly no disgrace in losing to Duke. The players, teams and coaches in this years Final Four are strong, really strong. Let's look at the teams who LOST and didn't make the Final 4: 1. Louisville - Brilliantly coached by Pitino and played a ferocious first half vs. Michigan State only to have their streak of winning games (95?) when leading by 6 points or more at the half broken in the cruelest of ways. SDSU was not going to beat this version of Louisville. 2. Gonzaga - Really good team with huge size, skill and heart. Also very well coached by Mark Few, although I thought Coach K got the better of him today. Another team I have a hard time seeing SDSU beating this year, Sabonis is a star in the making and Wiltjer is legit. 3. Arizona - Another team with only 3 losses who played an epic Elite 8 rematch vs. Wisconsin. Played a gritty game, but just could not match the incredible playmaking of Dekker and the skill of the Wisconsin team overall. I don't think we are beating Arizona this year either. 4. Notre Dame - My favorite team to watch after SDSU in this years tournament. So hard nosed, so well coached, such good shooters, such a great senior PG....these guys were absolutely balling at the end of this year (beat Duke/UNC in consecutive days to win ACC Tourney) and then outplayed Kentucky and honestly should have won the game. No way is SDSU beating this years Norte Dame team either. Those are the four teams that LOST in their chance to get to the Final Four. Meanwhile, you have Duke (crushed us), Kentucky (undefeated but fortunate vs. Notre Dame), Michigan State (toughest guys and coach in the tourney) and a Wisconsin team that I expect to win it. We have a ways to go to get to the level of these final 8 teams, we need better shooting obviously and clearly. You have to be able to score to win at this level of these final 8 teams. Thoughts? Watching this weekend's games is a wake-up call that it takes time, talent, skills, coaching, and a bit of good fortune / seeding to make it to the E8, let alone the FF. The championship game will likely be on Saturday between Kentucky and Wisconsin. If any team can take down Kentucky, it's the fundamentally-sound Badgers. We're getting closer to bringing in a steady stream of 4-5 star talent. While we're not there with the likes of the blue blood programs in recruitment, we need to bridge the gap by developing players' basic skills--shooting, passing, catching, dribbling, screening, cutting, boxing out, rebounding, and footwork. Experience i.e., SRs, JRs, counts in the tournament and that can level the playing field against 4-5 star freshmen and sophomores. I believe that has been Fish's approach in bringing in experienced transfers, holding off PT and redshirting freshmen. It's part of the transition and continuity strategy to provide more time for the coaches and players to develop and acquire experience in pressure moments. As previously mentioned, exceptional guard play is required to advance beyond the S16. We had DJ Gay and X to help us reach the S16. We had no such ball protector and facilitator on the 2014-15 squad to address the already weak offense and poor shooting issues from the perimeter, midrange, paint, and charity stripe. In the tournament, wasted possessions and careless TOs are magnified. You might be able to get away with a weak pass or poor handles in the MW, but you don't have that margin of error on the road and against elite defenses in March. As well, in the tournament it's about playing the percentages and probabilities. The team has to be adaptable to different styles of play. In one game you might be able to get away with jump shots if the stroke is on that day, however, you can't abandon high-probability shots in the paint or at the FT line. FG attempts is fine, but you also need to convert at a higher rate than from the 3-pt line or something is terribly wrong. Just watch the E8 teams and how they go strong to the rim and feed their big men in the paint during crunch time. Shep and Sky will be seniors next season so it's a make it or break it summer for them to not only improve their skills, but wear the facilitator hat in making their teammates better. If Shep returns, he needs to work on his handles and cut down on the TOs. With JJ and AQ gone, he will have more ball handling responsibilities unless DW / Zabo / Hemsley carry the load. Sky's contribution and focal point in the offensive scheme should improve with better guard playmakers. Shrigs, as a JR with his redshirt, has decent speed and can be utilized as a slasher to the rim. Like Kawhi, who was underutilized in his early years with the Spurs by parking himself at the 3-pt line, Shrigs can be a focal point in the offense with his passing and cutting abilities. If the skills gap and offensive playbook are not resolved over the summer and regular season, we all need to be realistic that it will take several more years before we get over the S16 hump. As Fish said, "San Diego State will eventually sometime - maybe not in my lifetime - but we will have a team that will get to a Final Four, have a chance to win a national championship. Now people don't laugh when you say that, so that's a neat feeling."
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Post by junior on Mar 30, 2015 18:35:52 GMT -8
I don't see the current line up as capable of competing with any of the SS teams - with maybe the exception of efUCLA. Having watched all 8 games, those teams were on a different level than SDSU. While the Aztecs might have been competitive - at least for a half - with most of those teams, talent would have eventually led the way. This is not to say the Aztecs don't have talent, they just don't have elite talent - yet. I'd go as far as saying they don't face elite talent or competition in the MWC, but neither does Gonzaga in their league. So what's the difference? I think it's elite talent. the 'zags showed they could compete with elite talent and win - because they had their own. But in the last 8, you could see differences - even in a level we call "elite". Will the Aztecs ever get there? Who knows. But it will take much more than the team they have today. It will take at least one truly elite player - and a strong team to support him. And then you still have to hope for the best: good seeding, no bad luck with health or injuries, stuff like that. This year was not a debacle by any means, it was a part of what's hopefully a natural progression. But that progression may take another 10 years to come to fruition. It ain't happening tomorrow - or even next year. Even though we lacked at the guard position, consider how we would have done had we been a good shooting team. If anything, that's what killed us. We had open shots galore in every game, but we know the results. Had our shooting continued as it was in Maui, there's no telling how far we could have gone. I still don't know how to evaluate the Maui tournament. It was still very early in the season, yes, but they were playing teams with plenty of experience (Pitt, BYU, Arizona) and the Aztecs still came out on top in two out of three - and just missed the trifecta by 3 points. But after that, we all know what happened. Simply put, I'd say that the data suggests that those 3 games were the anomaly, and that what we saw from December through March was the real thing. Still, that team was good enough to compete in the MWC. So I'm right back at not knowing how to evaluate that tournament.
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Post by DeeMoney on Mar 30, 2015 19:50:25 GMT -8
There is no rule that say you have to first win a couple sweet 16 games before you can advance to the final four; moreover you don't need a bunch of 5 stars- they just make it a lot easier. There have been two 11 seeds to make the final four in the past decade, and if you look at what they had done during the season they were pretty much seeded where they earned to be.
Would having a bunch of 5 star guys make it easier, obviously. But mid level teams get hot all the time; its asinine to make a judgement of a whole season/program based on such a small sample size
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Post by aztecfanatic on Apr 1, 2015 5:43:04 GMT -8
I don't see the current line up as capable of competing with any of the SS teams - with maybe the exception of efUCLA. Having watched all 8 games, those teams were on a different level than SDSU. While the Aztecs might have been competitive - at least for a half - with most of those teams, talent would have eventually led the way. This is not to say the Aztecs don't have talent, they just don't have elite talent - yet. I'd go as far as saying they don't face elite talent or competition in the MWC, but neither does Gonzaga in their league. So what's the difference? I think it's elite talent. the 'zags showed they could compete with elite talent and win - because they had their own. But in the last 8, you could see differences - even in a level we call "elite". Will the Aztecs ever get there? Who knows. But it will take much more than the team they have today. It will take at least one truly elite player - and a strong team to support him. And then you still have to hope for the best: good seeding, no bad luck with health or injuries, stuff like that. This year was not a debacle by any means, it was a part of what's hopefully a natural progression. But that progression may take another 10 years to come to fruition. It ain't happening tomorrow - or even next year. Well put Junior; many posters seem to lose sight of how difficult it really is to reach anywhere near an 'elite' level. We are solid but have a long way to go. We lost to a team that had 9 mcd all-americans; no shame there but we are still improving our recruiting bit by bit. It would sure help if Arizona would stop wanting all of the same players as us, (Gogzaga also). But we are closer now to having a VERY good team year in and year out than we have ever been and that sure is fun.
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Post by standiego on Apr 1, 2015 11:37:20 GMT -8
We have improved dramatically the last 10 years . We can now rely on good recruiting of quality HS recruits rather then on transfers . If all the guys return this summer of the 12 scholarship players ,only AC would be a transfer . But as Gonzaga has shown it takes a while to get to the E8 and even better recruiting . Zags have been improving for about 15 years . They get decent recruits but not top 25 or top 50 . Still need guys from Europe or transfers . Would say we have moved up from a good MBB school to a "program " on the way up . Still need to get into the top 20 of recruits . Also need to realize that Defense alone can not do it , coaches need to do a better job on offense , using the great athletic guys they recruit .
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Post by jpaztec on Apr 1, 2015 12:18:36 GMT -8
It comes down to this in my opinion: A FF quality team needs either a bunch of really, really talented young blue chippers with a damn good coach, or a team with a lot of solid, gritty upperclassmen with MM experience...with a damn good coach. The '10-'11 team was the latter, with a stud sophomore in the mix. It can't be understated that the senior trio of DJ Gay, Malcolm, and Billy White brought a headiness, and toughness that many freshman can't duplicate. You throw in an all-American underclassman, and a solid role player at that point in Chase Tapley, and you have the recipe of a team that could have just as easily made the Final Four, than bow out in the Sweet Sixteen.
The fact that Malik didn't really ever get in the team rhythm due to a very late start this year cost us the impact player that we would have needed to get to/over the SS hump. Had he had the summer and fall at full health to practice and learn our system, for one, we don't land up with an 8 seed and have to play a Duke in the second round, but maybe we're in the 4-6 range and have do ourselves a solid with a favorable draw. Lets keep in mind who we played last year to get there, we beat New Mexico State and North Dakota State, that's about as easy a path as you can ever ask for, anything past that and you run into the blue bloods in which elite talent AND coaching take over. I firmly believe that we've got top 15 talent in the next couple years, it's up to the staff to find a way to mesh and utilize it in a way that makes us multi-dimensional. Bricking shots and crashing the O boards hard might make us a top 25 team, but there is a ceiling unless we can put more points on the board. Not exactly front page news, though.
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Post by aztecgold on Apr 1, 2015 12:20:49 GMT -8
Kentucky's 2nd team could beat most teams in the NCAA. They are very talented. SDSU needs better guards and I think that was one of the reasons they were inconsistent and why they did poorly against teams with good guards like Duke and Boise State.
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Post by sdcoug on Apr 1, 2015 12:41:50 GMT -8
Kentucky's 2nd team could beat most teams in the NCAA. They are very talented. SDSU needs better guards and I think that was one of the reasons they were inconsistent and why they did poorly against teams with good guards like Duke and Boise State. Kentucky's rare, no doubt. I actually think our younger guards are very talented, but they were also very young. Our "lead" guard also happened to be our least athletic, while our more athletic guards were our least experienced. Not a great combo. We add Hemsley, who is VERY athletic & talented, but will be young, while our FR guards will become SO's. That's the BEST thing about FR! We still won't have a ton of experience at the guard position, but we'll be much improved IMO.
Polee was athletic but lacked consistency this year (for many reasons), and Shrigs is still only in his second year & isn't an elite talent you'd expect to shine early in his career. But I know I'm comfortable with the direction he's heading - he'll be improved next year & take on a larger role.
PS. I wouldn't put either Pope or WS in the "guard" category personally - more wing/4 than anything.
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Post by standiego on Apr 1, 2015 12:53:00 GMT -8
Can we take a realistic look at our team this year . We won a first round game over an average St John's team that lost their center , so no height. We needed better guards , forwards and center . JJ was our "best player " but got bottled up by quality athletic players . yes if we get a 6 or 7 seed( lost at home to BSU and then Slow Pokes) we may get to SW16 but not much further . Yes Pope was not able to do his thing due to injury and Fisher did not really like his defense . Would guess MP comes back . We could have been fortunate , MP went to visit Kansas with fellow recruit Kelly Oubre , Oubre today declared for the NBA . So who knows if we would have landed MP if he was healthy . Hopefully MP comes back and we can use an up tempo offense that lets MP and others start to use their athleticism . If we have MP, WS, ZC,DA really attacking the basket we could be a good team but also note Kentucky , Duke , Arizona ...are going to be really recruiting well again ( watch their guys in the Mickey D All Star Game ). As noted Kentucky reserves could beat most teams .
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Post by AzTex on Apr 1, 2015 13:18:24 GMT -8
I don't see the current line up as capable of competing with any of the SS teams - with maybe the exception of efUCLA. Having watched all 8 games, those teams were on a different level than SDSU. While the Aztecs might have been competitive - at least for a half - with most of those teams, talent would have eventually led the way. This is not to say the Aztecs don't have talent, they just don't have elite talent - yet. I'd go as far as saying they don't face elite talent or competition in the MWC, but neither does Gonzaga in their league. So what's the difference? I think it's elite talent. the 'zags showed they could compete with elite talent and win - because they had their own. But in the last 8, you could see differences - even in a level we call "elite". Will the Aztecs ever get there? Who knows. But it will take much more than the team they have today. It will take at least one truly elite player - and a strong team to support him. And then you still have to hope for the best: good seeding, no bad luck with health or injuries, stuff like that. This year was not a debacle by any means, it was a part of what's hopefully a natural progression. But that progression may take another 10 years to come to fruition. It ain't happening tomorrow - or even next year. Well put Junior; many posters seem to lose sight of how difficult it really is to reach anywhere near an 'elite' level. We are solid but have a long way to go. We lost to a team that had 9 mcd all-americans; no shame there but we are still improving our recruiting bit by bit. It would sure help if Arizona would stop wanting all of the same players as us, (Gogzaga also). But we are closer now to having a VERY good team year in and year out than we have ever been and that sure is fun. Sean Miller of Arizona went to the Elite 8 four times in an 8 year span without getting to the Final Four. Current Kansas coach Bill Self took his Tulsa, Illinois and Kansas teams to the Elite Eight four times in eight years without getting to the Final Four. The Sweet 16 is difficult enough. Any thing beyond that becomes incredibly tough.
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Post by smoothcat on Apr 1, 2015 21:55:20 GMT -8
To: SmoothCat From: Robthevol I don't post often but feel it now necessary. Your post was well thought out and well written. One of the better entries I've seen on this board in a long time. Thanks my friend, I appreciate the kind words. It would be so sweet if our Aztecs could eventually break through and make a Final Four, that would be so exciting. I think they could do it, but as others have said, a lot of things would have to break right. Our team that lost to UConn (in a game with terribly one-sided officiating) could have potentially won a National Championship that season but things didn't break quite right. That was definitely an Elite 8 or better type team.
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Post by Luchador El Guerrero Azteca on Apr 3, 2015 15:56:49 GMT -8
Shrigley is more that a 3 point shooter. He has good athleticism, defends well and can drive. I hope Fish uses him in a more versatile role next year. I think he is just finding his role and Fish recognizes it. His defensive improvement has been notable.
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Post by bearfoot on Apr 3, 2015 17:22:11 GMT -8
I think we could take Louisville. They honestly kind of remind me of SDSU's team last year. The biggest problem the Cards had was when coach finally kicked the starting PG off the team. Imagine how good they would have been with that guy. As for our Aztecs, baby steps. First get into the E-8. As good as Arizona has been, they still can't crack the F-4.
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Post by bearfoot on Apr 3, 2015 17:23:55 GMT -8
Think it is important for the Aztecs coaches to take a thorough look at the very good recruiting classes they have put together . Devise an offense that really uses those talented players on offense . Get out into transition as often as possible , and attack the basket . Get all the guys up front involved in the offense . Starts with a PG that has great court vision and gets his team mates the ball , not just dribble , pass and a lot of movement . Use the guys athleticism not only for defense but also offense . Time to let them get out and run whenever possible. We have a strong bench use them at least 10 deep , Be open to playing a zone especially with SS in the middle . Also agree with the other posters WS could flourish in that system as would others , MP , ZC , SS , DA , AC , KZ , JH , TK, DW Our strength is using the guys in motion . Also as pointed out time to get the 5/C guys involved in the offense on a regular basis - would help the 2015-16 season and even recruiting 5/C going forward . "Z" has already said it. Our staff intends on a much more attacking O next season. If it comes as a slight loss to the D, oh well.
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Post by aztecfury on Apr 3, 2015 17:51:34 GMT -8
I think we could take Louisville. They honestly kind of remind me of SDSU's team last year. The biggest problem the Cards had was when coach finally kicked the starting PG off the team. Imagine how good they would have been with that guy. As for our Aztecs, baby steps. First get into the E-8. As good as Arizona has been, they still can't crack the F-4. Arizona has won the tourney before. Sean Miller has never been to the Final Four though.
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Post by onelittleindian on Apr 3, 2015 18:50:19 GMT -8
Individual talent and the best roster you can recruit are hands-down thee most important factors in winning championships ... Just ask UNLV and the Dodgers.
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